Criminal Minds: Thomas Gibson, Aaron Hotchner on Criminal Minds, has signed a new contract!! Criminal Minds has their entire cast back together! A great day for fans!!
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- CRIMINAL MINDS: ERICA MESSER CHAT TRANSCRIPT
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1,273 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 400 of 1273 Newer› Newest»Nevermind! Lol ignore my previous post.
I'd also like 2 add I'm ready 2 c the new intro/ cast picture. And also see more of prentisses quirkiness and humor as well as her more emotional and meaningful quotes she's said throughout the past few seasons.
I also hope JJ keeps long hair bc she looks great w/ it, not 2 say she's not beautiful anyways. And that prentiss goes back to the look (mildly, more modernly) that she did 8 in her spy days.
The spoilers for the seventh season are interesting.
I think it’s a safe bet to say that Morgan will react strongly once he discovers the truth about Prentiss.
Will he keep the secret from Rossi, Reid and Garcia ?
Honestly, I really don’t want the Prentiss/Doyle storyline to be dragged on.
I want it to be over quickly, just let Prentiss kill Doyle so that she can come back and it’ll be perfect in my opinion.
As for the rest of season seven, I hope to see good team interaction too and good cases.
I want to see Hotch and Reid bonding more, I love their interactions and their scenes together. I hope we’ll see more of that.
As for Reid I want to see him being the genius we know and love.
I hope the writers will give him good screen time and will give him a storyline based on his intellectual skills.
In my opinion he brings so much to the team, I would love the writers to focus on his genius, on his worth to the team and on his relationship with his teammates (mainly with Hotch and Rossi).
I want the nerdy genius back!
I'm ecstatic on the signing of TG ... best news this week and season 7 can't come soon enough for me now with our entire CM family back on board, I have every confidence in Erica to take this forward and put this outstanding show back on the map after the dramas of season six, which I for one have written off as a bad dream.
Yes there will be a lot of pieces to pick up and Hotch & JJ will have some right royal fences to mend with the team but as a team & BAU family they have gone through a lot and with Erica’s experience on the show I’m confident that this will be handled well and add to the story lines.
There is a lot I personally would like to see in Season 7, and everyone out there depending on their favourites would like to see so much I’m sure, but for the moment I’m just pleased as punch that we finally have our amazing cast back and intact, and the show can go on and put behind it all the behind the scenes dramas of season 6.
My CM obsession lives to see another season fuelled by the re-signing of our Unit Chief … :)
I'm with you, Teresa H: Pls, Anonymouses: name yourselves so that we can talk to you! If you come to participate (not just to rant)that is and would like a response. It is extremely difficult when there are so many posts (sometimes almost impossible to keep up, scrolling and trying to answer someone who remains nameless.
When you finish your post, scroll down to Choose an Identity, go to Name/URL and name yourself SOMETHING in the highlighted box. We don't care if you are Joe Blow or Nosy Nora! Do this just before hitting Publish.
If you still want to maintain an Anonymous header, at least give yourself a little nickname like Silvain (sp?) does here: she adds "syd" at the end of her post.
Or at least Anonymous ABC or 123 or whatever.
Most people come to this blog to talk and share and we want to talk to you - we welcome newbies if they are true CM Fanatics (you need to really love CM and not just come to complain as they do on other blogs.)
I'm saying, we like to think of ourselves as mannerly and kind people (like our CM team - we have high standards!)
So, pls, introduce yourselves and talk to us and we will be happy to include you! Right, Fanatics?
Shemar deserved a pay raise, and it was looooooooooong overdue, IMO. He was making around 50k an episode, compared to Gibson's 100k and Mantegna's 125k, and Shemar was the one who did the majority of the physical labor, not to mention he's been in the biz for around 2 decades now, working for CBS for most of that time.
In my view, he's worth just as much if not more than Gibson. I find both actors right around the same caliber, but I like Shemar's Morgan character 15x more than I like the Hotch character. I don't feel Gibson should still be making more than Shemar in particular, and I feel the rest of the cast deserved a raise too. I shudder to think what Cook, Vangsness, and Gub were/are making. It's not right, no matter which way you spin it.
The Hotch character really does nothing for me, and in the first few seasons, I always saw Gideon as the leader.
I disagree that Morgan was a bad Unit Chief in Season 5. I could have gotten used to that very quickly, and I hated to see him step down back into subordination under Hotch. It had been a breath of fresh air, and Shemar looked like THE boss in a suit. LOL.
I don't see anything special about Hotch to suggest he is the only one on the team suitable to be Unit Chief.
Morgan or Rossi could handle the role just as good, if not better.
Rossi's the veteran, so he's a natural choice, but I really prefer Morgan. It's just so refreshing to hear him giving everyone their missions and I was bummed we keep getting little to no office scenes with him. They gave him an office, and now it's like we only get to see it once in a blue moon, while we're always in Hotch's office. I get tired of seeing Hotch's office. I wanna see Morgan's! lol.
I wanna see how much he's decorated it since having it for almost a year now. Does he finally have his name on the door? Does he have pictures of his family on his desk? What about pictures of his team? Little things like that we keep getting the shaft on.
Anywho, even though I'm an obvious Morgan fan (moreso than a Shemar fan), I really do love the rest of the team for their own little quirks. I am just apathetic to Hotch to be honest.
However, I am glad he finally got signed, so this internet garbage can finally be taken out, and we can get on with our show. It was disrespectful, as I said to the cast and to the show itself for those reports to talk like Gibson IS the show, when he clearly is not, despite what his fans think.
Every cast member has fans, and I'm sure they think their respective favorite is "the show," but they really aren't. This crap got blown way out of proportion.
Anonymous,
I love it that you love Shemar/Morgan and I smiled when you wondered about his office and what he might have done to it. I like him, he's not my favourite, but I think Shemar does a good job portraying Morgan. I'm delighted he got a raise.
I get it that you found all our yearnings for TG/Hotch over the top but you don't have to call it "crap".
It was just us loving our guy as much as you love yours.
And please could you give yourself a nickname. That is, if you want to be responded to and not get lost in the shuffle if there are too many "Anonymous" posters around you.
There. I have a nickname now. lol.
Wait...I wasn't talking about internet fan bustle. I was referring to internet news bustle.
I could care less what the internet fans think, because there are double or triple the fans in the real world who have their own thoughts that don't get on message boards and such, and God only knows what they think, so online fan opinion isn't something I really care about too much, unless we're in the same circle somewhat.
While I respect the right for everyone to have their opinion, and I would defend that right to the death, there's only one opinion that matters to ME, and that's mine, so, no, I wasn't referring to the Hotch fans's bustle as crap. I was talking about the blog news posts all over the web, that were acting like Gibson is Criminal Minds, and that it would fall apart without him, and only him. That's a slap in the face to the rest of the cast in my humble opinion.
Stuff like that is why I don't watch NCIS and shows like that. I don't want a Mark Harmon or someone being the "chosen one," leaving me forced to try and see them as the main star that I'm supposed to go gaga over. Not happenin. I hate being told what to like, and having to be force fed it, while what I actually like is being shoved in a corner somewhere away from me.
Morgan's my favorite, and I love this team as a unit, not just because Morgan's on it. Morgan hasn't always been my favorite character, and I didn't start watching this show because Shemar Moore was on it. I started watching for the profiling and the serial killers. Season 1 Morgan actually annoyed me a bit, but after Season 2, with the awesome scenes he had in episodes like "Empty Planet," and "Profiler, Profiled," I kinda connected and he's been my favorite ever since. He's THE hero, in my book. Seasons 5 and 6 have to be my all time favorite seasons.
Hotch is just bleh. There were actually a few scenes that I wanted to hit him myself. Like in "Lo-Fi," and "Profiler, Profiled." Oh, and the end of "Mayhem," he really rubbed me the wrong way too.
I love everybody else though, and I'd give anything to see Gideon and Rossi on the same team together. LOL!
I know that everyone has his/her favourites, but there is no need to belittle other people's opinion/likes. Although there are far more important things in the world to worry about, our love for fictional characters (or celebrities) IS personal and political as much as we'd like to deny that. Just as we do not like people insulting us or our families and friends, dissing the people and things we care about do translate into personal attacks because somewhere deep down we identify with the characters we're drawn to - there is something of us in them and something of them in us. Something fundamental in us is at the heart of our love for Morgan or for Reid or for Hotch (or for Foyet if that floats your boat). And maybe we should ignore the hate and move on, but it's difficult because it FEELS like a personal attack. So saying 'he is crap', for example, and just tagging an 'imo' to it, doesn't make it any less personal or any less political. We may not love all the characters/actors equally but we should desist from lambasting others for liking who they do, and, ultimately, who they are.
Hope the team doesn't break up, though, at least not for long. A temporary fissure is ok, and perhaps realistic.
As for salary disparity - please, they are all at different stages of their careers. I'm ok with my 50yo boss earning more than i do.
Gah, I do NOT want Hotch killing Doyle.
If Morgan doesn't do it, then at least have Emily do it, but I prefer Morgan.
Morgan was the angry one, and I want to see that rage unleashed onto the guy who not only shot at him in "Valhalla," but at the guy who escaped shortly before Morgan found her, and she practically "died," right in front of him.
That's one thing I can give the writers. That scene with Morgan finding Prentiss was the best scene off the entire episode, and I wish to God it could have been longer.
To the Anonymous repliers:
Everybody, including Joe recognizes the ensemble aspect of CM is more PR spin than reality. These actors negotiate individually for their salary and other benefits; and they have since the series began. The myth about the ensemble is basically to establish a sense of camaraderie and parity; but there was never equity in pay, which would have established a genuine ensemble.
The cast of the Big Bang Theory is a true ensemble because they all receive equal pay. So did the cast of Friends. But the CM cast has always had a hierarchy, and Thomas has always been one of the leads.
It’s neither distasteful nor disrespectful to the rest of the cast because they understand the Hollywood system, which is no different from most other TV series or from jobs in any other industry, I might add. All organizational structures have a pecking order; some of them have people who are at the same level who earn similar pay. But all have the ability to determine going into the situation the position and salary they are seeking.
I’m so happy Thomas got such a fantastic contract; now he’s making close to what the CSI leads make according to the mid to high seven figures number quoted. He deserves every penny. I wouldn’t have watched CM without him; and no way could Shemar Moore fill his shoes; and obviously the executives of CBS and ABC recognized that.
I'm not sure CBS/ABC will compensate Joe in the same manner, because Thomas is the lead on the show and clearly Joe is not; but that's for Joe to negotiate. I'm sure you won't have as many fans threatening to abandon the show if Joe's not there, so CBS/ABC will not face the same pressure to ensure that he stays. Gibson would have been a bigger loss ratings and continuity-wise.
sf, you are correct, CM has really done a poor job with continuity and closure. They have established many interesting storylines and subtle devices that would have been compelling if the writers had followed through.
One of my major complaints about the Prentiss arc was the total ignorance of Hotch and Rossi to Prentiss' unusual behavior--and they are the senior profilers.
I think it has little to do with the writers lack of knowledge of the character; but was a conscious decision to render Hotch and Rossi irrelevant, in particular Hotch.
That's one reason I'm happy CBS/ABC gave TG such a fantastic contract. It establishes who is important to them; now maybe the writers will pay attention and give Hotch more meaningful participation.
@ Elevenses
There's a difference between belittling someone's opinion and stating yours.
If I was belittling anyone's opinion, I would have stated it like they were wrong, and I was right. That little "imo" tag signifies that just as you or someone else has stated their opinion, this is mine, and I do respect yours, but disagree.
Disagreeing is belittling someone's opinion?
Saying I loathe Hotch is belittling someone's opinion?
Someone saying they loathe Morgan would be belittling my opinion?
I mean, what if I was a Seaver fan. Just think how much my opinion has been belittled in the past.
I play the role of the devil's advocate. I like to argue because I like to hear people's viewpoints to see if either I can learn from them, or combat them in a mature but passionate manner.
Like I said, the only opinion that matters the most to ME, is my own. That doesn't mean I don't learn something from another perspective, but I don't hold it in a higher regard than my own, because it's my own that counts in regards to me as a person. I'm on my own terms. Not trying to sound narcissistic, but I'm just saying that so nobody feels I get all butthurt and am trying to lambaste and attack people because they "hurt my feelings."
Yes, yes, yes, this is a fictional show, and these are fictional characters. Hell, if I dislike what's going on, I go off and write my own interpretation of things. Did I also mention I was a writer?
I'm just the devil's advocate.
Nothing is meant to be personal, or show animosity.
I just have a strong viewpoint, and am looking to see who will counter, and how they will counter, to see how interesting of a debate we can have.
Everybody can't like the same thing. Come on now. How boring would that be? LOL.
Yes it is belittling and it is my opinion. If it doesn't affect you when people say Shemar/Morgan is loathsome, then good for you!
SDWally, i don't consisder Thomas the lead actor. I think the frenzy would be enormous no matter which of these actors' contracts are up for negotiation. I love all of them, not equally perhaps, but i do understand how taking one of them out of the equation adversely affects the writing.
As for closure, yes, Minds has been lax with that. Hope they get the writers to correct that.
"But the CM cast has always had a hierarchy, and Thomas has always been one of the leads."
And I personally find that distasteful and disrespectful. Sorry. There's nothing about Gibson or Hotch to me that says, "This guy is the head guy or the lead star of the show." Nothing. I'm sure the average fan doesn't even pay attention to them trying to do that either, because for the most part, what gives this show its eccentricity is the profiling and serial killers. That's what the majority watch for, not Hotch or Gibson. He is needed just as much as the rest are, and it's disrespectful to suggest that of all the cast, he is the least expendable. They're all quite honestly expendable.
"It’s neither distasteful nor disrespectful to the rest of the cast because they understand the Hollywood system, which is no different from most other TV series or from jobs in any other industry, I might add."
Here say.
You might not find it disrespectful or distasteful, and they might not (who knows, they just might.) but I do.
That's basically saying that Thomas Gibson is capable of carrying the show himself, and that the rest of the cast are just catalysts, sort of just there to support him as he carries the show... that every Criminal Minds fan tunes in just to see him. I doubt even the overall majority tunes in just to see him. They tune into the show to see the show, and the pay raise that towers over everyone else on the cast, I'm sorry, I have a problem with that.
I had a problem with Forrest Whitaker's salary as well. It was absolutely ridiculous for him being on a second rate spin-off that was nowhere NEAR as good as the original.
"He deserves every penny. I wouldn’t have watched CM without him; and no way could Shemar Moore fill his shoes; and obviously the executives of CBS and ABC recognized that."
I wholeheartedly disagree with that entire statement, including the execs recognizing that. Nobody knows what truly has held this off for so long, and for Shemar's salary to be doubled at all, shows he is worth something. He could easily fill Gibson's shoes, IMO.
"Gibson would have been a bigger loss ratings and continuity-wise."
I also disagree with this. The internet fandom is the voice that screams the shrillest, but it isn't the voice that would pack the most punch. Let's be realistic. It's unknown whether Gibson's departure would effect the ratings as much as his fans say it would. They're gonna say that, they're his fans. The only way to know for sure is to let it happen. People are too quick to make assumptions.
"I think it has little to do with the writers lack of knowledge of the character; but was a conscious decision to render Hotch and Rossi irrelevant, in particular Hotch."
Sometimes it's necessary to make up for all the times they rendered the other characters "irrelevant." They cannot just center the show on Hotch. It's not going to be entertaining television if they center it on just one character.
@ Elevenses
No, it is not belittling, and it's not on me for you to feel that way. It's on you for having sensitive feelings.
You cannot try and make this personal by making me look like the bad guy for doing the exact same thing everyone else is doing, stating my opinion.
If I haven't called someone names or made personal attacks, how is that belittling?
I haven't called Gibson or Hotch names. What, I'm not allowed to dislike them? That means I don't have a right to my opinion?
What logic is that?
It is belittling to my 'senstive feelings' and, no, everyone is not saying what you've said this past day and certainly not in the way you've said it.
I'm so happy that we have Thomas back. He's finally gotten some recognition that has been well-deserved. I love the subtlety of his character and now that Paget is back too, I'm getting excited for next season. Cannot wait to make this one a distant memory. More Hotch, more Prentiss, more Rossi, please!
belittling to your sensitive feelings is in no way, shape, or form on me.
It's on you to feel how you feel.
I have the right to dislike a character. People have had the right to dislike Seaver, Rossi, and Morgan in the past. I should be entitled to dislike Hotch.
It's belittling to me that you're attempting to make me seem like the antagonist here, simply for stating my opinion when I've insulted no-one.
I dislike a fictional character, and have some disagreements with an actor's pay raise, so what? I'm entitled to it.
Nickname: yes you are entitled to your opinion but I agree w/ elevenses, your posts do seem a somewhat belittling. Try to think of it like this ... Your employer hires someone to do the same job as you. This person has been at it far less time and you have much more exp. and knowledge but you are both paid the same. Now does that seem fair to you?
On that note goodnight all....
Excuse the typos please..... I'm exhausted :)
Yes, Rachel, Rossi has been woefully underutilised, as have all the others this past season. Just giving them screen time is not going to do it - that's the diff between 'revelations' and 'corazon' or 'profiler/profiled' and '25 to life' i think. Both sets character centric but what a difference. It's a lack of sensitive writing. I hope they get to focus on this crucial aspect of the show. Without strong, thoughtful writing, the characterisation can only go downhill. And it's very hard to write murder mysteries - there are just too many bad ones as evidence. I read four Henning Mankell Wallander myseteries in a row a coupla months ago and although the writing is brilliant the endings leave you with a sense of incompleteness. And this from an established writer. I can only imagine how hard it is to accomplish on a 42min TV show as opposed to, say, 400 pages. Good luck to the writers, and to us, for a solid S7!
"Nickname: yes you are entitled to your opinion but I agree w/ elevenses, your posts do seem a somewhat belittling."
It's all in how one chooses to feel. I could make a positive post, and someone could still find it belittling. So, I'm the bad guy because they chose to find my words belittling, when I didn't go out to insult or attack them?
"Try to think of it like this ... Your employer hires someone to do the same job as you. This person has been at it far less time and you have much more exp. and knowledge but you are both paid the same. Now does that seem fair to you?"
Shemar, Gubler, and Kirsten have been on the job less than Gibson and don't have as much experience as him? O___O
This is news to me.
I could have sworn they have all been there since Season 1.
Hey, Valendra, good night and sleep well so we can get back to our good old-fashioned ribbing of each other and our opinions the way we are used to and love, and how, to be honest, we all survived the past few months. I'm sure we'd do the same for all our wonderful seven giants. What's up with our lavender lads these days, and can we please get Shemar on twitter? Was funny when tg called him from MC aboout the love letters. And love how Paget sends all these weird messages pretending to be him. Would like the Real Mr Moore to sta...erm ... follow.
Have a good night everyone...
TGfTG Teresa H....and where are you Gubegirl? I think we could do with some EC/apple pie right now. Sinful :-D
Sorry, Eleven, been at yoga and just dragged my sorry arse in. Listen to me: Been listening to Blimey so long, I've begun to talk like her during periods of fatigue...I will be overniting a special EC ASAP for some much needed relief:) ITMW, grab the Patrone, GF.
Velandra, thanks for standing up for Eleven.
Nickname: Thanks for giving yourself a name. I appreciate your viewpoint that is different than many here but you seem to be a newcomer here in that you are surprised at the emotion some here hold. You do not seem to be as endeared to this cast/show as many of us: as I said before we are FANATICS.
If you are looking for a debate, it's abit late here, even in San Diego where I am, and most are further east than myself, so I suggest we take a rest and talk again tomorrow?
Try to put yourself in our shoes and imagine how "addicts" feel: we are habitual watchers/bloggers/Hotch?morgan?reid luv'rs here; please don't try to spoil that for us. As a writer, I am sure you need to see other people's points of view? Try to see ours.
I'm headed for my Baileys and popcorn. The Voice finale isn't on as I thought and I just had to watch Prentiss lay a wet one on that nasty, skeezy Doyle. My skin crawls at the very sight of him. He has grubby fingernails even. Gross. I so hope she gets to waste that b-----d. Morgan would be my second choice.
G'nite all.
Gubegirl, hello, you fit, awesome lady and thank you for saying what i wanted to say but only more clearly! Have i not thanked you, Valendra? Shame on me! Thank you! I usually am able to ignore certain comments but dunno why i couldn't do it this time (i hardly ever spoke of Seaver!) - maybe i couldn't ignore it because it started as a tg thread?
Bailey's is good, too! one of my friends suggested topping it with chilled milk. Lasts longer and seems more innocent. heh. the things we do to delude ourselves. ;0)
Right, i need to go dream of Hotch now, scars and all. But maybe Doyle will visit me instead. Yes, I have cr^& luck with dreams.
I don't feel the need to explain how fanatical I am, because I know it's just a TV Show.
When you get on, please explain to me how you've gotten from my posts that I'm not endeared to the CAST as everyone else here?
I take it you mean I'm not as endeared to HOTCH, as everyone else here, right?
How many more times do I have to copy and paste the statement, "I love this team because of the team?"
I've watched Reid go from a kid who had trouble firing a gun and coping with it, to someone who realized, he didn't need to shoot someone to take them down. Not with that huge brain he has that can stop them dead in their tracks as he aids the team in tracking them down. As Gideon told him, their profiling is better than any firearm they could carry.
I've seen Garcia go from a girl who would scream the minute a bloody corpse popped up on her screen, to someone who has become essentially immunned to it, who has gotten alot more serious about her job, and who has gotten alot quicker and more dangerous on her keyboard.
I've seen Prentiss go from the casually funny badass chick, who was endeared to her team, to a marked woman who felt she had to hide everything from them as if she felt they really couldn't help her in a way that she needed it.
JJ's gone from a witty young girl, to a mother and not only a savy liason, but quite a force to be reckoned with on the field as well.
David Rossi started out as the mystery vet, the founder with a notorious dating record, who everyone kind of skirted around, intimidated and intrigued as to how his addition to the team would play out, and how he would get along with them. Now, he's like a dad, to everyone on the team, Morgan in particular, who always has a way with words to talk one of his team mates out of or into doing something, or he tries to help them understand something they're not seeing clearly, and come to grips with it. I was shocked to see how Rossi evolved, because I did not like him in the beginning, and thought he'd be a jerk.
And last but not least, Derek Morgan. The hunky pretty boy who had his female colleagues (not team mates) falling all over him, and Penelope Garcia gushing. He went from the big brother, witty, sarcastic and funny young kid, to a dark, menacing, brooding, serious natured agent who still cracks a joke every now and then, but nowhere near as much as he used to. He showed in "The Longest Night," he can be just as ruthless and heartless as any unsub that crosses his path, and then at the end of that episode, showed than when his heart came back, it beat harder than ever and magnified in size. In "Safe Haven," he showed that no matter the age, you mess with an innocent victim, he won't hesitate to put a bullet right through your skull. From "The Eyes Have It" to "The Slave of Duty," he showed that he wasn't just the muscle of the group. He put that New York field office request on a trial run with his own team, and showed he not only met the qualifications to be a leader, but he exceeded them, Hotch's expectations as well as Strauss's and the bureau's. In "Profiler, Profiled," he showed that no matter how things look on the outside, we all have pain we hold on the inside, and the least expected people have gone through the least expected horrific situations.
If I wasn't a true fan of the show, I wouldn't be writing fanfic, or studying up on those characters. My writing is very objective as I try not to let my feelings about one character shine through in the writing. That's not how a writer is supposed to operate.
A writer is supposed to let the character overtake them, and as a writer, I see Morgan as the one who has the fuel to many of the storylines I conjure up, while maintaining the important of everyone else.
There have been so many assumptions and so much that has been misinterpreted, not to mention those reading too much into someone's opinion and taking it to heart as a personal attack.
That is not my aim, and it's "belittling" to suggest so.
Well Gibson is back there is some good in that. But i hope the fans that drove RN away has a bad taste in their mouths. They probably contribute to her being fired in such an awful way.
@Anonymous (Shemar Fan)
I watch the show for Reid but I don't think he makes the show. No one character does. I never liked Morgan as Unit Chief. I didn't think it allowed him to be himself. When he spoke he never used contractions. I didn't know that becoming Unit Chief meant he had to say I will instead of I'll. He just sounded strange.
I was thinking about all your remarks about Morgan's office. He's not the Unit Chief anymore but he's still allowed to have an office. I feel for Reid. He's the only poor soul left in the bullpen.
Gubegirl, I agree totally, would the anonymous posters please name themselves something.
YEAH!!!! YEAH!!! I really was not going to watch my favorite show if TG did not get his contract renewal as he is essential as the "Dad" to the CM family I love.
He is the essence of the show and, for once, a network listened to its fan base. Now with TG, AJ, and PB back, bring it on for Season 7 after a disjointed Season 6!!! Can't wait for the fallout of Emily's arc.
So happy I have my team back!!
@ nickname:
Although your a bit new on this blog
I gotta say nice posts about the team growing, although I'd like 2 respectfully disagree about your a bit of your prentiss paragraph.
In my opinion, she went from a badass, brilliant linguist who had expierence in foreign affairs, who went from a woman not being sure if she fit in with them and campaigned graciously to become a part of the team she was ment to be on. To a woman who loved and respected her friends/ family so much she disappeared and went off the grid to protect them from Doyle and his goons and went and took him head on to put her past behind her and leave her team out of her demons from herpast as a spy for their protection.
PS: can we all get along? Lol as some of these posters pointed out we're all her 2 discuss our favorite show bc we all have that in common. In my opinion y'all( yes I'm a Texan, we talk like this down south lol) are all awesome and have great opinions so let's just take the mini disagreement as water under the bridge.
PSS: I agree gubegirl, please stop the madness anonymous's there are waaaaay 2 many of y'all. Lol
Heh.
I take it as a given that Gibson and Mantegna, as well as Patinkin before him, are and have always been paid more because they have the longer and more distinguished resumes, and they play the foundational characters of the series. As originally conceived, Gideon was the dominant character, with Hotch second to him as his main foil and the unit chief. There's a wonderful bit of meta in "Extreme Aggressor", where the not-quite-Strauss says to Hotch, "We need to know that you can step in if he can't perform." Well, we all know that Patinkin bailed in the second season. That is when Hotch blossomed as the intense, driven, true-believer linchpin character of the series.
If you like your characters to wear their emotions on their sleeves, he's probably not the one for you. But if, like many of us, you appreciate that still waters run deep, there's a lot to like. He has in common with Morgan that they were drawn to the job because their backgrounds as abuse victims made them identify intensely with the suffering of others, but whereas Morgan bounces off walls, Hotch simmers and single-mindedly pursues. It's his understated intensity that infuses the discipline, integrity, energy, and focus into the mythical BAU and the show built around it. He's the one that continually challenges, irritates, and inspires the others and provides them their strongest sounding board. For him, the job is a true vocation -- as he said, it is what is he is, not just what he does. So when it came to episode 100, the writers' crowning achievement, in which the themes of the series came full circle, they chose Hotch, not Morgan.
I can't tell you what the vast non-pollable, non-posting audience thinks, but no one else can either. One thing I can't see as a network executive saying, hmm, let's dump Gibson from the cast just to see how it goes.
I have to disagree with your whole observation there, and as appealing as you've tried to make Hotch sound, I just don't buy it for one second.
I've never seen Morgan as someone who has worn his emotions on his sleeve. He wears his passion on his sleeve, which is one of those things that makes him an authentic humanistic character, unlike Hotch who seems robotic and empty at times.
"It's his understated intensity that infuses the discipline, integrity, energy, and focus into the mythical BAU and the show built around it."
lolno. It's the calling of the job and the mission and dedication to catching the bad guys and saving lives that infuses the dicipline, integrity, and focus into the mythical BAU and the show built around it. You're making up credit for Hotch now, IMO.
"He's the one that continually challenges, irritates, and inspires the others and provides them their strongest sounding board."
Uhhh.....the same answer above goes for this quote. I doubt Hotch is the one who influences them as much as what they see and go through.
"So when it came to episode 100, the writers' crowning achievement, in which the themes of the series came full circle, they chose Hotch, not Morgan."
And I disagree with that decision. I felt Morgan would have done splendidly continuing on as Unit Chief, and the way they went about that was totally unrealistic, IMO. Hotch suddenly comes back and is in charge again?
Hotch should have slowly weeded his way back in, and the transition should have been slow. By all rights, in order to protect his son from further exposure to the monsters out there, he should NOT have gone back to the BAU, because what's to stop something like what happened to Haily from happening to Jack? It was a poor decision on the part of the Hotch character, so the writers could keep him on the series. It's unrealistic "superhero" stuff like that that causes me to find him overrated, and not up to par, IMO.
"I can't tell you what the vast non-pollable, non-posting audience thinks, but no one else can either. One thing I can't see as a network executive saying, hmm, let's dump Gibson from the cast just to see how it goes."
And as a Hotch fan, I wouldn't expect you to, but I have no doubts that thought has crossed their mind, considering how they like to "shake things up."
I get that the writers try to build the show around Hotch...I just don't buy it. They can force feed him to me all they want, but I don't buy into the whole Gibson is worth all the money in the world, logic. The whole team is what makes the show, not him, and I stand by that.
Even if I were one of the head writers, with me being an obvious Morgan fan, I wouldn't try to build the show around Morgan either. Everyone is a fan of someone, and it's not right to have one shoved down everyone's throats.
Interesting debate here but I don’t have the time to read all the posts so I’ll bail … but RMF reading your post as the last one before mine I have to agree with you … Clearly a Hotch fan and hooked from the pilot with this out of control obsession, I have to say that CM would not have survived without Thomas Gibson, the man is a genius, and I mean that in acting terms! and Hotch as a character is even more genius … oh and one thing that I neglected to mention when I posted earlier … looking forward to Hotch / Jack scenes in season 7 .. we keep Hotch and we keep Jack so this is just wonderful ;)
*Long post warning*
(salivates - seeing pic of Shemar at the top of this blog but somehow meanders onto this one to post)
oh Hotch - you little wooden puppet, what have you started? No, I'll never think of him as the 'central' character, and I don't think the showrunners do either. I do agree, however, that Reid, Hotch, Morgan and Gideon have got more attention than the others. I love Hotch most - that doesn't make him the show's centre; only as crucial as the rest of the cast. I don't think salaries are based on their exp on the show but rather on their acting oeuvre.
Ok, on to my misfit moppet - I think the BAU is both his curse and his blessing, and the constant struggle—so evident in his eyes and body language—is what drew me in in the first place. All of them grapple daily with demons, both real and imaginary, how can they not, but his job is perhaps just that little bit harder (brought to the fore in 'penelope', 'amplification' and 'demonology'), both because of his position and because of who he is. He cannot fall apart in front of his team, at least he thinks he cannot (idiot), and he bottles it all up because he cannot share. But there needs to be an outlet, soon, and as tg said recently hotch needs decompression. He knows that '...we're all capable of unspeakable things' and the joy (despicable me!), to me, is in seeing his daily struggle to control that inner intensity where the demarcation between right and wrong is so very indistinct.
Contd...
I am with sdwally—it seems inconceivable to me that rossi and hotch seemed so unaware of emily's struggles throughout the spy madness, which is in stark contrast to 'demonology' where both these men were so quick to know that emily wasn't herself (although to be fair she did seem a tad more forthcoming then).
Guilt, (possible) expiation, expurgation, bottled-up rage, abject loneliness (that last scene of 'haunted'—unpacked boxes, unhung pictures, beige low-lit walls and that one little sigh escaping from his lips when he stands in the middle of the room, alone, amidst the ruins of his marriage, the absence of his son, and death mocking him and baiting him)—what's not to love? GRIN.
Nobody's trying to make anyone appealing to someone else and you don't have to buy it even for a second. These are things that we care about, passionately, and so we talk about them, with each other, mostly without anger/loathing/disgust. And as long as we can differentiate between 'I don't like him as much as the others' and 'I want to hit him, I loathe him', we're ok. We've seen what happens when the perspicacity to acknowledge tonal differences is lost. I love what others have to say about their fav characters, because I love them, too, but it can, almost always, be accomplished without taking away from the other characters. Heck, give me 67 pages on why you love Morgan - I'll read every word and pause on every comma. I'll even pause longer on a semi-colon. But 67 pages on why you hate Hotch (or anyone! Got tired of the Seaver debate pretty quickly), I'd rather not read. So this will be the last time I'm going to respond to a 'negative' post - not one that is disagreeing (that's good for the soul), just one that is disagreeable.
I love hotch for the reasons I stated above and they may be the very reasons that turn off someone else, or a million others; they might find him abhorrent, unfeeling, wooden, all-round bad guy, whatever. I get it. Now, moving on...
I for one enjoyed Morgan as Unit Chief and the discomfort I felt was because everyone was so on the button in those episodes. It was meant to feel slightly odd, because it was sudden the rupture, and they pulled it off very well. I would love for them to do another short, intense scene with these two as in the poignant last scene of 'scared to death' (with Kalli's song playing in the background). I also think the scene ending 'Mayhem' was incredible, showing the qualities of both men. Most of the pairings are sans tension, but AH and DM have a bit of 'we're wildly different but we want the same end' undercurrent going on. 'No thanks, I like my job' - 'but you like him more' - brilliant.
PS: Gubegirl, why in the world am I finding it so hard to walk away from this?! Crazy hormones I would think. Gah, I hate myself for being like this. At some point I just need to go back to my saramago / beer / perlman supercombo to "decompress".
Great post Elevenses! Hotch is my favorite character and I would've stopped watching if he hadn't returned, but I enjoy all of the other characters as well. Hotch and Morgan have shared some great moments over the years and I can't imagine the show without either one of them.
I didn't care for Morgan's stint as Unit Chief because the show felt off balance and it seriously sucked the life out of the Morgan character. All of the things that made the character likeable were stripped away and he became this dry, bland character who sounded like he was reading from a user's manual every time he opened his mouth.
I agree that Hotch needs to decompress. I think they should bring Andi Swan back and let him decompress with her. ; )
Morning, why andi, SF? why not you? or me? or some of our other usual suspects? you think we'd be too much for the poor s*d?
i liked Andi - 'all that from a pair of sneakers' (snicker)
and did i say i love hotch's smile when andi speaks of garcia - fond and proud in a mother hen sorta way. v cute.
Mother Hen Hotch - that's an image! oh cluck.
I really liked how well Hotch and Andi Swan worked together in the finale and think them having some off-screen "thing" that we'd only get a rare glimpse of occasionally would be good for Hotch. The rest of us can just continue to decompress him in our fantasies. ; )
Where in the world would you get the idea that Aaron Hotchner would 'decompress' with Andi Swan or any other woman for that matter. When it comes to women I doubt that he is as experienced with them as Reid is. This is a man who met the woman he wanted to marry at seventeen and then did so. I doubt that he dated much if any one except Haley. They were together for more than twenty years, as a dating couple and then married. This man is not like Morgan and does not sleep with women. We haven't even heard of him dating anyone. He spends his free time with his son and David Rossi. where is he meeting women? I don't even think that he really wants to meet another woman yet. He is still in love with his dead ex-wife and really doesn't look at women in any sexual sense. Hotch does not go out with the others, in the past years he would sometimes join them after work for a drink but he has never socialized with them except that one time with his wife by his side. With David it is a little different. David had actually been to his house and had dinner with him and his wife. I haven't seen or heard of any one else doing this. When he talks with the others it is in a supervisory or boss mode not friend. So I guess I am wondering why you think that he should have noticed or talked to Prentiss about what was happening to her with Doyle. He has a great deal of responsibility to many people and not just his team so he can't see everything. She is very good at keeping things to herself. Morgan and Reid could see problems because they dealt much more closely with her. They were her partners, Hotch was her boss. There is a big differece.
Elisabeth, I don't know if you'll see this, but I completely agree with everything you wrote! I could definitely use more Reid next season. His mind is a treasure-mine and there is a lot of potential to be explored there. I also agree about seeing him bond more with his teammates. I love me some Hotch/Reid and Morgan/Reid. But since we missed JJ and Emily so much last year, I want to see lots of JJ/Reid(non-shippy way), they're just so cute together, and Emily/Reid, again nothing romantic, I just think they work really well off each other. I want to see more episodes in the vein of most of the seasons1-4 episodes. I think the show was at its best during those years. I liked season 5 too, just the previous ones better. Season 6 for me was a complete disaster, and there are about six episodes I'd consider re-watching.
I also agree with the people who think that Emily should be the one to kill Doyle. I love Hotch and Morgan, but Emily deserves to look him in the eye and put a bullet in his head, telling him that this time she really did win. Reid killed Tobias Hankel, Hotch killed Foyet, Morgan killed Billy Flynn, they were all extraordinary cases that became personal to them, Doyle should be Emily's.
I honestly can't wait for the Doyle arc to be over so that the team that get back together and start hunting the bad guys down. I just want the good old days back.
Interesting that the season premier will take place a few months after last season's finale. Hopefully this means that Seaver will already have transferred somewhere else and won't figure at all. My fingers are crossed that this is what happens. I think it's the best and most logical thing to do.
I've been reading the ongoing debate and find it fascinating!
First, full disclosure. I'm a fan of Thomas Gibson and love Hotch as a character (I'm on the camp of "still waters run deep" means love! lol!). But I love this show to pieces too, and I want ALL THE FAMILY, ALL THE TIME, IN ALL THE EPISODES WITH ALL THEM IN CHARACTER. And what's more, I'm certain that these actors, all of them, have been woefully mistreated by the network since the very beginning.
Second, I think you all are talking about two different things, more or less as if they were the same. On one hand we have the actors and their paychecks, and on the other we have the characters and their importance inside the series. Both may belong to the same show, but doesn't necessarily relate. Now comes the time when I have to explain it, and when I may not be able to do so fully; please, bear with me ;)
The Actors: in every work setting, as more experience doing the job you have, more entitled you are to get a bigger pay. In the case of the CM actors, if you take a look to their respective credits (IMDB is a good source for this) you'll see right away that prior to their stints in CM, Patinkin, Mantegna and Gibson are the only ones with lengthy and successful careers. The others, some because they were really young in 2005, some because they'd not been lucky to get breakout roles, couldn't make that double claim (not even Shemar, because a daytime soaps are not seen to be on the same league by the industry as a primetime show). This is the sole reason because from the get go the salaries each one of them got were vastly different, with the three I've mentioned getting the higher paychecks and the better spots in the show credits. Once the time to renew their contracts has come (CBS idiocy last year notwithstanding with their "fire the women to refresh things" approach), their pay bumps never will allow them end in the same pay level, even if the percentage of said bump is similar, as they don't start negotiations from the same place (the original salary). It's not a matter of this being fair, us liking it or whatever; it's how this industry works and what the unions reinforce.
The Characters: in every work setting where few people work closely, who you work with affects how you approach the job that needs to be done and how you react to every work-related situation. Sometimes is subtle, a missing different co-worker would do that; sometimes is glaringly obvious, a different boss would do that in spades. CM reflects this perfectly. Missing JJ and Emily affected the others, all of us saw that and none of us liked the end result; 'nuff said. If they would have lost Hotch, the boss, all of us would have seen the change without a doubt and most wouldn't have liked it one bit, as the character who would have taken his position would have had to change, losing a part of what we like about him/her in the process (as happened with Morgan, the charming multi-layered character we all have come to love, that suddenly became a strange that didn't allow himself to be his caring self when talking with Garcia, nor to be Reid's big brother, nor to be Prentiss twin-brother... and the season 6 awful writing made him devolve into a one-note-angry being I was unable to recognize) and the others would have changed too, because you don't relate to any person the same way you do to a different one. Does this make Hotch more important than the others inside the show? NO. Does this make Hotch an important character that conditions how the rest act and how we see them? YES.
I hope, hope, hope to have been able to express what I'm thinking as is, moreso after the long rant I've just imposed upon you all!
May I have your thoughts now? :D
Maria, SF, CZ, i agree with all of you! Well said! However, it wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility to see Hotch with another woman.... I understand that we may have, in Hotch, a person afraid to step into a relationship once again, but it would be good for him i think if he acknowledges the need to open up, again. Although i love my angst-ridden Hotch, it's just too much of an emotional cul de sac for any living human being.
As for Garcia now being immune to the violence, i put it down to inconsistent writing. She just seemed that way when JJ was gone. And in the finale, with everyone knowing JJ'd be back, she reverted to the girl who'd sent her resume on pink home-made paper.
Wow,
You guys can write! Yes, "sf", no matter what I will continue to decompress with TG/Hotch privately.
I do like the idea of him and Andi Swan. Would it be good for him though to be with someone who is in the same field as he? He has a hard time letting go of work as it is. And I can't see him having a fling, with Hotch I think it would have to be all or nothing. We don't want him to have something else to feel guilty about. Although there was that woman in NY, his friend who was killed, I remember the women on the team speculating about them. I always thought something was going to happen between him and Haley's sister.
My mind is not creative enough to work up a whole lot of possible scenarios for S7, I will leave that to those of you are good at it. I do however want Hotch to be less of a cariciature next season and do more than stand around looking stern and as if he's got a couple of poles up you know where and just directing the other team members where to go. I want the man back who would not have missed the signs with Emily. This man knew his team and should have known something was up with her. Rossi missing this was also inconceivable. "sdwally" I'm with you on this. I do hope that the stories left hanging from last season are cleared up quickly. I don't really care who kills Doyle, perhaps Emily with help from Morgan, letting her put that chapter behind her and moving on. I did not like the whole spy/spy catcher story arc so even if it just was totally forgotten about I wouldn't care. There have been other inconsistencies and lack of continuity as "sf" points out.
p.s. "Nickname" good to meet you and I look forward to reading about your love of all things Morgan.
Elevenses: You are welcome. I cannot take the time to comment much this AM because I have to run off for my annual PE lab work and am fasting. Which means I can't even drink my coffee, which, as you will realize, means that I cannot write properly. If I could drink it black, maybe, but since I like it strong, full-bodied and dark and THEN milk it down well....I can't have me.
But that does bring me to the subject at the top of this blog: strong, full-bodied, dark with just the right amount of milking down...oh, how I digress. This makes THREE magazine covers (I will buy this TODAY if I can find it) with this bare chest. When Eleven's men in the white coats come for me, it will be when my family comes home to find me licking my freshly Shemar-wallpapered walls...
Nickname. All I can say to you right now, my friend, is that you make some good points and we will want to talk to you more. Maybe you are a fan, and yes this is a TV show, but if you have been reading this blog the past several months, you would not be questioning our feelings the way you are. We LOVE these people as if they are family and you may find that silly, but now we, on this blog, feel like family; we have come together because of our love for them. There's alot to be said for friendships like that and maybe if you hang around long enough, you will "catch" it and feel the love, too. Try it, you'll like it.
Wow, I said I wasn't going to talk and I'm late! Off to walk dogs.
Have a good day, y'all.
P.S. Can't wait til Blimey gets on here again...:) The sparks will be aflyin'...
I have an idea for prentiss to kill Doyle
Ok so after the team tracks him down. He has one if the team members inches away from death. Their life in his hands, when suddenly from a nearby building a bullet shoots thru the air. Killing Doyle point blank. It's Emily who used her former contacts at the CIA to find out Doyle and team where about 2 come head 2 head and tracked him down just in the nick of time 2 help her family.
Just an idea. I can think of more ways 2 but that'd be pretty cool. I don't care how as long as it's Emily that does it.
I have to tell you this - i have a tiny pic of Rowan Atkinson on my bedroom wall. My friend and ex-boss told me that would do hubby's ego a world of good. Much better in fact than plastering my walls with Hotch / TG (or if i go back to my first post-pubescence, super-massive crush, Gabriel Byrne).
Dunno about fasting, Gubegirl, but i feel your pain with the coffee. Just drink in Shemar why don't you? Sure i'll lend you a few of my men in white coats if they get a free moment from handcuffing me (to Hotch's bed).
Elevenses,
We share so much: TGfTG; Trevor Eve and now I find out you had a crush on Garriel Byrne. I remember him when he used to be on a show on Irish TV as this dark, brooding young man who came home to work the family farm. It was only on for 30 mins each week. This was Ireland, our lust had to be curtailed somehow.
I keep making that mistake: "t" is me
Yeah, what happens after you type in 't'? Does TG eat up the rest of your name? (Yes you get it - i'm glued to the screen and up to no good.)
We didn't get married to the same man, did we? Maybe we would've if we'd been in the same country! OOOOH, scandalous! I fell head over Obama's heels in love with GB after watching Miller's Crossing.
Maybe I have become jaded,tired of the drama.Whatever the explanation, the news that the team will finally be back together was met with mixed reactions by me.
First I went YES!!!,then, I came off my cloud. None of it means much without good writing and storytelling. Add me to the list who wants to forget season 6 altogether(dream sequence!).
A cast is only as good as the words they put out every week,what they are given to say. Not sure where the writers went in season 6, but maybe they could go back to the dvd's for some character studies or continuity?
This turmoil and crap has gone on for a whole year now.I prefer my drama ON the show,thanks.Heavens, a bad soap could not write this stuff we have had to endure as fans and viewers.Maybe the network who shall not be named has finally learned something?Or do we go down this road again one year from now?If Mr Gubler goes, then so do I!
I would like to think these are intelligent people(hmmfph).You just do not play switcheroo with beloved cast members and expect viewers to go 'meh,whatever'.Surely they have learned that from us by now?
Seems as if many were ready to give up when Mandy left the show.Yet, imho, it just got better and better as the seasons went on.Well, until the end of season 5 anyhow.I just could not have imagined the show without Thomas.I cannot imagine the show without any of them.There was a hole the size of China for me in season 6 with the ladies gone. It was not right, It was just 'off'. So I turned it off. I eventually watched some season 6episodes online,but there are probably 2 or 3 that I would say were memorable.I won't be checking amazon for ordering,sorry.
And sorry, the newbie person did not endear me to the season either.That whole debacle just made me more ticked off.
This show works with THE SEVEN, take away any piece, there is this huge gap in the family.Now that we are going to get that back, the CM staff need to get off their you know what's and put this show back to its awesomeness.
Oh, and please, netowrk people, get our boy genius out of the police station too while you are at it.I miss our geek.I miss the Reid rants.At least give us a reason for those headaches.If you were not going to continue with it, you should never have gone there in the first place. That is just a big letdown.
Anna,
You're right w/o good writing it will all be for nought. Having TG, AJ or Paget is not enough. They have to get good scripts. I imagine writers must want to develop their characters but on a show like this, a police procedural (I know they say it's not) the development has to be within limits.
I'm not even sure the fiasco of the last season was an attempt at development but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. These people are cast as heroic, ok with some flaws, figures in a not quite true to life drama.
This is not a gritty, dramatic cable TV show. It's a thriller. In seasons 3 & 4 they perfected the formula, let's get back to that.
Shemar on the cover of Maximun Fitness. OMG!!! This is why he is gonna end up in my secret love chamber. The one I'm having built for him.
"Get lean at home with Criminal Minds' Shemar Moore" - pmsl at my smutty little mind on *that* one!!!
I wish the blokes at the gym I go to looked liked SM in that photo - there's nothing more minging than pasty English male flesh in lycra (bleugh!). He really needs to do a "Derek Morgan's home workout" DVD - I'd pay a ruddy fortune for that, assuming they do a region 2 copy!
@ Anna:
Agreed - It's about time Reid was allowed out in public again. I wonder if part of it is down to MGG's dodgy knee, but I saw photos of him jumping around like a first class nutter in Monte Carlo so I'd assume it's all better now?
@ Gubegirl:
Sparks always fly when I'm around! And keep it up with the "arse" usage - one of my favourite words and so versatile too. ;-))
Right, y'all (the closest I've got to the Lone Star State is sitting on the back of a Texan biker's Harley Davidson at the top of Mount Evans - does that count?) I'm off to the minger gym to ignore the mingers (minger = opposite of SM) and "buy" myself the trouser room for another slice of Cheesecake Factory goodness for the summer.
**Drools like Homer Simpson in a donut shop**
Laters...
Very happy that Thomas has a new contract, the man deserve everythiing he got!
Hope to see more of Hotch in S7, was very dissapointed by s6 because there wasn't enough Hotch!
Dawn
I've never seen Morgan as someone who has worn his emotions on his sleeve. He wears his passion on his sleeve, which is one of those things that makes him an authentic humanistic character, unlike Hotch who seems robotic and empty at times.
Morgan is the hothead whose feelings are never in doubt. Hotch is the great represser, the more difficult and rewarding read who may not run his emotions up a flagpole, but who feels them deeply nonetheless ("Ashes and Dust", "Psychodrama").
lolno. It's the calling of the job and the mission and dedication to catching the bad guys and saving lives that infuses the dicipline, integrity, and focus into the mythical BAU and the show built around it. You're making up credit for Hotch now, IMO.
The job itself does not inform anyone with discipline, integrity, or focus. Those are taught and enforced. Zeal is one thing, effectiveness is another. Morgan didn't call him "drill sergeant" for nothing.
I felt Morgan would have done splendidly continuing on as Unit Chief, and the way they went about that was totally unrealistic, IMO. Hotch suddenly comes back and is in charge again?
By choosing Hotch, I meant not as unit chief, but as the character to express the the multiple aspects of their struggle with darkness. Anyway, his reintroduction couldn't have happened fast enough for me, because I wasn't a fan of Morgan as unit chief. The role reversal erased Morgan's quintessential vitality and turned him into a dry, generic figure.
By all rights, in order to protect his son from further exposure to the monsters out there, he should NOT have gone back to the BAU, because what's to stop something like what happened to Haily from happening to Jack? It was a poor decision on the part of the Hotch character, so the writers could keep him on the series. It's unrealistic "superhero" stuff like that that causes me to find him overrated, and not up to par, IMO.
Maybe Hotch should have quit, and the writers are trying to have their cake and eat it too. But then, all the characters have ties, and there is a potential threat to Henry, Diana Reid, Morgan's family in Chicago, Rossi's ex-wives, and Ambassador Prentiss. Maybe no one should work this job? The writing is problematic, but it was less ridiculous on the "superhero" front than Morgan confronting Billy Flynn alone or Hotch walking into the restaurant sans bulletproof vest.
Elevenses & gubegirl: there's no reason to thank me but your welcome. Having you guys to commiserate w/ these last few months saved my sanity lol....
As for S7 there are a few things i would love to see and not see. I'm slightly worried when they say JJ will be leaner and meaner. Does this mean she will no longer be the liason? That she will be in a position of more authority? I don't think I could stand seeing Garcia present cases for another season. I am also one who hopes we move on from the Prentiss/Doyle storyline quite quickly Prentiss always struck me as a highly intelligent badass woman capable of holding her own in any situation but
never as the James Bond 007 type. Iwould also love to
see some more one liners from Rossi revealing tidbits
about his former wives. Not too many just one here or
there in passing. As for Hotch I'm in the still waters run
deep camp. Though I think maybe the reason he shows so
little
emotion is that on some level he thinks it may be a sign of weakness or that others may perceive it as such? As for Dr. Reid I'm w/ all the others who say let's get back to his genius. Get him out of the station and let's get back to what makes his so amazing.... his mind. I used to love when he would spout seemingly random facts and statistics . I say used to b/c I can't remember the last time it happened. They hardly ever tap into his genius to help solve a case anymore. The last reference I can remember is in Today I do when he said there are millions of self help books out there, I read 22 today. It brought a smile to my face b/c that's such a Spencer thing to say. It would be nice if they made Morgan a little less angry and more like the Morgan of the past charming,sweet, sometimes sensitive and I think by now we all know I'd love to see a few doors kicked in :)
And as a Hotch fan, I wouldn't expect you to, but I have no doubts that thought has crossed their mind, considering how they like to "shake things up."
They like to keep their marquee actors as a calculated audience draw. When they lost Patinkin, they didn't choose to drop the position or fill it with an unknown, they replaced him with another name actor. As it played out, Mantegna's Rossi did not become the dominant figure Patinkin's Gideon was. But for a time, everyone was afraid that Patinkin's departure would cost everyone their jobs. When they shook things up (ugh), they pragmatically picked on actors with less name recognition. I'm happy it bit them in the ass anyway, because screwing with the cast harmed the overall credibility of the show, especially in the case of JJ.
I get that the writers try to build the show around Hotch...I just don't buy it. They can force feed him to me all they want, but I don't buy into the whole Gibson is worth all the money in the world, logic. The whole team is what makes the show, not him, and I stand by that.
Not build the show around him, but he is the anchoring character. This is not a character drama on the model of House, where all plots and personal interactions are geared toward illumination of a central personality. The show is about this job and how these people do it. Nevertheless, there are characters who set the fundamental tone for their shows, and he is one of them. Factor in that this is Gibson's third successful prime-time TV series, and you have the reasoning.
@ Velandara:
I agree with all of your post.
Let's get back to the quirky,slightly nerdy, brilliant badass prentiss was before. As well as everything you said about the other cast members
@ Blimey limey:
Yes I'll count that....lol you sound southern already (trust me it's alot more great than our news makes us out to be)lol
@ CMFAN11:
Why, thank you! I'll be a-munchin' grits and po'boys morning, noon and night before the month is out.
Apologies if I've got the wrong food for the wrong bit of the South (although one could argue it's not bad going for a Limey) and a Texan lynch mob has already been dispatched across the Atlantic.
You'll never find me, y'all...
;-))
@ Blimey Limey
Lol it's ok actually I don't kno anyone who eats grits lol it's mostly steak and southern cooking and sweet tea down here in this part of TX
I say southern cooking bc we have a variety in all parts not just Texas lol
BTW: If i may ask what do u mean Texas lynch mob? I know it wasn't meant offensively at all because your obviously nice...I was just curious.
Have a great day.
@christyzachman
He is still in love with his dead ex-wife...
I agree completely with your entire comment. Hotch married his high school sweetheart; he's a faithful man; he's had sex with one woman ever. He was abused as a child (the way I read canon, he grew up with a violent father and a violently indifferent mother, but that's open to interpretation, although I do think Hayley's "Don't make me the monster" comment in 3x02 is very telling), so he has major trust issues. I think Hayley was his one true love and his safe haven - she knew him when he was walking around in shock after the death of his father. That's why her loss was so devastating to him. He's still in love with her, he can't move on. And even if he could, he'd only ever pursue an all-or-nothing relationship, because it's his natural inclination and because he won't bring random women into his home when he has Jack's emotional well-being to think about. I certainly don't see him "decompressing" with Andi Swann - why would he spend time with a woman when he could be with Jack? He didn't have Jack for so long even before Foyet forced them apart. Hotch wants to spend every spare minute he can with his son, and he wants to be involved in his life because he almost lost Jack. He knows how precarious life is. He doesn't take a single second with his son for granted.
There's also the fact that Hayley probably cheated on him to consider, and the fact that she left him. More trust issues - he might tell himself it was the job she couldn't get cope with, but a part of him will always feel she rejected him because she didn't love the person he is. How can he think about pursuing a relationship after that? And then she died because of who he is, and because the person he is wasn't good enough to save her. Because you know that's how he thinks of it, however much he tells himself otherwise.
And, on top of all that, you have the fact that he was very likely sexually assaulted by Foyet to consider. Again, that's something open to interpretation, but I don't personally see how you can interpret that dialogue as signifying anything less than a sexual assault, if not outright rape. And, guys, I gotta tell you, I was sexually assaulted and stalked by two different guys ten years ago, and now if a guy even checks me out in the street I run a goddamn mile. Hotch is going to need serious, serious therapy to even begin getting over that. One of my season seven wishes is to see Hotch flashback to Foyet's attack when a woman expresses sexual interest in him. I picture a female detective on a case surreptitiously touching his hand and making her interest very clear, and Hotch politely rejecting her. When he gets home, he thinks about it and then throws up in the bathroom. Maybe I'm twisted for wanting it, but somebody could write the shit out that scene.
Oh, and I don't for one minute think that Hotch didn't notice something was going on with Prentiss in season six. I do think Hotch has a general team policy of non-interference, and we know he's a supporter of the moratorium on inter-team profiling. For me, it was much like his reaction to Reid's drug problem - polite disinterest. They all know when something's going on, but Hotch isn't going to confront anybody, let alone a member of the team, if he doesn't have to.
And I have officially spent too long thinking about this thread. Shutting up, now!
@ CMFAN11:
A lynch mob is a group of people who want "revenge" on another. I was pre-empting that I'd possibly offend any other Texans lurking around if I got the food references wrong and I'd be on a hit list!!
Blame the warped Limey sense of humour (I know, too many Us...) - those Texan bikers were a pair of sweeties despite looking like total badasses ("badarse" sounds crap, btw; we never say it) and told me to "get my ass to Texas" as apparently people wave to you in the street whether they know you or not and once you've tasted Southern hospitality you won't want to leave.
All I can remember is the words "Texas" and "heat index" featuring heavily on last summer's morning weather news whilst I was enjoying my breakfast waffles - if I ever visit I'm going in January!!! (Don't mind heat, hate humidity).
If I ever say anything which doesn't make sense or could be misconstrued, shout at me. I can promise I'm never trying to be offensive, I'm just not always sure what does and doesn't translate across the Pond. I often find it weird how the same language can actually be so different at times!
My day is nearly over, but I hope y'all's is good so far! ;-))
@ Blimey Limey
Lol ok now I got ya, and I know what a lynch mob is lol but u defined it pretty good anyways.
And yes we just got some rain after 2 months of 104-108 degree weather the past month we're definitely in the "heat index" lol
Blimey Limey: would you mind stashing some of us in your suitcases? I'm sure we could all use a vacation ;). I've only been to Texas once and even then it was only passing through on my way to Florida.. It was beautiful from what I remember. Maybe you could update us along the way and we could all vacation vicariously through you :)
@ CMFAN11:
Plenty of rain here for you!!! We should do a swap??
So much for summer - it was 15c/59f today. Urgh! AND I had to put the heating on yesterday. So wrong.
I'm having a day out in Death Valley sometime during the last week in July - can't bloody wait!
@ Velandra:
Ha! My hideously pink trolley case (can't miss it on the carousel) will be packed full of the cute little summer skirts and tops which have been gathering dust since our last decent summer in 2006. No joke.
I've got a little netbook I'll be taking, so I'll be able to keep up with CM developments whilst I'm leaving a trail of havoc across the SW...
I'm sorry, but Cadbury's comments has me a little creeped out. The Foyet part. You did say it's open to interpretation, but I personally don't think a sexual assault happened, much less a rape.
I was just kind of kidding around about Hotch decompressing with Andi Swan. I was trying to lighten things up a bit. Honestly, I've never really given it a whole lot of thought, but what I do know is that grief and trauma are different for everyone. There is no right or wrong way to react to things like that and there would be no right or wrong way for Hotch to behave in the aftermath of his trauma and loss.
I lost my husband in a very sudden and traumatic way and I know how I and my children have coped since, but I don't compare my situation to others. I know that there are 9-11 widows and widowers who were married again a year later and there are some who are still flying solo today. It's different for everyone.
I do know that watching someone you love die and in a messy way messes with your head in ways that you can't imagine and I also know that something like that can and will completely consume you if you let it.
I don't see Hotch as the type to lay down and let something like that consume him. He loves Haley and always will, but I don't think it's a love that would keep him from loving another. It's only been a year so it might be too soon for Hotch, but then again a date might be exactly what the doctor ordered. You never know.
But hey, it doesn't have to be Andi Swan. There's a whole bunch of soccer moms that found a reason to put their cell phones away and pay attention and you know they do. ; )
I'm sorry, but Cadbury's comments has me a little creeped out. The Foyet part. You did say it's open to interpretation, but I personally don't think a sexual assault happened, much less a rape
I don't think he was raped either. I think you could say he was raped psychologically, but not physically.
Well, I was looking forward to S7 after I heard of TG's signing and that our ladies were returning, but, hearing that they are all separated doesn't give me much hope now. I want them all together.
@Umm... said...
Aww, why creeped out? It's just an interpretation. I didn't mean to creep you. I just can't interpret that scene any other way. The dialogue doesn't make any sense otherwise, I mean, why even script it and play it the way they did? It was very, very sexually threatening. Even if there was no physical bad touching, sexually threatening words are still a form of sexual assault - especially when combined with physical violence.
@sf81387
I get you were joking, hon, I just decided to run with it and get all the thoughts out of my head. I've been thinking all of this since season five and never verbalized it! Sorry to have upset you. x
Cadbury said...
Aww, why creeped out? LOL!! Okay, I'm no longer creeped out!!
You didn't upset me Cadbury. : )
Pat,
What do you mean about them all being separated? Did I miss something?
Cadbury: I don't think that Hotch was physically raped either but I am totally blown away that you have spoken of your own experience here and admire you for being able to talk about it to us. I hope that you are able to overcome your negative feelings after your painful experience and that you can find a good man to trust and love some day. My empathy to you and I mean that sincerely.
The flip side of what you were saying: I think Hotch could fall in love again and like sf, I think Andi Swan is a great choice. She is a fine, professional woman and one Hotch could respect and maybe ACCIDENTALLY fall in love with. I could live with that. Oh, yeah.
And sf81387: I am so sorry to hear of the sudden (hopefully not recent?) loss of your husband. It doesn't occur to me to think anymore about my fellow fans other than maybe are they old, young, married, single, kids? That sort of thing.
We have begun to know each other abit better in the past few months and I am happy to have this place to share.
Cadbury and sf: pls do not feel you need to respond to my comments re: your sharing and hopefully, I have said nothing here to offend either of you re: such personal matters. The mother hen/former HR person comes out in me and I seem unable to repress it:)
Digressing a tad, I would like to say that we have joked before about how many of us "have no life" and of course, we are saying that facetiously and excusing why we are here blogging all the time(!), but I think that there is something different and compelling about CM that draws - and keeps - the group it does. And I think that the family element from the show plays out to some extent here on this blog that we find some commonality to share with each other. Anyone?
I had better sign off and go walk my dogs because I am feeling rather mushy right now and frankly, wondering if I am being silly?
Only you guys can answer that...
P.S. Blimey: It is in the 70's here in sunny San Diego, and has been quite DRY for awhile...in more ways than one...:)
I'll be on the hunt for a CM re-run tonite, for sure after seeing those-oh-so-lovely abs today...sigh...
Gubegirl: your not being silly. I agree that the family element does playout here. I feel like we've all developed a closeness/ friendship if you will. Especially in the last couple of months. I sincerely hope we don't lose touch over the summer. Since I am now the one becoming increasingly mushy/sentimental ...... Until later :)
Oh you guys are the best....there is so much needless hate out there that this site, usually, feels like 'a god-given solace'. My prayers are with those of you who are struggling and my heartfelt admiration for you, too, that you have the strength to cope in whatever way you can and overcome.
Minds is like a family - whether it's because it shows on screen and rubs off on us or whther it's the actors who are such warm, funny nutters i don't know. Or maybe as tg said we treat the actors/characters like family. Whatever the symptoms or the cause, it's all good. One for all and all for one....
Cadbury - that would be a freaky good scene (please i don't want to inadvertently offend anyone by calling it 'good'), but does the Minds writers have the guts to go there i wonder. They tend to pussyfoot around some major issues.
As for S7 storylines, i just want them to surprise me :-)
Blimey, the weather gods are never democratic, are they?
Glad to see that TG signed a new contract. Very much looking forward to Season 7!
@ Theresa H
I was just going by this on the blog. From what Messer's saying, it sounds to me like they're all in different places, doing different things. I could be reading it wrong, but that's what it sounds like to me. I'm just wondering how that's going to work. It won't be the same if they're not all together.
Messer told TV Guide: "All of those threats that were made in the finale, that there might be changes and people were going to move on, have come true to some degree [by the season seven premiere]."
The showrunner also revealed that Morgan (Shemar Moore) will be the first team member to discover that Hotch (Thomas Gibson) and JJ (AJ Cook) faked the death of Prentiss (Paget Brewster).
"You'll learn who's been where and who's been doing what," she said.
Cadbury,
Thank you for your thoughtful post. I'm very sorry to read of your past suffering.
I certainly see your point about Hotch and the traumas he's faced. I agree that his "experience" with women would likely be limited since he seemed so devoted to Haley. On the other hand, I don't see him just as a father devoid of sexual interest or desires. Overall, I agree with you about Foyet's attack/rape and could certainly see natural desires being deeply sublimated as a result of that.
Anon/Nickname- I am a little surprised that someone would devote so much time- on a thread 'celebrating' TG's contract- bashing TG/Hotch. Seems more trollish than your post about the various characters shows you to be. You obviously know and love CM (esp. Morgan), but have opinions about Hotch that are alien to me and many here celebrating his return. :)
I'm a "still waters run deep" fan. I like men who are tall/dark/handsome/responsible/strong with private passions. I love my own "Mr. Glynnis," Pride & Prejudice's Mr. Darcy, Capt. Picard on Star Trek, and CM's Aaron Hotchner. I think Cadbury's description of Hotch as an anchor character for the show is excellent.
RE actor salary disparity: whoever suggested looking at IMDB had it right. Yes. TG & SM have been on CM the same amt. of time, but TG had great success with 5 yrs of Dharma & Greg and a few yrs on Chicago Hope, too (in addition to lots of other, less distinguished, work). SM has not had equal credits to that (though I loved him on Y&R and don't think ill of soap experience, TG was on soaps for a few yrs, too). So, his salary being lower makes sense, imo. While SM is not my fave, I do admire his abs. :) I will join the camp who would like to see more of the sensitive Morgan who flirts w/homeless ladies and makes them feel pretty.
Anyway, on general stuff, grits are really good, FYI, Blimey Limey. ;) Humidity is not good and heat index can be painful. I'm not in TX (have family there and used to travel there on business a lot), am in NC. While specific presentation of "southern foods" varies (i.e. different types of BBQ) across the south, we all pretty much eat or at least are familiar with the same foods. :)
RE Prentiss' return: as I dote on Hotch, I'm always happy for him to be the hero, but in this case would probably prefer for Emily to get Doyle and maybe save Morgan in the process. That'd have some umph, imo.
I'm just delighted that TG signed on for 2 more yrs. Since he did, I've been enjoying watching past eps again... I couldn't while I was on pins and needles RE whether he'd stay on CM. He was one of the main reasons I gave the show a try (MP & SM were other two) and I couldn't imagine it w/out him. I hope Season 7 will be awesome and will center more on Hotch and then Reid (my 2nd fave).
Time for bed! Nighty night, y'all! ;)
I'm still here and still read your comments.
But well, you're writing to fast...
I miss the last post...
Bonjour les filles
As for the chat transcripts, I'm a european fan and i wait the transcripts to know whath was said, so i'm a bit sad that i could'nt do that this time.
I'm tired, see you later!
Syd
glad tg is coming back for season 7. what a great way to start a 3-day weekend...now i will be able to catch up on the 2nd half of CM on my computer....maybe..hoping to find a cars toy model of jm's character in cars 2....
The discussion about the right kind of women for Hotch is interesting although I disagree with all of the ideas presented so far. This is a faithful kind man who needs a woman to control him. He has so much control of himself at work that he needs to go home and be taken care of. I think that is what caused the end of the marriage to Haley is that she now had Jack and couldn't give as much to him and that hurt their relationship. Hotch needs a woman who does not have other children or a job but is able to help him come back from the dark places that his job takes him to without too much competition. He loves Jack with all that he can and I got the sense from the beginning that he was the one who wanted a child, not her. I think she was happy with just taking care of her man but gave him the child he wanted. She just didn't realize how much work it would be having a little person with her twenty-four hours a day and really wanted Hotch with her more often and in a less dark type of job. But that's just not what could happen with him, what he does is who he is and nothing will change that. There are so many men who do jobs that they hate because their wives and families need them to do that instead of what they really would do if they didn't have the responsibility of others. The problem is that leaves them angry and not happy. The cause of many fights is that, women who want more than what a man can give and men who hate what they do.
Hotch should not date a soccer mom or any woman who has been married and divorced and has children of her own. He could not handle that type of woman. He should not date a woman that he met at worked because of the possibility of them wanting to continue to work beside him or around him rather than to choose to keep him and his son in a good home. He needs a quiet, gentle, unmarried or childless widow who can take care of him and support him in coming back from the dark places he goes to while working.
Yes, I realize that I am setting this relationship into the 'fifties' except that I would happen to love a relationship like that. Families stayed together and did things together. My grandparents were married for more than fifty years before they died, my Aunts and Uncles all had marriages that have lasted for more than forty years. I have cousins who have been married for up to thirty years, including the one who got pregnant at sixteen and have just celebrated thirty years married. These are relationships of respect and honor and love between the couples. They support each other and of the older generations there were homemakers and working husbands. The men were not expected to do work around the house in addition to working outside the home, except on Saturdays when they might do the yardwork or clean the garage. There was division of work and respect for each other but they didn't command, they supported and helped.
One of my sweetest memories is watching my grandparents walking down the street holding hands. Children are important in the family but they should not come between the husband and wife. Because when the children are grown it is your spouse that you will spend your days with, not your children.
Hotch needs a old-fashioned girl not a feminist who has real idea of how to love a man.
Misprint - typo- A feminist has no idea of how to love a man which is why many get divorced, chose a lesbian lifestyle or end of alone an miserable.
sf81387,
So sorry to read about your loss. I hope you have a loving and supportive circle around you.
Cadbury,
I hope you too have found the love and support you need to recover from what sounds like an awful experience.
christyzachmann
This is all I'll say on the subject because this is not the place for this particular discussion but I don't see the correlation between feminism and an inability to love and care for someone or feminism and being a lesbian. Life is full of contradictions and I know both feminists and people who would never call themselves that struggling to juggle their own needs and those of spouses and children and older parents and being loving people in all the mess that that entails.
Re Haley:
Yes, she became angry with Hotch but that was because so often he put the job before her and Jack. Yes, it's a hugely important job but so is being a husband and father. I was sorry they killed her off because she was really the only one who called him on his total dedication to the job.
It's interesting, now he's a single father, doing it all alone and we've seen less of the struggle he must be having.
Cadbury, sf81387, I’m sorry to hear about the suffering you both experienced and appreciate your sharing your heartbreak and devastation. I wish you both true happiness and admire your courage.
Cadbury, I must admit, I was a little “creeped” out by your post, especially the statement: “I picture a female detective on a case surreptitiously touching his hand and making her interest very clear, and Hotch politely rejecting her. When he gets home, he thinks about it and then throws up in the bathroom.”
I don’t want to believe that Foyet actually raped Hotch; and I highly doubt that the writers or the actor would even go there on TV; but to think that the slightest touch of a woman’s hand on his would make Hotch hurl his lunch really bothers me. I don’t believe a man who has dealt with death, devastation, and the most horrid acts of depravity to women, now can’t handle being touched and hit on by one. I would like to believe a man who looks as fine as Hotch, gets hit on practically every day; we just don’t see it.
I know Haley was the love of his life; but she was the love who chose to divorce him 2 years prior to her death. Part of the problem with the way Hotch is written is the writers have almost caricatured him as a monk or a saint, who is devoid of sexual interest since his divorce and after Haley’s death. I don’t know too many men like that, that includes some priests as has been well-documented. CM’s fantasy existence for most of their characters makes it harder for audiences to accept the fact that these characters aren’t perfect; they don’t always follow a certain structure and pattern; and they are not as noble as we want them to be. They, like every other human being, are flawed and should be shown as such.
I would like to see Hotch decompress with Prentiss because they not only have shared experiences; there is a contextual reference/background already established from past storylines. In Nameless Faceless, Prentiss was the one who worried about him, sought him out, found him and asked him if he wanted to discuss what happened to him. In Haunted Prentiss was the one who picked him up, brought him home and let him know he wasn’t alone. The historical aspects would give any “decompression” scene greater context and meaning.
But as Thomas stated during his interview about what may happen with Hotch, where he mentioned that he needs to decompress, he and Erica had been discussing it. So whatever happens, if it happens at all, will be determined by the showrunner and the actor(s). If the scene we eventually see is of Hotch decompressing with Andi Swan or a new character; that would be the decision made by Messer, Gibson and the other people involved.
However, if I were Paget, I would want to be that person because the opportunity to be a part of a riveting storyline and compelling drama doesn’t come to often in CM. The scenes of Hotch unraveling with a chosen friend could be Emmy worthy for all involved, the actors, the writer, the director; especially if the dialogue is gripping and the script is worth of the actors’ talent. If CM ever decides to allow Hotch to finally deal with his demons on screen, Erica should seriously consider whether it would be better to give that juicy dialogue to a guest star or to one of its talented originals.
Sorry, that should read...
"...especially if the dialogue is gripping and the script is "worthy" of the actors’ talent."
Oh here we go. The big political type push for shipping.
I really don't know how the writers are going to handle crafting scripts around so many fans' differing opinions. If we still had Andrew Wilder at the helm as Executive Story Editor or preferably Exec Producer, I would be more trusting of him to choose the right way to go and maybe have Hotch be in a temporary het relationship to satisfy the mainstream viewers who just have to try to ship Hotch with someone no matter what. And of course most of these same fans don't want to believe that Hotch was raped by Foyet even though Foyet really couldn't have used more clear dialogue as far as what he was going to do to Hotch in that scene.
And I am truly sorry that you were attacked Cadbury. It happened to a friend of mine a long time ago, and she really didn't get over it until her rapists ended up getting murdered years later. And I am completely with you that Hotch wouldn't even want to be touched by anyone in any kind of way that would seem sexual. If he was, I agree that he'd immediately flash back to the Foyet attack. He needs to get therapy before he could have an intimate relationship.
Sf8, I am so sorry about your tragic loss. :(
I had never heard/read the term shipper until I started on this blog. Oh, the places one gets an eduction!
sdwally I believe you're a big Hotch/Prentiss shipper and if it had happened earlier on in the show I could buy it. They're both attractive people and strong characters and there's an obvious bond. But at this stage it would almost seem incestous to me. The characters and the actors have worked together as colleagues and friends all these years and more than that there is the family context in which we all see them.
Neither do I trust the writers to handle the complexity that this would bring to the relationship between them and the wider one with the rest of the team.
I wouldn't mind if we saw something of the attraction between them but then a pulling back because they both realise it can go nowhere.
I agree with you that the fact that these people live in a fantasy existence makes genuine real-life flaws and complexities harder for us to accept but that's the nature of this kind of show. It's a formula that can be tinkered with but not messed with too much.
I wish it were different, a hot and heavy Hotch scene would make my day.
p.s.
Where did the term "shipper" come from anyway? Anybody want to further my education?
Teresa, the word "shipper" is from "relationship". It started with "The X-Files, I think, when there were those who just couldn't be satisfied with the stories and cases and were obsessed with Mulder and Scully getting together in an intimate relation*ship*.
Thanks Sky :)
You're welcome T.
Like Teresa, I don't understand the correlation b/w lesbianism, feminism and the ability to love (a man). Maybe this is not where we should discuss this, but it confuses me greatly.
My 'sometimes 't'' friend, I've never been able to take sides with Aaron and Haley. It has always just made me sad....I can either assign (some) blame on both or on neither. I vacillate with these two and in the end I'm just left with immense sadness.
Plus, strangely enough, I don't think Hotch ever chose his job over family; he just couldn't choose his family over his job (and job sounds like a cold word when I associate it with any of these characters - they give so much of themselves to it, the kindness in their eyes for the victims, their passion….it's not a job for any of these people. It is who they are). I don't think he even saw it as a choice he had to make, till Haley called him out as you said, t, because in his head and heart he'd always tried to do the best, 'both here and there'. And despite his passionate confidence about his ability to do the job (recall 'how do I know you favour your son? Because I'm good at my job'), I think every so often he feels that he can't do enough. His biggest fear is that he (they) cannot save everyone (I know I'm quoting one sick puppy). You may find this exceedingly odd, but despite his being seen as intimidating, I've never considered Hotch to be supremely self-confident. I don't know if he sets the bar too high for himself. But if you're fighting to save a life, is any bar too high? Same with his family - I just think he saw this aspect of his life as less 'urgent' or less a matter of life and death till Foyet happened. Maybe he realised too late how urgent it really was? Don't know. How do we define human beings or the relationships we forge?
That's why I can't even begin to fathom what kind of a woman would be 'right' for Hotch because, like any other real person, I don't quite know what kind of a man Hotch is and who he would be 'right' for. It is about reciprocity, isn't it? And madness - this guy joined a theatre group, wore an ugly hat, to meet a woman. Who knows what or who would do that to him, again, but we do know he is capable of being unimaginably un-Hotch-like….
I just don't see him as being dead from waist down, is all.
it's all a mindless ramble, so forgive me for going on like this :-)
Eleven (etc)
Does anyone have any idea what episode prentiss might return? I heard it might be mid-season. Gahhh I hope not! 3rd episode hopefully or 2nd. Lol.
Also I would like 2 see Emily having a nightmare about Doyle at the beginning of the episode and hotch having a nightmare about foyet at the end of the episode and a good quote about being intertwined with your friends at the end of the episode.
Then have hotch and Emily platonically decompress w/ each other in the next episode.
Also please no political issues/ discussions on here. Lol I'd like 2 respectfullly say this isn't the place. This is for solely CM. Don't bring politics into it or it'll get messy and we won't all be cool w/ each other anymore.
Yes I'm well aware I'm talking like we all kno each other personally but as gubegirl said and those of you who shared personal stories (sorry for what happened to you both btw) we are kinda like a weird nutty fanatical cm fanbase family so let's all get along.
Elevenses,
I hear you. I didn't mean to assign blame to Hotch about their relationship but neither can I blame Haley. She watched the man she fell in love with, who went to all those lengths to woo her, who obviously wasn't "always so serious" become consumed by his work all the while they were becoming parents. I remember a conversation he had with Gideon about being in a silent panic trying to be as good as he could be at home because he knew at any minute the phone could ring calling him back to work.
I hope he's not "dead from the waist down". Some sign of a raising from the dead so to speak would be good.
CMFAN11
You're right, this is not the place for political discussions. This is for indulgence in our craziness so that, at least in my case, I don't drive my friends mad. It's so much fun to go back and forth with equally nutty people and be understood.
It's good to have you on here. Are you the only male among us?
OK, guys, just got back from my workout. Keeping my sunglasses on, I took my sweaty self into the local CVS to get the Max Fitness with Shemar. Oh, my.
There are of a very serious Shemar doing his routines. I was forced to read some of it while drying not to drool-it was tough, I have to tell you. GFs, I strongly suggest you don your shades and run to the mag stand to take a peek.
Thanks for putting this on the blog, Jill, because I would not have seen it otherwise.
Did I mention that I got the last copy? Whew!! That would mean, HURRY!
On a more serious note, I am a tad uncomfortable with some of the "political" comments that we've seen in the last day or so, and I would rather be silly and see humor than go that direction.
I know we need things to talk about while we have no new shows but I would rather it continue to be having fun. I think that some of the others may feel the same?
And CMFan11: You are a breath of fresh air to we hard-core-CM lady fans who have been beleaguered by RN fans who can talk about NOTHING but. Let me give you a hug, because it's what I do:)
We have a good thing going here and it's going to get us thru the summer if Jill keeps giving us a fresh thread every now and then...:)
Have a great day everybody!
Thanks for all the kind words. I really wasn't looking for sympathy when I shared that. I'm at peace with all of it, but again thanks. I just hate to see people who are grieving or traumatized pigeon-holed into one specific type of behavior that is deemed acceptable or normal because that's not the case. It is very much about each individual so whatever they decided to do or not do with Hotch would be okay.
I've always been of the belief that it takes two people to destroy a marriage so I've never taken a side in the Haley and Hotch relationship. Neither was willing to compromise and yes, it was just sad because they clearly seemed as though they still loved each other.
I don't know about the shipping thing. I'm thinking they'll never go there with any of the characters, but I also think I'd be okay with anything they do with any of the characters as long as their personal lives were never shown on screen anymore than they are now.
Frankly Sky, I don’t know you or Cadbury and don’t really care if you interpret my words as a political push for shipping. As far as I’m concerned, it’s your political agenda to ensure that Paget and Thomas never have an opportunity to share their brilliant talent and engaging personalities together on screen; which would be a complete injustice and waste of talent and appeal. To have the showrunner/writers keep these incredible actors from sharing significant screen-time together simply because of the “shipping” boogeyman conjured up at every turn, is ridiculous.
I believe the scene should be between Hotch and Prentiss based on what’s transpired on the show in the past and maintaining continuity and meaning in the storytelling. I also would like to see Paget and/or the original actors be given the more dynamic dialogue and screen time rather than some inconsequential guest star.
If you misconstrue my being bothered by a scene of Hotch throwing up from a woman’s touch as an attack on Cadbury, you’re intentionally invoking negativity in order to support your baseless argument. I had nothing but kind words for Cadbury, but expressed concern about the scenario she painted as it related to Hotch. We don’t usually resort to attacking people personally on this blog, simply commenting on/debating the issues or positions that are made. My comments were specifically about the scenario, not Cadbury.
And to speculate about what Hotch would want or not want is really assigning rigid beliefs and feelings to the character that you can’t possibly know. Yes, the writers could eventually make him react that way; then again, they could make him more open and accessible to someone since it’s been more than three years since he and Haley have been apart. And as I said before, if the showrunner, writers, and Thomas decide they want to make the Foyet attack a rape, then that’s what it will be. You’re not the only one who’s experienced tragedy or knows someone who has. I wouldn’t presume that a friend’s reaction to a trauma is the only possible reaction to that situation. People respond to and handle things differently. I know someone who became an activist on the issue; others experience greater emotional distress.
In addition, my suggestion that Hotch decompress with Prentiss is just as realistic and reasonable as anyone else’s. I neither take it back or apologize for it and continue to maintain that position. And no one said that decompression should be sexual in nature. Far from it, they’ve both been through very harrowing experiences; their conversations should come from a position of mutual respect, shared experiences and friendship.
Personally, I wouldn't want for Hotch to be taken to even darker places than he's already been. The man has suffered enough. It's time to start bringing him back to life and that little glimpse of him and Rossi coaching Jack's soccer team was a good start. I'd much rather see 45 seconds of Hotch having a nice moment with his son or Prentiss or whoever than see 45 seconds of him suffering some more.
And while we're on the subject, I don't want to see Reid suffer anymore either.
Yes I might be.
althougg you'll unfourtanetly be seeing less on here in the comin months bc of
A) Schoo/college consumes my life.
B) I'm a tad bit worried this could end up on a background screening for a job sometime in the future and don't want my employer to think I am crazy. (I mean generally not just about a tv show) lol. Realisically they could interpret it that way and with my major it would affect my job oppurtunities
C) Between trying to be online less because of hackers, and FYI everybody I suggest you all go 2 google news and look search the article "ALERT: Job Screening Agency Archiving All Facebook", and (I'm about to delete mine mometarily) lol I'm very leary f the interent nowadays so I'm going oldschool and reading/going outdoors/ somethin else from now on. lol
PS: No offense ladies, not calling y'all old. That's pretty much disresptful so just had 2 clear that up
T, i didn't think you were assigning blame on either of them. I was agreeing with ya :-)
I don't like the word 'ship' - it makes it seem, how shall i put it, cheap. I have no bias either way. But i don't want it to devolve into silliness and, after S6, i'm not sure i trust the writers to handle it with any great maturity or sensitivity. That's my only fear. Apart from that, bring it on. I want all my ladies and lads to find happiness in whatever way they can with whomever they want. The poor things live in a dark world. Who are we to say they should be imprisoned there forever?
And if they can't find anyone for Hotch, just umm parcel him to despicable me, will ya?
What are your thoughts on the other guys and gals?
Eleven (etc) and while we're at it HUGS!
Excuse that my last post please
I'm am so embarassed! Good lord above, my paranoia kicked in bc I just read that article. Oops! Please ignore those paranoid paragraphs lol
BTW: y'all are w breath of fresh air as well, I look forward to discussing next season on here once it airs in September.
Later ladies, going to take my break from my stalking this blog. Be back later have a gear day guys.
@ teresea h:
I also use this 2 not drive my friends crazy, cool 2 have other fans to discuss my favorite show with.
Just for the record, when I said I preferred humor to any political talk, I was NOT referring to any shipping between Hotch and Prentiss or Hotch and Andi Swan as political. I thought someone was referring to sexual preferences with the lesbian talk and thought it unwise and inappropriate to discuss that here. Maybe I missed something or skimmed too fast but I am all for Hotch finding some love somewhere! That goes for all our team members who have such dark and depressing jobs. I don't want it to become a soap opera, we have already discussed that but a little love could go a LONG way and I have said that all along.
It the show is to be REAL and life-like - not all dead-like:) I say let someone, anyone, find a lover this season. It doesn't mean they can't still do their job and I don't care if it's BTS and they just hint that they are dating, I think it would be a natural, progessive move on the part of the writers.
Not to mention that it is long overdue.
I'm with you, sdwally, show us some love: )Now THAT would be refreshing---way more than firing and replacing some of our team....uh...let's not go there again...I want to forget all that.
I wouldn't mind seeing a little romance. It's only natural for people to want love in their lives, their not dead and honestly does anyone really want to be alone. Especially after all the horrible depraved things they see it would be nice to see they have some normalcy to come home to. Though I do agree w/ Gubegirl and would only like to see snippets or hear references in passing. The one thing I defiantly don't want to see is any romance between the characters. That just opens up a whole new can of worms. Such as how the team would react or if they broke up there would be the akwardness of working together. Even if they remain "friends" there will always be the proverbial elephant in the room. That being said if written correctly I think some hints at a romance might be nice.
E
I love the Romance between Garcia/Kevin. Though I didn't like how he practically disappeared during S6. I also wonder how he feel about the flirtation between Garcia/Morgan?
sdwally, I didn't misconstrue anything in your post as an attack on Cadbury. I actually had forgotten what she said about Hotch getting physically sick when I was writing my post. And I have no "baseless argument". LOL. I also don't have some political reason to not want Paget and Thomas to have scenes together, even though having the Hotch and Emily characters involved in an intimate relationship on the show isn't something I want.
In fact, I haven't liked one bit the strange way that the writers have kept Hotch and Prentiss so separated throughout all of season 6 to the point where they didn't interact AT ALL at a time when it would've been expected that they would because of professional reasons(during the spy arc). As her boss, Hotch should've had a scene with her during the spy arc.
I love the Kevin/Garcia relationship, but coming up with someone for Hotch is a lot more tricky. How do the writers choose someone that all the fans will like? And some fans don't want him with a woman. And some fans don't want him with anyone no matter what the gender simply because it would make them jealous since they want to fantasize having him for themselves. Yes, that might sound comical but it's no joke to them. I know someone who feels that way. So who do they pick for Hotch in order to prove he's "not dead down there"? And I really don't want to see more bad writing where Foyet's brutal attack on him just gets swept under the rug, btw. They can't just have him dating and smiling away like that never happened.
Even though my preferred pairing with Hotch is a same sex pairing (and I don't particularly like the word "slash"), I'm not completely opposed to a man/women pairing for him because it worries me, too, that he might be feeling really alone. And I don't know if I like the idea of Hotch just never having anyone ever again to share his life with. But if it's going to be a woman, it has to be someone super special. Someone like Teresa Lisbon in "The Mentalist". She is perfect for Patrick Jane and if they could find someone as likeable as her who clicked with Hotch and had that undeniable chemistry with him, then I would be for them being paired. I didn't think Andi Swan was the one for him. I didn't see any chemistry with them. It bugged me that Hotch spent the whole finale episode with her.
I do think the writers/showrunner will put Hotch with someone this season. And it will probably be someone I won't like.
Good evening, y'all!
Not sure if I'll be very coherent tonight (am I ever?!) as I hit the proverbial wall every Friday afternoon - getting up at 6am five days a week after a maximum of five hours kip ("sleep is for wimps" - too much to do) can't be maintained. Still feel wiped out after a three hour snooze after getting home. Bleugh!
I'd not proof-read and correct this to show you how cabbaged I am at present, but my pride won't let me!
Lots of interesting debate going on. I'd agree on keeping the political-type stuff out of it, after all, we're here for some light relief.
I'd also agree about people reacting differently to traumatic events and therefore there's no such thing as one specific reaction.
However, I don't see anything wrong with polite debate about the show & its characters - it would be boring if we all agreed with everything! I've said stuff on here, someone else as offered a different perspective and I've chewed on it and decided what they say makes more sense.
Remember though, it's often difficult on the internet to get exactly what you mean across. You can't rely on a person's tone or facial expression to gauge their mood/intention and some of us have a language barrier to contend with. ;-)) Hence I use a lot of smiley faces on here which I never really do elsewhere.
Remember as well, I did say earlier I NEVER set out to be offensive on here, it's not the way I operate. Anything ambiguous which slips through the edit will definitely not be unpleasant, it'll have been lost somewhere over the Atlantic! You'd *know* if I was being a mard-arse, folks...
;-))
Anyway, onto Sir Hotch of Hotchalot. I'd be very surprised to see him having a casual fling. Firstly, all his time is taken up by being a good dad to Jack and doing a demanding job. Secondly, I don't see casual liaisions as being his thing.
I wouldn't be adverse to seeing him in a new relationship, but I agree with those who said that he'd need to come to terms with a lot of stuff before that could comfortably happen. In addition, I wouldn't want it to detract from the cases - all we'd need to see is the occasional scene, we can fill in the rest.
As for decompressing, there's nothing to stop it being purely platonic! I'd like to see him & Prentiss open up to each other about what they've been through, it would be a good way of developing their characters further as well as making for some compulsive viewing. And, it certainly doesn't need to end in the horizontal lambada!!! ;-))
Finally, I still maintain I'd prefer not to see any of the team dipping their pen in the company ink. See the last part of Velandra's post for details! Been there, done that - awkward if it doesn't work out.
Although as for any of them having a total lovefest off screen with an "outside interest" - go on, fill your boots!
Personally I don’t think Hotch was raped by Foyet. I know that some fans thought about it, but I never got that impression (and Foyet never raped his victims). And I hope the writers won’t go down that way, Hotch deserves some calm and happiness now.
I really hope we won’t see romance on this show (and I don’t think Hotch and Prentiss share any kind of special bond).
I also don’t want to see their love life with someone outside of work, it’s better to leave that off screen and let he audience fill in the blank.
We already have Garcia and Kevin and JJ and Will, and for me it’s enough.
After Hotch was attacked by Foyet I really wanted to see Hotch and Reid having a discussion.
They were the only two on the team who had been through torture, I wanted Hotch to share his experience with Reid, and I wanted Reid to share his experience with Hotch.
We could have gotten nice scenes where they would have bonded.
Sadly, the writers never gave us that. I remember being deeply disappointed.
Now, if they have Hotch and Prentiss bonding over their shared experience, and once again leave Reid out of the equation, I’ll be more than disappointed by their choice.
And the scene where Prentiss is tortured by Doyle has a LOT in common with the scene where Reid is tortured by Hankle.
But what I really want to see is more scenes between Hotch and Reid in the future.
Just need to clarify my last point:
I'm quite happy to know team members may be romantically involved with someone outside work, but we don't need to see it very often. The occasional reference a la Garcia & Kevin would suffice.
I have no objection to anyone on the team finding romance, I think it's healthy, but I wouldn't like it to be between team members.
To me, Hotch is the pentultimate boss. He is correct in every way and I can't see him sleeping with one of the agents he supervises. That doesn't seem like Hotch to me.
As far as them all being friends I can see that. I can't really see Hotch letting his team see him 'decompress' unless perhaps it's Rossi. And I can't agree that the writers are abandoning the skills of two great actors because Hotch and Emily don't have a sexual relationship. They can still have wonderful and powerful scenes together, just as all the team members do.
I don't recall seeing kevin at all last season except for the finale. am i wrong?
Blimey: Every day I am googling or Binging a word you use. Today it is "kip" yesterday or the day before you used a word like "minget" or "minger" and I would like you to to define them for me, s'il vous plait?
Velandra:I have asked that question re: Morgan & Garcia sev. times and no one ever takes up the debate. WTH is w/ them, him with his head in her lap watching TV (pic on this blog), them w/ arms around ea other coming out of the theater with Reid and AS, etc? and MARCIA: I believe you are right. We did not see Kevin 'til the end ( & the ref to him when she brought in the cupcakes for AS's grad) and that's another reason I was getting suspicious about the PG/DM thing. I like the constant sexual banter - I would miss this if it were to go away. They are champs at this. I for one would not like to see it come to any fruition, ya know? Him maybe (or maybe not?) hooking up with Tamara was OK with me. But if PG truly loves Kevin (she said so during this season) why does she have her mitts on Morgan...(esp. when we all want to ourselves??!!!)
I am not a proponent of getting involved w/ a co-worker; Blimey said it and I am totally with her: SO-O-O awkward, both during and usually for sure after...a-a-g-g-h-h-h do not want to go back there...
Def do not see Hotch with another man. 'Nuf said. No offense to anyone here--I'm sure that he is quite attractive to both sexes as are Reid and Morgan but do not care to discuss that. I think we all found Andi Swan to be a likable, attractive lady and a great agent and so she comes to mind. Nothing more; at least not for me. The British agent he had formerly "liaised" with from Scotland Yard in "Mayhem" and "100" seemed to have some chemistry w/him but I did not like her. Even tho' she resembled Haley alot. Maybe BECAUSE she resembled Haley alot:)
I agree with whomever suggested he needs a strong woman who can take control at home...this way, he can release, decompress, let go, whatever, because he puts his all into the job. I cannot blame Haley for leaving him, many women would, but I can identify with that because I am married to a man who is married to his work as well. Some get used to being alone and others never do. Why do you think I spend so much time ranting here?? :)
BTW, I don't know where the idea came from, but I was never under the impression that Haley was cheating on him...maybe never even dated anyone after the split. IMO.
I would dearly LOVE to see personal moments between team members re: shared experiences, like Hotch and Reid or Hotch and Prentiss re: their tortures, etc. Doubt we will see all three but we can cross our fingers for even one? It would be so totally NATURAL given what the three of them have been thru. You could throw Morgan into that mix with his treatment by Billy Flynn and former and subsequent experience with Ellie's dad (blanking at his name and he's only too famous:) and Ellie. Maybe Garcia after being shot...not unlikely she could suffer some PTSD also.
Getting late, my dogs are hungry and there is walking to be done before dinner prep.
Have a good nite, y'all.
(Don't be thinnin' I'm Texan or anythin', Blimey, because I am orig. from Michigan and grew up in Arizona! Hah! I only sit on a chesterfield and run my garbuerator because I am married to a Canadian...)
Elevenses,
Hugs to you too.
I do think that Hotch and Prentiss could have a good freindship/mutual support relationship. I would like to see more of Rossi being a sounding board for Hotch over a good Scotch. Preferable to him helping coach Jack's soccer team. I really don't want to see any in-house romance. Garcia and Kevin don't really fit in that category. It would take up too much energy and if they didn't devote a lot of time to it, would become the elephant in the room. I'm also afraid the whole thing would become too much of a soap opera. Other people have said this too; Hotch is just too responsible to start a relationship with one of his team. The whole idea of something between him and Emily or anyone on the team, male or female, would just seem incestous to me, given that both the actors and the characters have been together so long at this point.
At some level my heart and parts south would like to see something but my head says a resounding "NO"
By all means give them all some romantic outlets but let us just have glimpses.
Even let them play now and then. I loved that scene, I don't remember the episode, where JJ, Emily and Garcia are in a bar and they have fun at the expense of an arrogant male FBI agent, it was so well done, didn't take up too much time or energy but gave us a little window into their out of the office lives.
I really find it hard to imagine who Hotch could be with. I could see him with Andi Swan. I don't think he'd want a one night stand with someone and neither do I see him looking for a marraige partner right now, I think everything might still be too raw to go there.
But I could see him in an exploratory relationship with a woman who would be his equal. I was going to write "or maybe even a man" but the more I think about I definitely see him as straight. He married young or at least entered into a long term relationship while still very young. Now he's been through the wringer, he might be ready for a relationship with a woman (he's still straight) who is independent and with whom he could explore what the adult/non Dad side of Hotch wants.
I say all this and I still know I don't want it to have too much focus on the show. This is not a show about relationships, it's not character centered, it's about this team of heroes, whose flaws are there in the background but not on full display, who profile and capture bad guys
Got a copy of that mag. with Shemar on the cover at Walgreens. It's not for me but a friend. Her first love on the show is Reid/MGG and then Shemar. I couldn't find GQ when photos of MGG were in it. So this is the next best thing.
The young woman at the checkout said "oh, I know who that is. I love Morgan". I mentioned my love for TG/Hotch but I think it went right over her head
Sorry,
The Cab. Sauv. is at work. I tried to show my friend some of those cute photos/videos of MGG from Monaco but her computer is just way too slow. It's great, she's the only one of my friends anxious to hear what I know about CM. I don't tell her the full extent of my obsession though.
Gubegirl: I think the Kevin Lynch character not being included in the show had more to do with Nicholas' real life personal problems. He had drug/alcohol problems and was in rehab I think. But, I could be wrong haha.
Heyya : thanks for your comment and I could certainly use more Reid next season too.
I want my genius who can outsmart everyone back ! I hope season seven will let Reid shine multiple times with that big brain of his.
Concerning romance : while romance is certainly a natural thing(and we know our protagonists are certainly not immune) I don’t think we need to see it.
We know it’s there for them (at least from time to time), but seeing romance doesn’t interest me.
I much prefer seeing scenes where the team is bonding together, at least I can relate to those characters in a way I could never relate to an outside character who’s there for romance purposes.
I won’t care much about a new character whose sole purpose is to be the love interest of one of the main character.
So, the scenes between that new character and one of the hero will totally fail to give me that warm feeling and that sense of closeness I get when I see scenes between the team members ( the scenes at the bar in ‘The Big Game’, the end of ‘The Instincts’ at the restaurant, the scenes with Prentiss, JJ and Garcia at the bar with Brad the real FBI agent,…).
I’m also pretty sure all the fans have different ideas about what kind of person the team members should be dating. A big part of the fans will inevitably end up disappointed by what they’ll see because they won’t adhere to the writer’s choice.
Add to that the fact that the team member in question would probably have to meet his/her love interest while on a case (once again….) and it’s a big no for me.
I’m happy thinking that our team members already have relationships outside of work and I do not want to see the writers take on this.
As for Hotch bonding with either Prentiss and Reid, maybe we could have some scenes with both (and a scene between Prentiss and Reid...they did share pretty similar stuff on the department torture like it was pointed out).
But I have to admit that I would prefer to see scenes featuring interactions between Hotch and Reid.
It has been lacking since the beginning of season four, and we saw they have a wonderful relationship, we should see it more in my opinion.
@ Gubegirl:
I agree I couldn't see hotch w/ another guy, no offense to anyone just my personal opinion.
Also I'd like 2 see bonding moments trickled throughout the season btw prentiss, hotch, and Reid at one point or another.
And why is JJ so immune to be captured? Don't get me wrong I love her but it would be interesting to see how she handled it, and be really cool if she got out of it alone. That's something you never see in tv, if written right it could be a positive moment that would rock bc it's so unexpected
Once again just my opinion.
Btw gubegirl, don't hate on us texans lol jk and I love your predication of a Texan accent. It's pretty on dead on. I'd tweak it if I could but you can't do that over the net lol and lastly here's a virtual hug since I owe u one from earlier lol
Correction: impersonation not predacation lol oops
Karen! Where have you been, GF?
I wanted to put a shout out to you yesterday when it started to get a bit too serious on here! I was going to yell: Karen: what did CBS ever say about our soundtrack? It's been months since you requested further info and we may just have to start talking music again on here...we certainly can't start Obama bashing or anything to pass the time (no political talk, we already decided:) LOL
Anyway, I'm brainstorming about something that could help us get thru the next three months: taking turns posing our fave scene and the corresponding song that was memorable; when we hear that song, we think of that scene, or the other way around, ya know what I mean? LMK what you heard or if they 'nored you. We may have to sic Blimey on them... she's a pistol and can make sparks fly:)
Re: Kevin: did not know that, you very well could be right, the timing was surely strange for him to show up so late in the season.
Teresa H: yeah, right, you got the mag for your friend..actually I did the same thing with the one GNC May issue of Muscle & Body and mailed it to my GF in No. Van (Canada) only to have her e-mail me that there is a mailstrike going on! She's bumming while dying to see it!
Don't be thinking you missed MGG in GQ. That was a misleading bit of info I picked up while trolling and picked up someone who spoke poor English; she meant that the pics LOOKED GQ and they certainly do - they are SO good and he looks super. I ended up finding them again on MrPorter.com, an on-line men's clothing website. It was end of May and maybe they are still there; it was called Matthew Gray Gubler/The Look/The Journal. He has a little facial hair going on but much more clean cut than in Monaco. There is also an interview and several quotes, so try and find it. What a cutie he is. I would "adopt" him in a minute but won't admit to much else:) He was in Vanity Fair the prev month, but I think you already know that and the pics were kinda cute but not good enuf for me to buy it. (What restraint...sometimes I amaze myself...
CMFan11: We can't let JJ get captured; not bc she could not get away but because she's a mom of a little guy and the writers wouldn't go there...I don't think. Glad you agree that Hotch is a straight shooter. Don't you go thinnin' I'm dissin' Texas, 'acause my son-in-law is from there, which prob'ly explains my recent ability to talk like one...hah! Don't know who/what jk is tho'? Clue me in, guy. And, TY 4 the hug back.
G'nite, y'all.
@ gubegirl
I think people got the impression that Haley was cheating when in In Birth and Death the phone rang, Hotch answered and no one said anything. He hung up and then Haley's cell rang in her purse and she didn't answer it. When their conversation was over she left with her purse. Whether that meant she was cheating or not, I don't know, but I think that's where the idea came from.
Sitting on the chesterfield and listening to the garberater eh!! What can I say, we Canadians...
Ahhhh, Saturday morning - how I adore thee!
The Morgan-Garcia banter thing. There's a fair few of us where I work who indulge in similar. It's very flirty, the ivory tower dwellers probably wouldn't approve but it's purely for a laugh and nobody crosses any lines.
Most of the men involved are married/in long-term relationships, as are the women. It's just a way of lightening the mood and nobody ever offends anyone else (I think any of us would be mortified if we offended someone). Hard to explain.
As for the touchy-feely stuff, I suppose it depends on lots of things - we don't do that, but then it's the workplace. Outside work? I wouldn't snuggle/link arms with a man I wasn't involved with or didn't fancy (unless he was gay!) in case he got the wrong idea that I fancied him - that could be so awkward. Although as a nation we're supposed to be repressed, it may be different in other countries?!
The other thing I wondered about Hotch... If he was attracted to another woman (I agree, I see him as straight based on the "evidence") I think he'd feel as if he was cheating on Haley just by *thinking* about having a dabble**.
I could see him with someone *like" Andi Swan, who would understand the demands of the job. Or, in complete contrast, a stay at home mom who would be happy to look after Jack while Hotch is out chasing unsubs.
As for that Limey bird who got blown up... I agree she looked like Haley, perhaps he was subconsciously attracted to that? Whatever the situation, she was a walking (well, not for long...) stereotype who wound me up.
(For 14 years I lived 20 miles from London city centre. Very few people speak like that and those that do get the you know what ripped out of them by everyone else. I can parody it - goes down a treat when we're winding up the Londoners who dared get a job at ours...).
@ Gubegirl:
I've always harboured a secret (well, not any more) hankering for getting me a Canadian husband one day - I think it was my addiction to "Due South" during my teenage years. Handsome bloke in a nice uniform (?!?) & an extremely cute pooch - I was quite smitten. If he owns a maple syrup factory, even better.
If I come out with any random words, Urban Dictionary is the place to go. I use it if I hear anything random on American/Aussie shows, although I'm not bad at guessing the meanings from the context.
**Dabble = In this sense I mean to get involved with. Doesn't necessarily mean for them to be going all the way!
"Are they dabbling?" means "Are they involved?" which could cover any part of the spectrum from phoning each other right across to a bit of how's your father (I'll let you work that one out).
Kip = Sleep.
Mard-arse = Bad-tempered/sulking.
Minger (oh, how I adore that word!!!) = Ugly as sin; the complete antithesis of SM on that magazine cover. The gym I go to is full of them (mingers, not SM clones) and is representative of much of the male population of England. Seriously. I think it's the milk bottle flesh and mousey hair thing - torpedoes my boat.
Anyway, I'm off out in a bit so need to get ready - I think I'll be substituting the sandals for boots and a brolly...
Just to clarify something after a re-read post-publish:
I don't hit on gay blokes, that would be a waste of my time! One of my bloke buds from university is gay, we'd link arms on boozy nights out but obviously there was no chance of mixed signals and we certainly didn't fancy each other! ;-))
gubrgirl,
Thanks for the heads up on those MGG photos. I'll try to track them down. I really did get the mag. for a friend. Shemar is one very good looking guy, those abs are a sight to behold but he just doesn't float my boat like TG.
Matthew is definitely a cutie, I'll vouch for you as a good adoptive mom when the time comes.
Very interesting discussions going on right now. If I might add my two cents, whatever little they might be worth in times like these.
Re: Hotch being raped by Foyet: At the moment, canon is that he wasn’t raped by Foyet. It happened two years ago and it has never been mentioned or hinted at, except maybe that odd comment Foyet made to Hotch in “100” about being gentle with Haley like he had been with Hotch. Profile based on past M.O. suggests that Foyet wouldn’t do that to a man. He never raped his victims, let alone his male ones. He seemed to be focused on – preferably blonde – girls in their late teens. I do think that Hotch definitely feels psychologically raped and of course the stabbing as a substitute for the act itself could be interpreted as a form of rape too. But I don’t think an actual sexual act is – at the moment – supported by canon. What I think is that the producers/writers were pondering a possible storyline of Hotch being sexually assaulted too and that’s why they shot the scene in a suggestive way to leave themselves all options open. If they’d decided to go “there” it wouldn’t have been contradicted by what was shown onscreen. It’s just that they decided to drop the possible storyline, likely because it really would’ve been a bit too much.
Re Morgan/Garcia: I like their banter, including sexual innuendo, if it’s not overdone that is. But I don’t think we are really supposed to think it might lead to something between them. And it shouldn’t. I am strongly against in-team romances. Basically, I’m happy with not seeing any romance onscreen at all. The occasional mention of them going out with someone would be completely sufficient for me (i.e. Rossi when he showed up for a briefing in a tux right from a date). As for the touchy-feely aspect of Morgan/Garcia, I think it’s just normal for them. It’s how they are with each other. Heterosexual people of the opposite sex can go arm in arm without a meaning to it other than friendship, IMO. It can mean something more, but it doesn’t have to. I think Morgan loves Garcia deeply, platonically, he even might find her attractive, but I don’t think for a moment he would consider a relationship with her that goes beyond friendship. Garcia might have a little crush on Morgan (who wouldn’t? ), but I also like to think she really loves Kevin. She would never say that if she didn’t mean it.
Re Hotch and romance: As I said, I’m not overly keen on seeing a romance develop onscreen. For no one of the characters. And for Hotch it might be a bit too early anyway. He needs to deal with his feelings of guilt and grief first. But then I think he would pursue another serious relationship eventually (agree with those who don’t see him as the type for meaningless flings or one-night stands). However we don’t need to see that onscreen. Elizabeth explained it best. Excluding in-team romances – a big no-go for me personally – that woman would have to be someone from outside. A new character introduced with the sole purpose of being the love interest. Someone most of us likely would have a hard time to feel connected with, especially since we all have our own image of what kind of woman would be best for Hotch. I personally don’t see him with someone who works in the same field. He needs someone he can talk to about completely different things with, someone who isn’t jaded from seeing all these horrible things. Someone who can bring light to his and Jack’s life. I also don’t think it has to be a home woman who is able to devote all of her time to care for Jack and Hotch. How is that possible anyway? Most available women age appropriate for Hotch (meaning no 16 years olds) who are either single, divorced or widowed, would have a job and I personally would not like seeing them giving it up. That would just create more problems. See, that’s my very own take on who I think would be suited for Hotch. Each of you has different views, so it’s almost impossible for the writers to create a character we would all accept.
Hey gubegirl! Sorry I've just been working ALOT and had to study for the GRE for grad school haha. I still havn't heard anything from CBS records. I'm beginning to think they are ignoring me. I was going to try and mention it again to Erica in the chat tonight if we get the opportunity to ask questions again. But unfortunately I will be working 11-8. I think it may be time to to Blimey at them haha.
@ Luma M
I agree with everything you said and couldn't have said it better so I'll just choose to agree.
Omg your right gubegirl I completely forgot she was a mother! Oops lol we'll I'll be happy if she gets to be a badass and shoot someone again. Lol that'll work for me, just as long as she's still the nuturer if the team. Granted she'll be a bit tougher after working w/ the big cahunas at the state department and liasing with some people from Langley as well.
My thoughts on Hotch/Foyet. I do remember being puzzled by what Foyet might have meant in that exchange. At the time I put it down to him screwing with Hotch's mind. But haven't we always heard from our profilers that stabbing is a subsistute for penetration/rape. Perhaps that's what it means to him. The act of stabbing was the sexual assault and of course we saw that in no was he gentle with Hotch. So Hotch was well aware what awaited Haley. Now I'm not remembering that he stabbed her but rather shot her. She was bleeding but it did not look like multiple stab wounds and then there was that shot that everyone heard. Is that correct?
There I go again with the wrong name.
Theresa: yes foyet shot her which I always found odd b/c he always stabbed the women. Maybe he wanted hotch to be able to hear it? I'm not really sure anyone have any ideas?
Almost forgot ....
Gubegirl: I love the scene/song idea. I already have two favs. In mind. It would be really interesting to see what everyone elses favs are.
Hey, guys, just wanted to let you know I won't be up for crackin' any jokes or discussing good music for awhile. We lost our Welsh terrier this A.M. after she woke us up at 5:30 having multiple severe seizures. The vet thought it was very likely she had a brain tumor given her state and rec. we put her down which we did. Jazzy would have been 14 on 8/1/2011 and we gave her a very good life (mother-hen that I am) but I am bawling my eyes out and have a horrible headache after crying so much.
Despite having little seizures for some time now, she was still eating well (homemade dog food, of course) and was sniffing out gopher holes during our walk last nite, so we know she was not suffering. But had she had a seizure w/ no one around, she could have injured herself and that would have caused her more risk/harm.
Have a good wkend everyone.
Theresa: yes foyet shot her which I always found odd b/c he always stabbed the women. Maybe he wanted hotch to be able to hear it? I'm not really sure anyone have any ideas?
I always got the impression that the gunshot was just for Hotch's sake and that he never really shot her, but did her in with a knife. There was blood all over the house and it looked as though she was trying to either run to protect Jack or trying to get away from him. If he'd shot her in the living room and just drug her up the stairs for Hotch to find her I doubt there would've been blood all over her feet and blood pooled in her throat. Plus, when Strauss was reading the coroner's report she said her aorta was severed so she didn't suffer much and you don't typically think of bullets when you hear about a wound like that. It's possible he shot her once in some non-fatal way and she ran up the stairs and then he just shot her in the heart to hurry things up because he knew Hotch was on the way.
Foyet shot a lot of people, including Haley, the wife of the older couple he stopped, the man with the flat tire, and the several people on the bus. He was simply more likely to use the knife on teenage female victims because that was who he was sexually attracted to. He might have shot Haley so Hotch could hear it and because he surmised he wouldn't have time to torture her before Hotch got there. Of course he also used a knife on Hotch to humiliate him and to attack him specifically through his identity as a profiler. It wasn't a literal rape, but all the creepy sexual overtones marked it as a psychological one.
Gubegirl: I am so sorry to hear about your dog. My condolences to you and your family. I had my cat for 17 yrs. I lost her last year, I remember how hard it was.
sf: that makes alot more sense than him just shooting her.... Thanks
(Long comment ahead, part 1/3!)
I have to admit, after creeping people out the other day I've been a little scared to check back on the discussions here, but it's all okay! Phew! Just a lot of interesting discussion, it's great. FYI, I don't feel attacked by anybody. :)
@gubegirl
I don't mind talking about what happened to me online - I hang out at a few feminist and pro-victim forums, and I'm so used to seeing people online talking about their experiences I'm always surprised when people on other forums are surprised that I'd be prepared to bring it up in conversation. I'm all about trying to alleviate the shame that victims of sex crimes can feel after their attacks, and talking (relatively) openly about it online is one way to try and do that. The only thing that bothers me about it these days is the thought that I might inadvertently trigger somebody, and if I've done so here, I apologise wholeheartedly.
@Elevenses
that would be a freaky good scene (please i don't want to inadvertently offend anyone by calling it 'good'), but does the Minds writers have the guts to go there i wonder. They tend to pussyfoot around some major issues.
It would be a fantastic scene and as a screenwriter I am, of course, convinced that I could write the ever-living s*** out of it. I might write it anyway, in a fangirly sort of way and for my own amusement. :D
My guess is they don't have the guts to go there at all. I'd love it if they did, not because I want to see Hotch suffer or because I'm just so emotionally invested in my interpretation or anything but just because ... in terms of male victim awareness and advocacy, it would be amazing to see that issue crop up on such a big show, with a character like Hotch facing up to it. And I don't want to forget Morgan in this, either - it would be amazing to see two strong, successful, intelligent guys acknowledging a... not a shared experience, because their experiences are wholly different, but it would give them an unwanted sense of kinship and add another layer of conflict to their relationship.
@Glynnis
Overall, I agree with you about Foyet's attack/rape and could certainly see natural desires being deeply sublimated as a result of that.
I agree with this so hard. I can absolutely see Hotch falling in love again and would even like to see it happen on-screen (as long as it's done in a Garcia/Kevin way - CM ain't a soap opera!). I just want to see some acknowledgement of what he went through with Foyet. Even if they choose not to reference the Foyet attack as a sexual attack, he still has the physical scars to confront. He'll still need to explain them to his partner of choice. I don't think Hotch will get physically intimate with anybody until he's psychologically up to discussing what happened out loud. I sometimes wonder, what did he tell Jack the first time Jack saw him get out of the shower, or the first time Jack walked into his bedroom at night? I'd like to see that scene in season seven, too. (Although something about the scene in 6x06 "Devil's Night" between the unsub and his son makes me think that Jack and Hotch have already had that conversation off-screen. Just the way Hotch reacted to the boy touching his father, you know?)
I also agree with you on who gets to off Doyle. I'll feel cheated if it isn't Emily. She's badass, why wouldn't she be the one to handle it?
(Part 2/3)
@sdwally
to think that the slightest touch of a woman’s hand on his would make Hotch hurl his lunch really bothers me.
Well, it wouldn't be a scene designed to inspire comfort in the audience. It's not a comfortable proposition at all. Sometimes writers have to go to the dark places.
I will say that I don't envisage this scene as "Hotch being disgusted by a woman" or "Hotch unable to handle being hit on". It would be... Hotch suddenly forced to confront the prospect of intimacy and what it means in terms of explaining those scars to any intended lover. That conversation would be a very intimate, very vulnerable situation for him. He'd have to expose himself to somebody who isn't Hayley, and he wouldn't feel entirely in control; it would be frightening for him. He'd be angry, too, at being forced by Foyet to have to contemplate having the conversation with all. So it's not so much Hotch being unable to handle being hit on - it's more Hotch being temporarily unable to handle being hit on that time, because it's the first time after Foyet.
And, you know, this is just my wish-list, never gonna happen fantasy scene! Maybe he takes Jack to school in the mornings and gets hit on every day by all the single moms and it's not a problem for him at all. Who knows! I'd also love to see a scene like that, because there's great comic value to it.
@Sky
Foyet really couldn't have used more clear dialogue as far as what he was going to do to Hotch in that scene.
For me, there's one other thing that leads me to think Hotch became a sexual obsession for Foyet: the wording of Foyet's letter to Shaunessy in Omnivore. If I remember rightly, it contained the words "until death do us part", a marriage vow. Foyet got off on Shaunessy's faithfulness, and he was faithful in return. Hotch didn't just refuse to make a deal, he rejected a proposal. That's the subtext we're dealing with. And Hotch didn't see it because ... why would he, when serial stabbing is so often indicative of impotence and a substitute for sex? When Foyet's stabbing victims were all, until that point, female?
I'm not necessarily arguing that this was conscious on Foyet's part. In a way, I think conscious desire on Foyet's part denies the complexity of the fascination he felt for Hotch. I do think that fascination may have manifested sexually, however.
@Elevenses (again!)
I don't think Hotch ever chose his job over family; he just couldn't choose his family over his job
I think that's a perfect way to describe it, absolutely perfect. And I know what you mean about "job" being the wrong word - maybe "vocation" is better? How about "calling"? That gives it an almost religious overtone, which I don't think Rossi would object to. But I think it fits, if we go with the Arthurian analogy TPTB spout. Our boys and girls are constantly in pursuit of the Holy Grail - catch all the killers, save all the victims, perfection. That high bar. And, of course, the great tragedy is that they will never, ever succeed.
(Part 3/3! Phew!)
@Sky (again!)
In fact, I haven't liked one bit the strange way that the writers have kept Hotch and Prentiss so separated throughout all of season 6
I'm less inclined to blame the writers and more inclined to blame scheduling necessities. Paget's contract was reduced; I think the writers were probably forced to choose between a) little character moments between Prentiss and the others, and b) doing their best to keep her a consistent presence through as many episodes as possible. If I know one thing about the shooting process, it's that you can only work with what you've got, whether that's broken equipment or limited access to a cast member, and do your job regardless.
@gubegirl (again!)
BTW, I don't know where the idea came from, but I was never under the impression that Haley was cheating on him...maybe never even dated anyone after the split. IMO.
I get it from 3x02, the scene when they're at home and Hotch is working on the Milwaukee case in the living room (I was like, "Not in the living room with your little boy on the loose! Go to the study, Hotch, jeez!") and Hayley catches him at it. The house phone rings, Hotch answers, whoever it was hangs up, then Hayley's cell rings immediately after. The way that whole scene is directed and shot, the way it's played ... Hotch knows, Hayley knows he knows, but they both choose not to acknowledge their mutual knowledge. Hayley because she knows Hotch won't confront her, and Hotch because, well, he's probably been "warned off" profiling her in previous fights! And because he doesn't want to believe it.
This is one of the things I love about CM, all of the unspoken moments. Like that moment at the end of "Tabula Rasa" when Cece is hitting on him, and he totally brushes her off - I love Reid's look! He's like, "Does Hotch not know she's hitting on him? Why is he doing that? Interesting!" And if Reid's not thinking that there's just no other reason for TPTB to even edit Reid's reaction shot into the sequence. Love it!
@CMFAN11
That's something you never see in tv, if written right it could be a positive moment that would rock bc it's so unexpected
OMG. Your comment reminded me. Have you ever watched Fringe? I remember the first time I saw Olivia Dunham get captured and actually rescue herself, I just about jumped for glee. You're so right, we almost never see female characters rescue themselves. I didn't even realise I was waiting for her knight in shining armour to arrive until she was up and away.
And to everybody who offered well-wishes, I want to say a very big THANK YOU. :D And my condolences to people who have suffered and are suffering now. Sky, I was particularly sorry to read about your friend. How terrible for her. And Sf8, I'm sorry for your loss. :(
Gubegirl, I'm so sorry to hear about your dog. :(
Cadbury, my friend ended up doing really well. She ended up becoming a very successful doctor, and got married.
I think your theory about Foyet's deal with Shaunessy as being like marriage vows and Hotch rejecting those vows is fascinating.
Cadbury: Looking to distract myself from my crying jags and am lurking. Can't resist. Am remembering the scene with the phone calls and my memory was that the house phone rang; Hotch and Haley looked at ea. other (I had it in my head it was for him - that Hotch was getting a work call) and when no one picked up, they called his cell and then, Hotch gave Haley another kinda resigned look and she looked exasperated and he took the call then said he must go. I did not realize that it was Haley's cell ringing. I must go back and watch this. ( When I'm not bawling and can see clearly.)
TY for all your sympathies here, Velandra and Sky, I truly appreciate it. It is so very hard to make the decision to end a life and I cannot get the vision of Jazzy on our laps this AM while being euthanized out of my minds' eye but even before they administered the drug, she relaxed for the first time in over an hour, looked at my son and blinked sev times at him as if to say "It's OK, Josh, you guys have given me a good life & thanks for loving me and letting me sleep on your bed all these years..." She was from the owner of the local Terrier rescue, and the woman told us, "she can't wait to sleep on somebody's bed." And she was right, and we let her even tho our prev dog always slept in the kitchen in his crate. At least that's what I keep telling myself she was trying to say. God, now I'm bawling again and can't see, gotta go.
Assuming the Erica Messer chat went ahead? And still hoping for a transcript or synopsis. ;-))
**Widens big blue eyes, smiles sweetly & holds out big tray of cyber earthquake cake**
For what it's worth, I personally don't think Hotch was raped by Foyet in the literal sense of the word. However, I think Foyet wanted to violate him and give Hotch a permanent reminder of him, in this case in the form of scars from the multiple stab wounds inflicted.
I have never been stabbed nor suffered any form of sexual assault (and I hope I'll go to my grave with that unchanged) so can only try to imagine how someone who's experienced either of these traumas would feel. My (educated?) guess is violated - both physically and mentally, which is how I imagine Hotch to feel. But I could be wrong.
@ Gubegirl:
So sorry to hear about your pooch, I'm not very good at knowing what to write in these circumstances. It sounds like you gave her a fabulous long life (sniffing out gophers and coming home to a home-cooked meal sounds great to me, and I'm not of the canine persuasion!) and it's wonderful she enjoyed it right to the end.
My friend's Staffie died in very similar circumstances three years ago and the vet said he wouldn't have been aware what was happening, which we were all grateful for. He was an old rescue dog who'd been dumped, but he was spoilt rotten for his last couple of years.
Not everyone realises pets are members of the family - my Garfield clone is now ten and I can't imagine life without him. I'm leaving him at Chateau Parents while I'm away this summer and am already having a massive guilt trip over it, even though Mum will pander to his every whim!
On the subject of kitties, I was at a friend's place this afternoon and that marvellous Cravendale milk advert I mentioned a few threads ago came on TV. My friend then informed me that it's none other than TIM CURRY doing the voice over. I hope he's invested in a toothbrush and a bottle of Listerine since his CM role?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6CcxJQq1x8
@ CMFAN11:
We also caught an episode of "Man v. Food" which was in Texas. The presenter managed to eat some small but deadly burger called the Four Horsemen which had various evil peppers/chillis in it! There was also some place which did these amazing looking 3.5lb cinnamon rolls - I'd have had a damn good go at polishing off one of those beauties...
Hmmm....
Dharma and Greg?
Never saw that show. It looked lame.
I'm not the biggest Gibson fan in the world, but I was glad to see him sign.
Admittedly, I was happier to see Shemar sign, as I feel his character is vital too the show. I could have watched without Hotch, but absolutely not without Morgan.
There isn't another character like his, and aside from the rest of the team, his adds way more flavor than Hotch.
Yeah, Hotch is the "head guy," but I honestly don't give his character much thought. I've even had to change the channel in the past, so meh.
Maybe this season will interest me more. Season 6 sure made me more of a fan than before. I was a spotty watcher during the first few seasons.
Good for him. ^_^
Now, to get Shemar, Kirsten, and Gub a bigger pay raise! =D
My family is back together again! Here's hoping Morgan keeps his word and goes after Doyle, spattering his brains all over the walls and finding Emily! :D
I was hoping to see Rossi in charge :(
Anon under blimey limey: out of curiosity what was it about S6 that you liked so much? It is my least fav. Season. I found the characters OOC the writing and storyline continuity sub par at best. Also it seemed there was alot less profiling this season. IMO that is what set it apart from other shows. Then I wasn't to keene on all the big name guest stars. I think this show holds it's own w/o having to pull the look who we got this week card. They've used lesser name actors and even unknowns and it has worked just as well if not better. I feel that for a moment CM turned into the unsub show (as others in previous threads have stated). I really didn't like knowing who the unsub was before opening credits either. I've never changed a ep. of CM before this season and at times I didn't even watch. Sorry for rambling I just found this season lacking in so many ways I really am curious as to what you enjoyed.
Because the episodes before were too Gideon and Hotch centered.
What about Rossi, JJ, Prentiss, and Morgan?
Morgan's my fave...so is Garcia. Love them to bits. With there being tons of Morgan in Season 6, it automatically became my favorite season, of course, Season 5 being up there too since Morgan got to run the BAU for a while.
There was alot of action, excitement, chills, it was just so compelling and captivated my attention.
The profiling aspect alone has began to bore me. There's only so long that you can watch the same thing and not get bored with it, ala all of the Hotchner drama got boring real quick.
I enjoyed the Prentiss arc, and I'm still anxiously awaiting a Morgan arc. Not some subpar storyline where he plays second fiddle to Hotch's character like they did in Season 5. Something that puts him at the top, where he is the main focus.
Criminal Minds will lack until that happens.
Velandra: ahem, not a CMF, my dear, so, don't engage. Take a deep breath and think about the music/scenes. Let's hear about those faves of yours...:)
Have a good nite, y'all.
Oh Gubegirl, I'm so very sorry for your loss... I'm sure you gave her the best life she could have and vice-versa...(a big hug for you).
As for the non-CMF - taking a deep breath and walking away. Life's too short.
Part of the problem with the way Hotch is written is the writers have almost caricatured him as a monk or a saint, who is devoid of sexual interest since his divorce and after Haley’s death. I don’t know too many men like that, that includes some priests as has been well-documented.
I don't know as it's so much that as the fact that screen time is precious, and they wouldn't spend it showing Hotch having a random hookup just to be showing it. The same is true for Morgan -- we see him flirting with the ladies to establish the character, but they don't dwell because we get it. If they threw a prospective romantic interest at Hotch -- who would probably politely rebuff her at this point -- it would be a mechanism to get him to confront the trauma he's suffered from Foyet's attack and the loss of Haley. Until and unless they want to launch that storyline, there's not much point.
I would like to see Hotch decompress with Prentiss because they not only have shared experiences; there is a contextual reference/background already established from past storylines. In Nameless Faceless, Prentiss was the one who worried about him, sought him out, found him and asked him if he wanted to discuss what happened to him. In Haunted Prentiss was the one who picked him up, brought him home and let him know he wasn’t alone. The historical aspects would give any “decompression” scene greater context and meaning.
I agree. I liked the protective nucleus Prentiss and Rossi formed around Hotch during the Hotch arc, because it rang true that the two of them would be the ones that best understood a private man like him. Now, Prentiss, with her established tendency to compartmentalization and her own suffering and secrets, would be a good candidate to invite confidence, because she knows what it's like to be trapped in a difficult situation. I definitely don't want to see Hotch in one of those trite, hokey therapy sessions that TV so often offers up. It would be far more rewarding if the writers could create a situation in which he would open up to one of the regular characters, who the audience is actually invested in. It would be a better challenge for them, too, because Hotch's natural instinct as their leader is to keep his distance and be strong for them.
Hotch knows, Hayley knows he knows, but they both choose not to acknowledge their mutual knowledge. Hayley because she knows Hotch won't confront her, and Hotch because, well, he's probably been "warned off" profiling her in previous fights! And because he doesn't want to believe it.
I think it's more a case that it's nutty to accuse your wife of having an affair based on a couple of ringing phones. Yet every instinct tells him something's up.
I find it hilarious that anyone who isn't a fan of Hotch isn't a Criminal Minds Fanatic.
I'd love for this one-sided observation to be explained a little more in depth.
Just keep taking those deep breaths and don't engage people. : )
Assuming the Erica Messer chat went ahead? And still hoping for a transcript or synopsis.
I can give you some of the highlights. First of all, it was very good chat and much thanks to Erica Messer for giving us her time and to Jill and the mods of course. : )
It sounds as though season 7 is going to focus very much on the characters and fleshing out more of their personal lives.
JJ is coming back as a profiler and her previous duties will continue to be spread out among the team. We will see more of JJ's home life and AJ's son will be playing Henry in those scenes.
It sounded as if the Prentiss/Doyle stuff will be resolved in the premier and Paget Brewster will be back in the premier and not just as part of the teaser.
They wrote the first few episodes assuming Thomas Gibson would be back so Hotch is part of those stories. They had a Plan B if things didn't work out and she said she was gald they didn't have go there.
There will be more Reid and more Hotch and more of the ladies this season. I'm sure she wasn't going to suggest otherwise when asked about that though. LOL
She said Reid will have an arc this season that includes his mom.
She and the writers still have to sit down with Thomas, Shemar and Paget to decide what it is their characters do when they're not at the BAU.
Rachel Nichols will not be appearing in the premiere. She has moved on.
Gubegirl & elevenses: you are both so right. It was late and I was tired (as you can tell by my somewhat rambling choppy post). I just got sucked in.
sf: thank you for synopsis.
I'm not sure how I feel about seeing more of their personal lives. I like others preferred it left to the imagination. Just seeing snippets here and there. Though I am excited to see Jane Lynch back as Reids mother. I had pretty much written that off seeing as she is now on glee. I always did love their scenes together. It's nice to see he in a non comedic role every now and again. While I'm happy to see JJ back as a profiler ( she def. deserves it and has been there long enough to have a good understanding) I don't think I'll like the liason duties being split amongst the team. I really didn't like when Garcia was presenting cases. All that violence was OOC for her sweet sometimes almost innocent charecter. It just wasn't in her nature. I'm glad They are not going to spend much time on the Prentiss/Doyle storyline. I like that they're just going to get it out of the way and get Prentiss back where she belongs. Though the fallout from all of that will be interesting to see. On a final note I'm sure not everyone feels this way but I for one am glad RN will not be back. Like it has been stated before a "she transferred to a field office" from Hotch will suffice. Ok everyone on that note have a wonderful morning and please excuse ant typos :)
For those interested in reading/re-reading the chat, the transcript has just been posted ;)
@ gubegirl
I'm so sorry for your loss. I had to put my 11 year old border collie down last year due to thyroid cancer. I bawled for days and I'm bawling now for you. We never realize what a comfort our little furry freinds are to us until they're gone.
I know you're into music and when I came out of the vet's and went to my car a song by Johnny Reid, a country singer came on called Thank you. One of the lines is "Thank you for the life you've given me." I can't listen to that song anymore without thinking of Chase and crying.
An internet hug is coming your way. I know how sad you are and how much you miss your little one.
@ sf81387:
Thanks for the info - I've just read the transcript and it sounds like season 7 should be much, much better than season 6 - if everything mentioned comes to fruition.
Am now off to digest Erica's chat properly.
Hope you're okay, Gubegirl? x x
Jill, thank you, thank you, thank you so much for providing the chat transcript. And thanks to E.M. and CBS for allowing it. :D
What did we learn?
More whodunnit episodes with focus on the team. Did I understand it right or is it just wishful thinking that Erica said this?
Will Hotch be shown finally dealing with the Foyet-trauma? Well, from how it sounds they'll try, but I guess that means no. They "tried" last season too and nothing came to pass with regards to that storyline. And I'm starting to think that it's a bit too late now. Maybe they should just move on?
Shemar will sit down with the writers also, so I'm sure he'll have a good storyline in season 7 too. I would love to see a bit follow up on the story with his dead cousin and his auntie.
The downer is that unfortunately no one asked about whether Rossi will have more screentime this season. He finally needs a good storyline, IMO.
Not sure how I feel about JJ as a profiler. She'll do great, I'm sure. But I always liked that she had this special place and responsiblity in the team. Does that mean we'll still see Garcia presenting the cases? Please no. I love Garcia to pieces, but her presenting just felt wrong to me.
As for the rest:
More of Prentiss and JJ - YESSS
More Hotch - YESSSSSSSSS
More Reid - YESSSSSSSSSS
Reid's mom is back - YESSS
Strauss is back in the premiere - YESSS
Kevin will show up once in a while - YESSSS
Seaver won't have a good-bye storyline - YESSS
And most importantly: Sergio the cat will be mentioned in the premiere. YEEEESSSSSS
Don't engage?
My sentiments exactly.
Nobody has an answer to explain that ridiculous logic.
"Nobody has an answer to explain that ridiculous logic."
I'm going to only give you the short answer.
This last season we have gotten a ton of Morgan, but instead of being the Morgan we all have come to love, we have gotten a mostly-brawn-without-brains-always-angry version that has pissed off most of us and if this continues to be the version we get our love for this character will fade fast.
This hasn't been an evolution for the character, it has been a devolving trip that has sent him back to the too-eager-green-behind-the-ears-agent state that he never got to show even in season 1 as he was already a experienced agent, and worse, that has made him lose all the multi-layered traits of his personality and apparently all the skills he put on the BAU table and gave him a distinct role and value in the unit.
To be a Fanatic for once means that we are going to point and fight anything that hurts our show and our beloved characters. Your position of loving a episode/season just because your favorite character gets more screentime than everybody else never is going to be enough for us.
Hope this explains our position to you.
Why do people become defensive when a poster says they don't like TG? Don't get me wrong. He's a decent TV actor. There are some worst and plenty better. He won't set anything alight, but he gets his lines out OK and he's obviously doing something right for a certain group of watchers.
I agree with the poster that you're instructing each other not to 'engage' with in hoping that this new season doesn't become fixated around Hotch. For me that would kill off CM. Season 5 is the only season that I didn't get the DVDs for -- it was too soap opera / cheap-thrillish for my taste. It's better when it works to its whole cast but focuses on the cases.
To be absolutely honest, and I'll sign this post because I don't believe in being anonymously honest, after the year of unpleasantness that's been generated by some disgruntled CM fans, I don't believe the 'loyal fans' deserve to be fed exactly what they want by the show makers. It wasn't pretty and it's not good creatively to let audience preference go wild.
uk viewer
thank you uk viewer!!
Finally, someone with some sense!!
Honestly, seeing Morgan's character take a dark and serious twist was realistic, understandable, and it's very much a double standard to accept it when Hotch does, but condemn everything Morgan does.
Morgan had just gone through a mind game, saw his boss and friend get stabbed and his family the target of a serial killer, the pig case with over a hundred victims really REALLY bothered him and he almost wanted to hang it up, as many of them had said they had urges to at some point.
It's stupid for fans to think that a person is supposed to go through all of that, plus the other stuff he went through, and NOT have a personality shift. Who the heck is supposed to laugh and joke after things like that? That just goes to show how little you "fanatics" know the characters as much as you claim.
Hotch personifies dry, boring, and one-dimensional, and I don't see any criticism of him. It's insulting to Criminal Minds in itself to have this kind of blatant bias and double standard subjected amongst fellow viewers, and sorry, but I reject your meaning of fanatic, and substitute it for my own, and mine doesn't include Hotch. I love my team, I love them like family. Hotch doesn't, and never did have to be apart of that family to me.
I don't have to like TG to be a Criminal Minds Fanatic, or fan for that matter, and to suggest so is quite frankly laughable.
Yes, I love Morgan, because unlike many of you, I know the character. I've paid attention to the character. I've followed the character. I write for the character. I RELATE to the character, and can feel what he feels on any given day. His personality is far from the angry brawn without brains gimmick, and it's also laughable and very dismissive to write it off as that. You don't even try to put yourself into the mind of that character, because you've been spoiled with so much Hotch. I'm sick of it. I've had Hotch overload for 6 years, and I want a change. I don't want to have to stop watching my favorite show because one character ruins it for me, so I've decided to pay him little or no mind, and to not watch Hotchner centric episodes.
As if the love for the Morgan character hasn't already faded on this blog. It never existed, plain and simple. We all know who your love is.
You want to point out what hurts our show? Too much Hotchner...building the show around his flat and boring character. That's what will hurt it.
If this new season becomes fixated on Hotch, it will go down as the worst season of Criminal Minds in its entirety for me. I've liked every season up until now.
I'm having horrible feelings about this next one.
We all have individual favourites. The poster above seems quite keen on Morgan, I'd say...
;o)
Me, I love Rossi (as I might have mentioned in the past). The majority of people are sold on Hotch -- and good for you but please be generous. (What chance? What happened to Rachel Nichols? But still I want to say 'Be generous'.) I believe that it's the responsibility of a strong majority to be tolerant to alternative points of view.
On this blog and elsewhere in the CM-verse you hear the word 'majority' and the word 'we' being thrown around as if that's the end of all discussion. But the truth is democracy doesn't work without effective opposition -- and I guess I'm going to be in the Devil's Party from now on.
To the poster above, I can't say I've thought too much about Morgan's character development (not cos I dislike him -- I just haven't) but the moment in the episode with the pigs and the pile of shoes where you saw Morgan ready to turn away from it all is one of the moments in all CM that I believe is real. Kudos to him for that.
UK viewer
@ blimey limey:
Yes Texas cinnamon rolls are awesome, and kinda famous in Texas at least. I would suggest going 2 the Houston stock show and rodeo to get a good sample.
@ cadbury:
Thanks, I'm glad u agree. And no I haven't watched fringe lol I'm way 2 hooked on CM
I'm glad prentiss will be In the premiere and the CM fan will be back together. I just hope it's prentiss that takes care of Doyle once and for all. It'll be interfering to see JJ as a profiler. Although I liked her as a liason, as a character she has 2 grow and change so she should do fine in that position. I wonder how the writers have made prentisses return different from her departure? It's going to be hard considering the set-up is very similar to her final eps last season.
@ Anonymous (Morgan fan)
I wish people who have strong opinions and are willing to assert them would have the courage to own them.
I don't turn my set on to see Morgan, nor do I turn it on to see Hotch. That in no way diminishes their characters to me. For me, I just enjoy Reid. It's a pesonal preference, even when I watch other shows, I'm drawn to the geeks.
I didn't enjoy seasons 5 & 6 as much because they were very Morgan and Hotch centric and Reid was very underused. None of that means that I respect these characters any less because I prefer another more.
I know Morgan is more than a angry side of beef. You can definitely see that in his relatiions with children every time they are involved in a case. It hits close to home for him. He's got brains and you can see how much he cares for his teammates. He was the first to approach Hotch after Haley left. He was the first to ask Emily if something was wrong. He's a wonderful sounding board and big brother like person to Reid. I didn't like when he was unit chief because he didn't seem like Morgan. I think it kind of squashed his inner enthusiasm, one of the things I like most about him. There are many wonderful things about Morgan even though he's not my favorite.
The same goes for Hotch. I think he's a great person who struggles every day with his inner and outer self. What he wants to do and what he can do in his position are in constant battle with each other and TG plays this perfectly, sometimes with just an expression in his eyes. He is loyal to his team and job and also to his family and that battle weighs constantly on him as well.
I can't fault or criticize anyone who chooses either one as their favorite or the one they wouldn't watch without.
There are seven characters on this show and they're all different. They all have their own perspective on the job they do and the way in which they handle it. They all have their own ghosts that haunt them and their own demons to battle and it's the co-mingling of these personalities into a family and their support of one another as they fight the unsubs to make this world a better place, even in knowing they will never truly win that makes this the show I cannot miss.
I agree with the fellow Morgan fan!!!! ;D
I too love Shemar's character the most because it seems to be the one that is the richest of all of them. I feel it's so authentic.
I don't know if you're a guy or a girl but it's funny because when you see Shemar Moore, the first thing you think is a sexilicious hunk of well seasoned hamburger that you just wanna eat slowly so you can enjoy its savory juicy goodness (mmmmmmmm, now I'm hungry. haha! )
But his Morgan character is so much more than a gorgeous face. He's the hero of the team. If I was walking through a dark alley and had to choose which team member to walk with me, I'd choose Morgan before they even got the question out. I would feel so safe with him, because he is fearless and he'd do whatever it took to keep me safe. Yeah, I'm sure a rebuttal would say they all would, but something about Morgan makes me put my trust in him more.
He's so down to earth, charming, protective, passionate, aggressive when he needs to be. What more could you ask for? I could definitely not watch the show without him.
I LOVE HIM!!! =D
.Keisha
Wow. I can't believe I am even giving this a minute's att'n. but someone here has quite a large ego. That or likes to play with people's heads. I feel compelled to speak up.
I love CM. Have since the first time I saw it and raced to get the DVD for the prev S (1) to catch up. My fave from the get-go has been Reid. I gravitate to geeks because I can totally ID with him. My second fave is Morgan. He is WAY more than brawn; he can be very sensitive not to mention, he is very intelligent. Love to see him kicking down doors but love it more when he interacts with other team members on a personal level (as is Elephant's Memory with Reid, etc.)
But the show is an ensemble show. Altho' I have my favorites, I love them all. They are all unique and extremely well-cast in my opinion. Hotch is very different but I think that he is far more complex than has recently been described here and I respect him immensely. As I do the remainder the the cast.
I believe that I speak for the majority here when I say we feel we are CM Fanatics because we love the ENTIRE cast and show. We all have our faves but we appreciate eveyone's contribution and are faithful fans because of that feeling: they are extended members of our family, laugh if you will, but the time and energy we spend watching and talking about them: do not doubt it: this is no ordinary TV show for us. I watch several but this one is very different for me. I am bummed if it is not on...if it is a re-run, I will watch it w/ almost with the same enthusaism I did the first time because there is so much "meat" to most epis and I always catch something I missed the first time.
I wonder if you realize how condescending you sound to those of us who share these special feelings and this blog that allows us to do so?
I don't care how much you love Morgan, I feel that you cannot love the show without accepting them all, and not as marginally as you describe. And it is well-known here and everywhere that TG is not some borderline-decent actor. And many here feel he EXCELS in this role, including myself, despite him not being my favorite.
Do you understand?
We won't ask you to name yourself here, Anonymous, because your writing SHOUTS at us from across the room; your message is loud and clear and I refuse to allow you to put me or anyone else who share these feelings down the way it would appear you are attempting to do. It's fun to debate but you are coming across as though you are trying to pick a fight; even looking down at the rest of us. It doesn't feel good and we come here for fun and to feel good, sharing talk about our fave show. You are spoiling that - at least for me and at a minimum, making some uncomfortable. Is that your intention?
Pat: don't worry about whether this Anonymous "owns" it or not, you are going to hear him/her loud and clear and speaking for myself, I suggest not joining this debate and walking away instead. After Jill's transcript of the chat with Erica, I would like to feel happy about the future prospects of CM and look forward to Season 7.
TY, Jill, I appreciate being able to read all that Erica had to say and the telling questions you asked. Great job!
Nobody has deleted any COMMENTS.
I second gubegirl and pat. I would put it in my own words but they said everything that I would have liked to say and they said it better than I ever could. Also there is no need for vulgarity here. Your choice of words shows that you are obviously not that mature and until you can speak like an adult (if in fact you are one) than I'm sure I speak for the majority when I say please go elsewhere.
Hmmmmm... methinks I'll return tomorrow, after Jill's Morgan-ed the resident nutter.
Goodnight, y'all - I'm planning a cinnamon bun flavoured dream so am getting into character... ;-))
Just been testing the netbook I'll be taking on the roadtrip this summer - it doesn't seem to like smiley faces so I predict a mard-arse few weeks. Haha!
It's nearly Monday, I'm offski...
I'm w/ Blimey on this one. I'll see everyone tom. after Jill has taken care of this little problem. Blimey I hope you gave a great trip! Oh and thank you fir the transcript of the chat Jill, it was great. I can't wait for S7
Checking back in after a couple hours away...oh, my. We true CMF's never fail to get their goat and then they lose it and then Jill must step in and shut things down...I'm sorry, Jill, but we must stand up for ourselves here and not let the crazies put the rest of us down. I tried to do it in a gentle, diplomatic way but I guess if someone is going nutter, as Blimey says, they're going thre regardless.
Pat, Blimey and Eleven: I meant to thank you for your condolences about my pooch. And anyone I may have missed. I thank you for your kind words.
Back to the prev subject, which you may or may not get to see if Jill must close down this thread:
My old boss (from UK) used to tell me:
"It's hard to soar like an eagle when you are surrounded by turkeys."
'Nuff said. Later, guys, headed to the kitchen to make the garlic buttered mashed potatoes to go with tonite's barbeque...think we'll be skipping dessert given this one...:)
Hey, been out for a while with a headache the size of London....
Hope you're doing ok, Gubegirl?
Erica's chat was v interesting, but i missed any ref to Rossi!!
Also, at this point, i just want them to surprise me (go on, do it). Apart from a few episodes, S6 was the bottom for me. So maybe things have bottomed out, at least i hope so. Because any kind of character-driven drama would mean nothing if the unsub stories and the profiling are not well thought out/ engaging.
I believe we have taken our characters far beyond canon, which leaves room for disappointment. So i'm going to try to pare back my expectations and my imagination, and sit back and enjoy the show.
Keeping my fingers crossed for a solid S7. Good luck to everyone.
Doing OK, Elevenses, thanx for asking.
I wish there some CM reruns on tonite. No Brothers and Sisters. No Army Wives. No The Killing.
Damn. My fallback is ALWAYS CM re-runs. Must stay fresh for when we get that call to serve as the writing historian assistants....My family walks in on me quoting the lines along with the actor; they shrug, shake their heads and leave the room but hey, what do they know?!
Maybe tomorrow. Cannot trust my DVR's guide despite having re-set it twice and both TV Guide and Cable guide and even the newspaper are wrong about ION and A & E. Must get on their websites and print them out so that I can plan my sitdown (mail, bills), stand- still activities (like ironing) around them. This is only June. We have almost 3 more months. UGH.
Thanks for the deletions here, Jill. Sorry you have to deal with that s---. I couldn't do it and I know that there are plenty of crazies out there, but this past season, it seems like we have had more than our share!
I presume to still write here since it not about the EM chat? Will watch for a new thread but am trying to be thread-appropriate:)
Have a good nite, everyone.
Good to hear, Gubegirl....i think i missed some sort of mayhem here this pat day?
You know i just finished reading Philip Roth's 'Exit Ghost' and was rendered rubble. I was gobsmacked, was totally having an out-of-body experience. It was like looking at a painting and suddenly it bursts forth meaning. i was on such a high. then i made the mistake of googling stuff on it, and it was unpleasant to say the least. i realised then that our love for the arts and crafts is so entirely personal, and so deep, that criticisms, especially ones that summarise the 'story' and then just say it's bad, are purely negative with nothing constructive. This has happened with so many books, movies, TV series, paintings, etc, that i try to avoid this kind of debate. It just spoils the enjoyment for me. Don't know if i'm making sense. It's like i've enjoyed so many books when they were not part of the course. I still make little notes on the margins but the love and the nameless pleasure are mine and mine alone. And nothing can take them away from me. It's just that sometimes i cannot be that objective about things so close to who i am. That's going to be a life-long struggle methinks :-)
Good night and good thoughts,
Eleven (etc)
Listening to 'Layla'....
@ gubegirl
The marathon's on A&E tonight, I just watched five or six, can't recall. I'm in the central zone and you're pacific so you can likely still catch them, or at least some.
Wonderful!!! CM without Thomas Gibson is absolutely impossible for me. Thank heavens - he is back.
Gubegirl, I'm sorry about your dog. I know how hard it is.
As for Hotch being raped? I had never thought of that at all and this is the first I've heard of it so if it seemed totally obvious, well, it wasn't quite so! I think the poor man has had enough trauma without adding that. So that will stay out of my mind, 'K? =)
I would also like to see Hotch and Prentiss decompress together. I know some people hate "shipping" but I think the two of them are well suited and would also probably both be adverse to marrying at least for a long time. But I can see a long slow build from a played down friendship (to the others) that mostly only the viewer and maybe Rossi would see (because she'd invariably be included in some of Jack's activities). Any intimacy could be implied or (mostly) off screen, at least until the last episode of all time! We could get a peck or two though couldn't we? A companionable lean while watching TV or something? But I agree all business at work.
I can't wait for the new season!
LOL Blimey Limey, I didn't steal your cat but if you need a replacement I have extras!!!
Pat:
Missed the marathon last nite with the DVR guide being WRONG, not having opened the newspaper guide (right for once! Damn but thanks!) Thining about ironing tonite but ion shows reruns til 10, & after yoga, I get home about 9:15... w/no rewinding to catch the first & my basket is more than 3/4 hour full :)...such probs. Def must go because at jazz this AM, had a sudden crying "Jazzy's gone" jag & fought it for 10 minutes but had to grab my mat and rush out to my car. Maybe you suffered from some of these little lapses when you lost your beloved Chase? Thanks for your empathy.
You, too, summerhorse:)
Elevenses: Sorry about your horrific H.A. but you're lucky: you missed an Anonymous going bonkers; (Velandra, Maria and I were a few that tried to reason with him/her) but after several strongly worded & snide comments, repeated their post numerous times until Jill had to jump in and stop it. Geez, we surely have had them this season, have we not? What happened to kindness, fun and camraderie?
Re: prev "Was Haley cheating?"convo:
Just watched Seas 3-2 with the scene with Haley and Hotch (just put on probation by Strauss) and the phone incident. I totally see what Cadbury and Teresa H or whomever else mentioned it; I think RMF commented on it, also.
Haley comes downstairs after cking on a sleeping Jack, walks into where Hotch is working on his laptop with some photos of pretty bloody stuff on the coffee table. He answers the ringing home phone (no one is there) as she flips the photos facedown and then her cell is ringing in her purse on the table near the door. She ignores it but the long look between them is very intense (and thought- provoking for us as viewers) and the first time out, I must have been writing bills or something to miss this. An example of why I maintain, you cannot look away for a second or you might miss something significant!
Anyway, he answers her ? about the new 9-5 job Strauss has offered him and she pronounces "Then it's a no-brainer," whirls around, snatches up her purse and is out the door not one second when Hotch picks the the home phone but is calling Morgan to ck on the current Milwaukee case. I THOUGHT that the team was in the field & had a bad connection at first, tried HIS cell, which under the duress Haley was doling out, he chose not to answer (I had to be looking away!)but then called Morgan back immed after she left, guessing they were trying to reach him.
What I'm saying is, I totally missed that and find it quite intriguing. My first guess, it would seem likely that she is cheating on him & yet at the same time, this would be incongruent, in that she is trying to talk him into shorter hours to have more time with her & Jack. Earlier in the epi, when he is first sent home, she wraps her arms around his neck and tells him that "this probation is a blessing in diguise." and he responds that he loves her. The latter scene makes little sense. But because I was so curious, I had to see & hear for myself. Makes me wonder if this will have a serious effect on Hotch's future dating unless it is with someone who works in a sim job as his, who can understand. Not just any woman can deal with this "alone-in-the-marriage." You follow me?
You got me going. Wonder if there have been any other such "telling" scenes that any of us have missed. This could be another "game" we play to get us thru the summer. If we run out of music.fave scenes to share:)
Have a great vacation, Limey Girl!
Have a good nite, y'all.
Re: prev "Was Haley cheating?"convo:
I don`t believe Haley was cheating. IMO the telefon scene was just a ploy from the writers to make the viewers see Haley as the guilty party in the failure of the marriage and to make them feel sorry for Hotch.
A protocol question:
Is this thread for general comments and the later one only for chat related comments?
I had assumed that since the new one was opened there was no reason to scroll down to this one.
Relatively new to all this so open to some guidance.:)
I suppose we should continue to use this thread just to be on the safe side. I've left you a comment on the chat thread, Teresa.
Who thinks it would be cool if Elle came back for an episode as a guest star?
Or better yet gideon?
AS long as it doesmt tear our CM family apart again....
I'd like 2 see elle and prentiss work a case together and use their foreign language skills..prentiss would have her beat lol
@CMFAN11
I'm all for getting some Elle back :)
Getting some Gideon would mean our cast and crew would have to suffer some Patinkin. Doubt they are up to it, and I'm sure they don't deserve that fate (remember that MP was the guy that left all of them hanging at the very beginning of S3, and is reportedly too much of a diva to work with). I prefer if Gideon remains away from the BAU and our guys and girls forever and ever!
Cmfan11: I'm not sure I would want Elle back even for a guest role. She always felt a bit off to me as if she was never truly comfortable w/ herself as a profiler. It was always like she had something to prove (if only to herself). Then after she got shot in FK part 2 and blamed Hotch I really started to get put off. I mean why not blame Anderson he was supposed to stay w/ her. Don't get me wrong I didn't dislike Elle she just felt like a puzzle piece that you know doesn't fit but keep trying anyway. I feel Prentiss works much better almost as if she was always there.
I meant FK part 1 :)
@ velandara
O yea I forgot about that, did I mention I wanted Elle as an unsub? lol
Personally prentiss fits the role perfectly and needs no replacement bc she's so brilliant and expiernced and objective to her cases.
Although the jury might still be out after Doyle came rolling into her life.
@ Maria
I also agree Elle tried 2 prove herself 2 much, and was slightly cold and almost not compassionate or caring like prentiss. I agree with u
Elevenses,
Sorry, I really can't choose between Hotch and TG. Perhaps we can take turns with one then the other. :)
Has Blimey started her U.S. vacation? If so hope you're having fun.
CMFAN11: would live to see Elle as a doling out vigilante justice as a unsub. I would love to see how the team deals w/ it since she was one of them. It would also be interesting to see Prentiss' perspective considering she never worked w/ Elle.
Gubegirl : I hope your doing alright.
Greetings, y'all! ;-))
No, I'm still on the cold, rainy (well, not today!) side of the Pond for another 26 days (yeah, I've already been counting down for the past month - haha!) but am getting stuff organised despite having now developed the attention span of a goldfish. Oh dear!
18 months in the planning and there's less than a month to go. I can smell those cinnamon rolls already...
So, where's the best place to catch repeated CM episodes? Bearing in mind I'll be in hotels which definitely won't be posh enough to have the full range of channels I assume is available if you pay more? I'm not au fait with what's free and what costs extra when it comes to US TV channels (although I'm looking forward to another Shark Week - I was glued to that of an evening last August). Any helpful hints would be appreciated - if I get back in time and it's on, it would be fab to watch the occasional CM here and there.
Whilst munching on my chips, maybe?! ;-))
I always though there was more to Elle that met the eye. I wondered (and still do) what made her so... defensive?? Not sure if that's the right word? She seemed to be bottling up one hell of a lot of stuff. There was the potential for some great backstory but obviously LG made the choice to leave.
@ Summerhorse:
One is quite enough, thanks! ;-))
Blimey: ION shows CM 5days a week starting at 9 except on wed. they start at 10. A&E Also has marathons Fri. And Sun. starting at 5 and they show eps throughout the day the rest of the week. Hope this help! Oh this is all eastern time
Blimey,
Hope those 26 days go fast. The best channel for reruns here is ION and there's at least two shows each night Mon to Fri. I think it's nationwide but not sure. Other fanatics I'm sure will be able to point you in the right direction. It's a blast because they even have JM and TG doing promos.
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