Criminal Minds spoiler thread for "Hanley Waters" starring Joe Mantegna, Thomas Gibson, Shemar Moore, Matthew Gray Gubler, Kirsten Vangsness and Rachel Nichol.
**Beware! There will be spoilers in the comments :)
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- CRIMINAL MINDS: JOE MANTEGNA'S STAR
- CRIMINAL MINDS: MATTHEW GRAY GUBLER INTERVIEW
- CRIMINAL MINDS PRESS RELEASE FOR "SUPPLY AND DEMAND"
- KIRSTEN VANGSNESS SHARES EXCITING NEWS!
- CRIMINAL MINDS: DISCUSSION THREAD FOR SEASON SIX
- CRIMINAL MINDS: MESSAGE FROM ERICA MESSER
- CRIMINAL MINDS: MATTHEW GRAY GUBLER & MAGIC VALLEY
- CRIMINAL MINDS: JOE MANTEGNA GOLFING FOR CHARITY
- CRIMINAL MINDS: MIA MANTEGNA INTERVIEWS HER DAD
- CRIMINAL MINDS: TV GUIDE INTERVIEW WITH AJ COOK
- CRIMINAL MINDS: BEST NEWS EVER!
- CRIMINAL MINDS PRESS RELEASE FOR "BIG SEA"
- CRIMINAL MINDS PROMO PIC FOR "BIG SEA"
- CRIMINAL MINDS PROMO PIC FOR "BIG SEA"
- CRIMINAL MINDS PROMO PIC FOR "BIG SEA"
- CRIMINAL MINDS EXCLUSIVE CHAT WITH SHOWRUNNER ERIC...
- CRIMINAL MINDS EXCLUSIVE CHAT WITH THOMAS GIBSON
- CRIMINAL MINDS CHAT WITH ERICA MESSER: CHANGE OF DATE
- CRIMINAL MINDS CHAT WITH ERICA MESSER
- CRIMINAL MINDS DISCUSSION THREAD
- CRIMINAL MINDS: AJ COOK SIGNS TWO YEAR CONTRACT
- CRIMINAL MINDS PRESS RELEASE FOR "OUT OF THE LIGHT"
- CRIMINAL MINDS CHAT WITH THOMAS GIBSON
- CRIMINAL MINDS QUOTE & SONG INFO FOR "THE STRANGER"
- CRIMINAL MINDS SPOILER THREAD FOR "THE STRANGER"
- CRIMINAL MINDS: KIRSTEN VANGSNESS INTERVIEW
- CRIMINAL MINDS REBROADCAST OF "WHAT HAPPENS AT HOM...
- Criminal Minds: "The Stranger" --Hotchner (Thomas ...
- CRIMINAL MINDS QUOTE & SONG INFO FOR "HANLEY WATERS"
- CRIMINAL MINDS SPOILER THREAD FOR "HANLEY WATERS"
- CRIMINAL MINDS: JOE MANTEGNA ON PETROS & MONEY
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316 comments:
1 – 200 of 316 Newer› Newest»The CM wishes for Japan are absolutely beautiful. Thank you for sharing them.
Lin, you beat guegirl to the new comment thread :)
Ditto on the video. It is so horrible what happened out there.
Very thoughtfull of them. Thomas, Matthew,Kirsten,Rachel,Joe and Shemar are incredible
Cindy: I know you were in such a hurry to be 2nd here, that was a typo and that you really did not mean to call me "guegirl!" Hah! I've been called worse! Glad that I am not the only one that types/scrolls too fast! (TSTF?)
Just skimmed the new TVGuide - nada info in for our CM entertainment except that the epi for 4/13 is the new one that will have the team coming to see me...well, San Diego. If I knew where, I so woulda been there...
Keep the tuneage going, people. I want to listen to those that you suggested, Optika, I think? Don't let me give you credit again, GF when I shouldn't:)
Nice video of the team. I feel proud to feel that I am a fan of NICE people, totally apart from the show. Why can't Charlie Sheen use his fame for such a good purpose?
Later.
It's poor without Prentiss! :(
Eeks, sorry gubegirl... I think you "profiled" me correctly, I did want to be second, LOL
Anonymous, yes, I was missing Paget in the video. The video and the show are just not the same without Paget and AJ :(
Hi there!
I'm doing a presentation on profiling, and well... I'm having a hard time defining exactley what profiling is! I feel it's so many things... But, I guess what I'm asking is if any of you fans out there can help me define it clearly. Thanks to anyone who can help :)
I can't wait for this episode!
profiling is studying people read them know how they tick
Please let it be better than last week. This really sucks without JJ and Prentiss ( sorry to keep brinnging it up) but the quality has just gopne down since the changes have been made. Season 6 is by far the weakest yet :(
No need to be sorry Anonymous, I feel the same way. I don't know who in the hell at CBS thought eliminating those female characters off the show was a good idea, and don't get me started on the writing. The idea that getting rid of writers like Andrew Wilder was at all a good idea ranks up there with the top ten stupidest moves in network history. I'm sure this will be another unsub-centric episode made worse by the lack of JJ, Prentiss, and a continued Seaver presence.
Great going CBS :(
I too dislike the unsub-centric episodes, and yet I thought this preview seemed somewhat compelling. What do you do with someone who just snaps? No mental illness, no history of abuse...one day they just go off the deep end. How do you profile that?
Kelli Williams should be good in the role. Wasn't she always on trial for shooting her crazy stalkers in "The Practice?"
Gubegirl,
I dont think I suggested that but I'm not sure...sorry.
I will continue to watch to support everyone else in the cast except for RN/AS.
Those messages to Japan were very thoguhtful and considerate of them.
In regards to wardrobe, I really like the business suits and casual and coats wear that the CM ladies wear, including Seaver. Only thing I like about Seaver is her wardrobe. She is dressed very similar to early JJ but with jeans instead of dress pants.
I really want to know more about their makeup brands and looks, and what clothing brands they wear. I like that kind of stuff so if anyone knows and can find out, please post it. Thanks.
I hope that this episode is Hotch-centric tonight. Apparently they are currently shooting at a beach. Maybe TG will take his shirt off!?! Here's hoping!
Looking forward to tonight, but when will we get a strong female back on the team? I've tried CBS, but Seaver is a total loss.
I would also love to see more hand to hand from the characters and less guns. A realsitic street fight scene from Hotch, Reid, and of course, Morgon.
Sometimes I feel that the quality of the writing was better in the first couple of seasons, especially with the consistency and the unsubs. There was more depth. Now its like the writers are trying to be more CSI like, more hip or something.
They should stop.
Optika,
There are a few hair/makeup people on Twitter that tweet about things like that. They're really great about responding to questions and tweeting behind-the-scenes photos.
@annafleiner - makeup artist
@lindadeandrea - hair
@Dayne9165 - makeup
Anyone I'm missing? Unfortunately I don't think there's a costume person on Twitter.
Anyone I'm missing? Unfortunately I don't think there's a costume person on Twitter.
I think the guy who has been off with his new baby is a wardrobe guy. His name is Krish Ribeiro.
For Call me Jumbaliah: here is a link to a website on Criminal Profiling / Forensic Psychology. Maybe that can help your your essay. http://www.all-about-forensic-psychology.com/criminal-profiling.html
Optika said: "Apparently they are currently shooting at a beach. Maybe TG will take his shirt off!?! Here's hoping!"
You want to kill me, right? LoL. Shirtless Hotch, I might get a heart-attack or slip on my drool.
Anyway, back to this night's episode. I like watching Kelli Williams on "Lie to me" or "Medical Investigators" (was that the title?) so I'm looking forward to seeing her guest star in this episode. OTOH, as someone else already said, having such a big tv star on the show will likely mean a lot of screentime for her (which isn't bad in and of itself of course) and not so much screentime for our team (which is bad altogether). And these days little screentime for the team means even less screentime for Hotch. Therefore, I'm not putting my hopes up too hight. Ideally, it's a balanced episode with as much good profiling as we can have. I do wonder how much time we'll have for the grief counselling. That's supposed to be in this episode, right?
I read a spoiler about the season finale. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to elaborate on it here and now, all I can say is that it could be interesting with regards to a new, experienced female profiler. But that's just me totally speculating.
The costume guy, Krish Ribeiro's Twitter account is:
@K_T_Rib
He's hasn't been too active on Twitter since late February, but he should be back to work for the season finale.
I'm hoping for:
1). A "whodunnit" episode which keeps me guessing, rather than knowing who the unsub is from the first scene.
2). More of how Prentiss' "death" is affecting the team.
3). Reid's headaches - either answers or for the proverbial to hit the fan, so something *has* to be done about them.
4). Hints as to the nature of the remaining secrets - preferably Hotch's first.
5). More profiling = More team interaction.
Demanding? Moi? Too right!
"See" you all on Thursday evening (well, Thursday afternoon for most of you good people if we take time zones into account) after my Source has come up with the goods...
LunaM,
I saw some spoilers for the season finale, and the topic sounds very interesting. I'm just curious how profiling will mesh with the subject matter. But it's not a topic this show has covered yet, so if well-written, it could be very good.
Blimey,
You are definitely not getting a "whodunit" episode this week since the unsub was clearly outlined in the promo. In fact I think the team knows who the unsub is. I'm guessing they are just profiling her to anticipate her actions. As for the rest of your hopes: I'm right there with you and would love to see that. I won't be able to watch this episode Thursday night my time either.
Two quick notes: Kelli Williams was an atty on The Practice back in the 2000's and ended up marrying the owner of the firm, played by Dylan McDermott (hunka-munka.) She did, indeed, kill at least one person (like a stalker) if not two, and my husband has a HUGE crush on her. We both happily enjoyed The Practice:) He can hardly wait to see the epi but when I told him that she will once again be "a killer", he was bummed. Refers to her as "my poor Lindsay.." her name on the Practice.
Secondly: glad to see you back on here, Blimey Limey, because I wanted to ask you if you are serious about taking a vacation here and going to Mexico anytime soon. If so, you should know, in case you have not heard, that there is a great deal of unrest in that country, the violence is not only down deep in the country but close to the border, and our San Diego tourist/visitors are less likely to travel there anymore, even to Tijuana because of the safety issues. Two men who work in the area were killed two days ago while in one of the "car parks" this side of the border where they "queue up" to cross. Pls research abit more if you are planning a trip here anytime soon.
Sorry for another "PSA", but we CM Fanatics must stick together. Numbers (viewers!) count!
Blimey Limey, if you have seen any of the previews of the show which it seems like you may not be able to because of your location, then you will already know who the unsub is and part of why she is doing what she is doing.
I forget who in the other thread said it but it I think it rings true for CM nowadays. The person said that CM has turned into "The Unsub Show" guest starring the BAU team. Well, this week, it is "The Unsub Show: featuring Kelly Williams, with appearances by the BAU team." I don't have a problem with episodes that sometimes focus on unsubs but this season it is like almost every episode has featured the unsub (guest star). Kelly Williams is a good actress so that will be nice to see, but I don't tune in for Kelly Williams or any other guest star. I tune into CM to see TG, SM, MGG, KV and JM, formerly, TG, SM, MGG, KV, JM, PB, and AJ.
I am not holding my breath that there will be much focus on the team performing any sort of substantive profiling in this episode as that has not been the trend this season, although, I will be happy if I am wrong.
Numbers do count, so in order to maintain the numbers moving forward they have got to do something about the writing and the cast (bring back JJ character, pray that PB/Prentiss comes back, get rid of the Seaver character, renew TG and SM's contracts). They can't continue to take for granted that people will keep on going along with their poor decisions.
Sadly I dont have twitter, so if anyone wants to volunteer to ask questions for me? It would be greatly appreciated!
As for TG with his shirt off, TG is a good looking man! And he doesnt have a beer gut or anything either. He is handsome and ages well. He looks like he's in his late 30s, not 40s and I love his hair and his sunglasses. His sunglasses are so sleek and sophisticated and give him a great air of mystery and professionalsm. They look like Oakleys.
I am interested in where the team gets their bags and sunglasses and shoes as well.
Maybe a beaty breakdown for AJ Cook. Really loved her makeup in the Slave of Duty and 100 eps. I am going to get my bags cut like AJ's.
Please let there be Hotch in every scene. He is so good! Why take hime away from us! Why?!!!!!!
Optika, Twitter is easy to sign up for. Just create an account and go. You don't have to tweet to read. Reading tweets from the cast and crew has become the highlight of my day.
If Hotch were shirtless he'd be covered with scars. How would you like to be the make-up person getting to apply all of those? ; )
ANY DISCUSSION NOT DIRECTLY RELATED TO THIS EPISODE OR A PREVIOUS EPISODE WILL BE IMMEDIATELY DELETED.
According to the commercials were going to find out what turns a soccer mom into a killer. I can think of a few soccer moms in the past I wanted to strangle so it should be interesting to see one actually melt down and go crazy. ; )
This unsub's tragedy sounds like one that would hit home for Hotch so I hope we see lots of Hotch and Rossi tonight. I like it when they're paired up.
Are we getting Strauss tonight or is that the next episode? I love Strauss. She's so deliciously diabolical while showing signs of humanness occasionally.
I wonder how this episode will go--will it be a flashback-like episode (similar to 100). I don't know.
I opened up a USA Today newspaper at my college, and looked to the Prime-Time Nielseons ratings page, and I've got some bad news--
Despite getting 13 million viewers last week, Criminal Minds only made 11th place on the Network top 20, bumped from the Top 10 (the spin-off didn't even crack the list last week). On the 18-19 index, Criminal Minds only made 11th place with 4.6.
What does that say?
I dont really want to sign up for twitter, but thanks. i just like checking out the cast and crew pages for behind the scenes stuff.
maybe they can have a How to dress and style like a profiler featurette in the season 6 dvds.
I just watched Natural Born Killer and The Fox and The Tribe recently. The first couple of seasons had a different feel to them then the current ones. The characters really keep the fans coming back and the close family relationship between everyone, well, almost everyone.
I wish Gideon would come back for a guest starring arc. i'd like to see him, Hotch and Rossi, Reid, JJ, Emily, Garcia and Elle, and Morgon all interact.
Maybe an old case that both Gideon and Rossi worked on will come back to haunt the BAU and Gideon needs to be located to help. They do it with Rossi anyway.
And I would like to see what Elle has done with her life since leaving the BAU and proving that it isnt for everyone and you really need to be willing tosacrifice. More eps written by Jim Clemente would be great.
Also, after rewatching Lauren for the tenth time, I realized that Hotch said that "since terrorism isnt a field we're experts in" or something like that", as JJ was making or wonderful grand entrance. Well I would like to point out that that is a huge error on part of the writers or the dialogue people becuase of eps like Secrets and Lies, Lessons Learned and Amplification. Why they would mess it up for an EMily centric ep is not logical, especially since if anyone is an expert in terrorism, it should be Emily. Also, Morgon should know a few spy tricks becuase it was mentioned in Natural Born killer that he did two years deep cover (maybe his secret has to do with that? would make an interesting storyline) and he stated that they dont know any of Emily's tricks in Lauren.
I would like to see more espionage stuff, as I mentioned before and more eps exploring terrorists. I think they are important. I really would like to see more of the BAU tema members pasts come out.
On a sidenote, does anyone know where I can find Thomas Gibson's Category 6 tv miniseries thing to watch online? He looked really good in that and I also really liked the story.
I'm back - decided I was safe as it's just after 4pm on the East Coast so no chance of spoilers yet!
Ah well, unsub show it is then. I'll try to find a promo on youtube - CBS flags up a "Jog on, Limey!" type message on their site. I suppose it depends how the episode is done. Like someone said on another thread, we've had knowing who the unsub is before and it's not detracted from the profiling, etc. "Revelations" is a classic example.
Just been on youtube - hmmmm! I wonder if the pressure of having to "keep up with the Joneses" finally became too much for her. We have "netball mums" at our local leisure centre; if you listen in to their conversations (they talk so loudly you can't ignore them) life in general just seems to be one long competition. It seems a stressful way to live? I suppose feeling under huge pressure to live up to the perceived expectations of others could make someone snap? Just speculating, not judging, btw.
Another thing I'd like to see - and I doubt I will - is what happened to Prentiss' cat Sergio. I aspire to be a Crazy Cat Lady and if I knew I was going off the grid and possibly not coming back I'd make sure my Garfield wannabe had a secure home. I could see Garcia taking Sergio in and spoiling him rotten. Ahhhh!
Finally, I hope the mods don't mind me thanking Gubegirl for her advice regarding Tijuana. My vacation (5.5 week road trip!!!) was booked ages ago, but the stroll across the border isn't definite as I'm monitoring the situation as summer approaches. Or rather my Mum is, if the amount of news report emails she sends about violence in Mexico is anything to go by! If my cousin's in LA for work while I'm there she's interested in going to Tijuana, but if it's still really dodgy I've said we'll stay firmly on US soil and go shopping instead! Thanks for the heads up though - much appreciated and I'm looking forward to sunshine, tonnes of waffles and good ol' US hospitality!
Anonymous,
In terms of the top 10, it's really all relative. Last week, CM had 2 episodes of AI, 2 episodes of DWTS, and 2 NCAA semifinals to contend with. It was still the #4 scripted show of the week, and it remains steady relative to its Wednesday slot. You're always going to have weekly fluctuations depending on what's airing that week.
I'm feeling poorly today and the only thought that makes me smile is knowing that I get to see CM tonight. I'm really hoping that we *do* see reaction from the team regarding Emily. It would be so abnormal not too.
Coadygirl, I hope you feel better.
Well, for last week's ratings, Criminal Minds went DOWN the list, reaching 11th place overall out of the top ten, and sixth place for a scripted drama, with NCIS, NCISL LA, The Mentalist, Body of Proof, and Grey's Anatomy ahead of it.
Shouldn't this be a worrying sign? I'm afraid that Criminal Minds is sinking in the ratings, but on a gradual decline. What will the ratings for this episode be, higher, about the same, or lower? If it leaves the top 20 altogether, that's not good news.
When Criminal Minds was facing AI, it did well, though not number one, but now it's much lower.
BTW, CMSB (resisting temptation to switch last two letters around) didn't even make the network Top 20 list, or the 18-49 index.
This is all from USA Today.
Thank you very much Cindy. One more hour and I'll get the best medicine ever! Too bad Dr. Reid isn't a medical doctor ;)
Didn't we learn Hotch's secret...Emily is alive.
re the ratings : CM has been out of the top ten four times before "Friends" this season and is doing a lot better than last season, where they have been out of the top 10 eleven times. My source are the Nielson ratings. Hoping for a great new CM ep tonight (well tomorrow for me,since I`m in Europe).
I am bumming because with so few epis left this season, usu there is tremendous interest in the show and much posting on this blog. (Am I remembering the past years correctly, Criminal Minds Fan? or any regulars?)
I noticed it last week and now again this week: it would appear that not as many of us are looking forward to our show, esp a new epi after the couple that were more well-written and encouraging in some ways.
I wish we would get some strong good news, like TG and /or SM signing their contracts, maybe followed by an old writer or two returning? Too much to wish for AJ or Paget's returns at this time but maybe not too much to be hoping for these other "wishes" to be granted?
Sigh...I still am looking forward to tonite's show and seeing abit more of the team's reaction to losing Prentiss. Sorry, but Morgan's admonishment of Garcia for "sulking" doesn't cut it - a close co-worker and friend supposedly dies a violent death and no one should "sulk?" I would be willing to bet that SM had a hard time spitting that one out, because as far as lines go, that one stunk. And I am not buying the rest of that convo either with his advice - too phony for someone who just lost their "partner" as Morgan did. Let's not go into the specific of this one, guys, because I am not trying to stir up anything, I just ab anxious to see some true feeling.emotion for Prentiss; feelings that I beleive that the "family" really has.
Later.
True coadygirl.. although, I bet he'd be booked with appointments clear into 2015 :)
I don't think DR.REID "seeing" YOU is as important/therapeutic as YOU seeing HIM tonite, Coadygirl, but watching him and Morgan has always fixed what ailed me...:)
Of course, it's Reid that needs the doctor, and we know what kind, & the sooner the better that our guy gets into some serious therapy. And that, of course, will require that he recup in a warm, sunny climate with lots of mother-henning...we won't say who/where that caregiver and exact location will be...:)
Re "Body of Proof" and "Gray's Anatomy". "Body of Proof" is a new show and this was it's premier. It is already down to just over 11 million this week and a 2.4 rating. "Gray's Anatomy" did what they called a musical episode this week so it was a gimmick type of episode. (Season to date "Gray's" is not in the top 20).The ratings for CM are just fine.
Oh wow, Hotch is conducting the grief sessions. Maybe this means more Hotch this episode?????
Must be crazy though, being that he knows that Prentiss is alive.
does he really know prentiss is alive? i didn't get any indication for sure that he knew. i mean i guess it could have been insinuated from the look btwn him and jj at the funeral.
I think he definitely knows from the conversation at the hospital and the look at the funeral.
ya but at the hospital there wasnt much said just we did everything we could by jj and hotch said i know so i'm still not positive. the look would be the only thing to convince me. still on the fence about it though.
The pic of Morgan on Garcia's lap: did we see this before or is it a publicity shot? She has this look like, "He's MINE" all over her face, doesn't she? I can't remember when she suggested a movie and popcorn - just that she did - it seemed like it was at the end of something and I don't remember ever seeing any follow-up. Am I having a little brain lapse here or totally wigging out?
How can Hotch conduct the grief sessions when he is one who is grieving??? WTH? That can't be right! Contrived to cover up what he knows somehow?
Talk to me you guys - only 6:40 on the west coast and I can hardly wait and I do not mind getting Spoiler'd!
he's doing the assesments so strauss doesn't do them...he had a moment with rossi showing that he is greiving. i can understand why he's doing it so someone doesn't come in and judge them and say get over it.
Can someone please give me a recap of the episode that is ONLY relevant to Prentiss. I want to know what the team said about her. Don't have the time to watch it tonight!!
Hotch!!!! Yes!!!!!
About time CM puts him in the forefront again!!!!
Oh God, I hope that Hotch doesn't know.. it would be awful if he did and he went through these sessions with them.
ok so hotch is doing assesments. morgan is the most torn up guilt wise bc he was there when she "died". garcia just wants to talk about how prentiss made her smile. reid is just plain depressed. he made a gideon reference. he wonders if everything is worth it bc if they can't protect each other what's the point. rossi said this loss was different bc he is more married to the job than any of his wives. no seaver in the assesments! i hope i did an ok job with my quick sum up.
Tonight I am so happy....lots of Hotch makes me Smile!!!!!!! Love Hotch-Reid and Hotch-Rossi scenes!!!!!!
Plus at the end what he said to the mom and more important how he said it....just amazing.
Thanks!!!!!!!
I absolutely loved the Hotch-Reid scene too. I hope to see more of that in the future.
2 great episodes in a row!
A CM in Season 6...reminicent of seasons1-4! Spot on writing, directing, acting. Feeling very satisfied right now!
I miss Prentiss :(
The preview for the next episode looked...vague. A killer who attacks victims while they're alone? Shocking.
I thought the episode was okay. I can see where the unsub would tie in to the team, both are grieving and maybe this is a way of showing the team that they have to find a way to get over it, so they don't turn out like Shelley.
Yes, no Seaver in the grief session, telling. I love that Rossi said he was more married to the team than he ever was to his three wives, totally says family to me.
Pat, I thought that was telling as well.
Pat,
Clearly none of the team is going to wind up like Shelly. The episode was an observation of grief in all its different manifestations. Shelly's story set up a framework in which to examine the team's grief, but it was not a cautionary tale.
Very well done. Great work by all the cast. Kelli Williams knocked it out of the park.
That was a good brief summary Karen :)
I have to think about this ep some. I really like that they did a grieving theme -- how damaging grief gone wrong can be. Well done. And Hotch in the restaurant was beautifully done, and I'm sure it did the team a world of good to hear it.
I would have been so much happier if this ep had aired last week. It feels out of sequence.
And Hotch without a jacket -- those shoulders. Holy ... cow. Somebody's been hitting the gym, or the pool, big time. Good on ya, TG! (Applause!)
Too much Hotch in this episode. Big turn off for me. I've had my fill of him after 6 seasons, to be honest.
I did love the Morgan scenes at the beginning and the end. Was hoping for a tear from SSA Badass, but he had to fight it back, didn't he? LOL.
I loved the Gideon reference from Reid.
Overall this episode wasn't one of the best (the best ones were at the beginning of this season.) but I loved how angry Morgan was. Him getting his hands on Doyle = EPIC WIN!!!
Can anyone remember / post Hotch's quote to the mom at the end? It was beautiful...
In addition, I must say, I'm stoked for the Morgan episode that's gonna air after this next one!! xD
I thought this was terrific. My only comment would be that I wish the last scene was between Hotch and Reid. Reid is drowning and Hotch doesn't talk to him. Actually when you think of it Hotch and Reid have not really spoken since Season 3 in Tabula Rosa. I was thrilled to see more of Hotch in this episode and all the discussion about blaming oneself is really on the mark for Hotch.
A very strong episode with seaver winning more and more footing. Good stuff in this episode.
Okay, maybe I need to re-watch this episode because I am not tracking with how they figured out the unsub was suffering from the loss of a child being that up until that point she had shot 4 guys in a gun shop, a security guard and a cop. Not sure how all of that leads to the conclusion that she was suffering from the loss of a child. They didnt even interview the woman at the mall whose child she tried to take???? Maybe I need to watch it again to see if there is something that I missed.
I did enjoy that Hotch was more of a presence in this episode, that has been sorely missing this season. The Hotch and Rossi scene was wonderful. Great to see these actors playing against one another again.
I agree that if Hotch knows that Emily is alive that is going to present one hell of a situation if Morgan, Reid, Garcia and Rossi discover this secret.
I really loved this episode, I cried more tonight than I did at the end of Lauren. All of the assessment scenes were so well done; when Rossi raised his glass to Emily and Haley it tore me up. The whole cast did a great job, Thomas was AWESOME!!
Optika…I don’t know where you can find Category 6: Day of Destruction online but it definitely available on DVD. I just watched it again this past weekend.
Next to the assessment scenes, the scene with Hotch at the restaurant was great! The assessment scenes I believe captured the essence of these characters. I do agree with some of the profling points that Rosalie mentioned. Still the magical leaps in profiling that I think Eleven or Uk viewer mentioned before.
Come on CBS make this "family" complete and bring back AJ and beg Paget to come back!!!! Don't even think of messing with TG and SM's contracts!
I haven't watched an episode since Prentiss left...and I don't think I will start again. I watch shows like CM mostly for the character development...and when a show loses two main characters in one season, it totally kills it!
Anonymous, let's hope that CBS developes a brain and gets both AJ and Paget back. Paget may be a rough one, but CBS needs to do everything possible to make that happen, knowing that it is Paget's decision and she may just end up flipping them off. Maybe if AJ comes back she may be more willing to come back. I will respect and follow Paget to whatever project she decides to do, always hoping that she (and AJ) come back to CM.
Finally! After virtually a full season of being pushed into the background, our Unit Chief reappears with a vengeance. :) I'm feeling really bad that he has to do the team interviews while harboring his secret re Emily tho'... I don't like to think what will happen if/when it comes out.
Very happy to see that Emily's 'death' wasn't ignored and finally we get some acknowledgment for Haley. I love Hotch/Rossi scenes when somebody actually cares to ask Aaron how he is. I'd also like to see some Hotch/Reid; agree its been missing for a couple of seasons.
Good epi all round; so much better with Hotch back where he belongs. Thank you CM! Now we just need TG's contract signed and PB to return!
Excellent episode! Am relieved that we got some more Hotch, I've really missed him ever since the middle of last season. Sweet team moments and nice touch to leave Seaver out of those. I miss Emily alot but will keep watching as long as TG sticks around. CBS, you need to resign Thomas, the ladies and SM.
Trish, the ladies? KV is already signed for season 7. Do you mean AJ and Paget?
From reading the posts, it seems like it's going to be a lot of Hotch and very little Seaver. Great combination in my book! This makes me actually look forward to watching the episode, something i haven't felt in a while. And though I think Shemar and Kirsten are fantastic actors, I feel like Season 6 has been a lot of Morgan and Garcia. We need MOAR HOTCH please. I certainly hope that both Thomas and Shemar's contracts will be renewed SOON!! But Thomas especially. Cuz he's my fave. Duh. LOL
Am I who sees perhaps a glimmer of the team starting to figure out that Prentiss is alive? Maybe not that she's alive, but more that something is off about Hotch's reaction? Hotch worded his response very carefully - "like you, wishing she was here." They're profilers after all, I wonder if they will figure it out...
OH what a cool theory anonymous!! That would be awesome. If AJ and Paget could come back wow!!! I would be one freaking happy camper!! OMG CBS I WOULD LOVE YOU FOREVER!!
Yes, Anita, I mean Paget & AJ. :)
"She clearly knew someone there." STFU Seaver, no one cares about you, esp since you're ALWAYS WRONG. Ugh.
Am liking Kellie Martin so far, though. Wish they'd added *her* as a profiler and not Newbie Know Nothing.
Blue, it is K. Williams.. K. Martin sounds familiar though....
Blue, the thing is Seaver, well, there is nothing going on there. By that I mean there is nothing dynamic or unique about her like there was with Prentiss. She is either spouting out wrong or useless information, or spouting out stuff that the team doesn't need for her to state, stuff that is obvious to them. But in other instances they have her spouting off stuff she is simply not at the experience level to be able to contribute. The character is just off and I don't know what they think they are going to accomplish via this character. I just hope that come season 7 this character is off the show, not by being killed or anything like that, but gone off to a field office like other rookie agents.
Loved that Hotch was front and center in this episode. My how I have missed the Unit Chief! The Rossi and Hotch scene, gotta love it! These are two great actors playing great characters who were allowed to show some of that greatness together. Love it! Garcia, what she must be holding inside. In a way, I think she may be one of the hardest hit of the team ever finds out that Prentiss is alive. Morgan, loved his scenes. His anger was understandable, couched in pain, grief, and regret. Wow, I can't imagine how he is going to react if he finds out Prentiss is alive. It is hard for Morgan to open up, he did that with Hotch and Prentiss and to find out that this was being kept from him, wow. Reid, he broke my heart too because you can see not only his love for losing someone like a sister to me, but his feelings of guilt and of failure for not being able to save Emily. The profiling part, yeah, I think there were some leaps made there that led to conclusions that didn't make sense. Not that the conclusions didn't make sense, it was the process of getting to those conclusions that didn't make sense.
I have the same concern as others have pointed out. I personally believes that he knows that Prentiss is alive and so I think they are setting up the character to hit some trust walls with the other team mates. This is something that can potentially tear a team apart. I hope they can find a way to write Hotch and JJ out of this hole.
I am hoping with every inch of hope that Paget returns to the show- there is something for me that is undeniably missing without her there. Also, we need AJ back, please.
I hate the changes they've made this season. I want AJ and Paget back. Nothing against the new girl, but what was the point of making all of these changes? I don't think she enhances the show in any way. I also find it highly unlikely that her character would graduate from the academy and immediately fall right into a profiler slot. They've made references in several past episodes about there being waiting lists for profiler positions and classes to take. Did she even take the profiler classes? They just celebrated her graduation to the academy last week. So really we’re expected to believe that the FBI would pull a cadet, who has no discernable skill or quality other than being the spawn of a serial killer, out of training to act as a profiler. Then after said cadet proves to be completely incompetent and useless to the point of almost getting herself killed, they decide to make her a permanent profiler. Interesting. I swear, if they make any more dumb moves, (like say, getting rid of TG or S&M) I may be forced to give up on my favorite show.
criminal minds fan
please delete bluesunflowers post it contains everything you said you will not have on this blog
Blue Sunflower mentioned something that was said in the episode. How is that not allowed unless there is something that I am missing? It seems like Blue Sunflower is in the process of watching the episode now because of the comment of liking the actress that plays the unsub, so maybe it was a comment on what has been seen so far in the episode.
Blue Sunflower, as much as I wish they had just left the show alone this season, I gotta agree with you. Kelli Williams would have been really good as a profiler. BTW, "Newbie No Nothing," Love it! So fitting, LOL.
Kelli Williams is a good actress. She was good in "The Practice."
my, I think Blue has mentioned in the past that the show shouldn't have gotten rid of AJ and Paget.
I agree with anonymous. blu sunflower and some others here only contribute by posting their hate for Ashley Seaver.
Is this really what this board has come to. What happened with talking about the plot of the episode.
Blue talked about an aspect of the episode, a line that a character stated in that episode that Blue did not particularly care for, that is not outside of the realm of the discussion of the episode. Stating a disliking for a character is alos not outside of the realm of the conversation as that character is part of the episode. Maybe you did not care for how Blue phrased it, but it is a legitimate comment for how Blue felt about that line. Characters are either liked or disliked, loved or hated, sometimes there is no specific feeling toward a character. There is nothing unusal about that.
Postman's post is clearly not adding anything about the episode. The main topic of the post seems to be to put down the blog and the blog posters. Please delete if you agree with my assessment. Thanks!
K, finished with the episode now. Wished they'd had more Reid, but am happy they finally gave Hotch some airtime. I liked the episode but it could have been a ton better. Really bugged how it took f.o.r.e.v.e.r for them to figure out they needed to look at accidents occurring on the date in question. That was kinda a no-brainer, IMO.
And wow, guess I'm lightning rod of the night with my Seaver comment. I'll say it again though: GET RID OF HER, SHE SUCKS SO MUCH.
Anonymous said...
criminal minds fan
please delete bluesunflowers post it contains everything you said you will not have on this blog
Considering all I did was comment on the episode itself - which, BTW, is the whole point of this thread and therefore perfectly allowable - I'd really like to see this list I supposedly went against.
As much as I loved this episode, I couldn’t help but notice that the dresser in
Damien’s bedroom is the same one used in “Instincts” & in “Cradle to Grave”; it’s not that big of deal I to the many fans who watch an episode just once or twice I guess. It really bugs me to see props used over and over and most especially those that have significance to a major cast member; like the items from Hotch & Haley’s home, the light over the dining table has been used a couple of times and the wall hangers that Hotch removed Haley’s hats from in the closet showed up in the bathroom of one of the victims on “Comprising Positions” and the decorative pink wall hanging that was in room that Jack “worked the case” in was also used in “Doubt”. There are many, many more instances of this and yes I know, my best friend already told me “GET OVER IT!!”
I will say KUDO’s to the props dept. for adding the framed handprints of Jacks’ (first seen S3 in “In Name and Blood”) to Hotch’s shelf in his office, I noticed it in Valhalla.
Thanks for letting me vent a bit…now back to more important things! CBS let’s get AJ & Paget back for S7 and make sure our guys are happy and signed soon, we need TG and SM back for S7 too!!
Was it my imagination, or has there been no sight of Hotch either in the promo pix for next week or in the coming scenes?
Was delighted with the episode -- pretty thin for, say, seasons one through three, but downright awesome for this miserable, droopy sixth season.
Hmm, just thought of another note, reading some comments about Hotch being the one to do the press conference.
While yeah, Hotch is a parent, I really think this is where the loss of JJ is most felt. She definitely brought the "mom touch" and sympathy to the floor. I think she would have gotten to Kelli a lot more than Hotch would - or anyone else on the team, for that matter.
I believe Hotch knows Emily is alive because I WANT HIM TOO. That simple.
My it's just my wishful thinking, but the way the writers are weighting heavily on the effect of Prentiss's "death" and not going over it like it never happened, gives me hope that they're building up to something. I do hope Paget comes back, even if it's just for one episode. I need to see her again and I want Emily's arc complete.
Finally a decent episode in a long time! With nice team dynamics... And a great normal case
"Hanley Waters" was quite a decent episode. Not one of my favourites, but definitely better than some of the other episodes I've seen this season. I don't know if I'll watch it for a second time, perhaps I will for the wonderful one on ones Hotch had with Morgan, Garcia, Reid, and Rossi. Those were by far, my favourite parts of the the episode. I think the writers did a good job of capturing the essence of the individual characters through those one on ones. I felt for all of them, Reid, Morgan, Garcia, Rossi, and Hotch, they all broke my heart, especially Garcia and Reid. Morgan's opening scene was very well done too. I was glad Rossi was there for Hotch because I kept thinking to myself he needs someone to talk to too! So it was a nice touch when Rossi raised the glass to Emily and Haley.
Another thing I liked about this episode is increased footage for Hotch. I have been crying out for this since a long time, and TG did not disappoint. He completely owns Hotch and they need to renew his and Shemar's contracts asap. The last scene with Morgan and Hotch made me want to cry. We're all wishing Emily was still with us, aern't we? :( When, oh when is Hotch going to be doing another quote? It's been a really long time since we've had a Hotch opening/closing quote.
That scene with the unsub, her husband, and Hotch was a good one too. I do think this episode, like a lot of other season6&5 episodes was a bit too unsub centric, but it did help that the actress portraying the unsub did a commendable job. I could feel her pain, her helplessness, her sadness, anger, grief and I felt really sad for her :(
The best thing about "Hanley Waters" though was that Seaver did not get a one on one session with Hotch! Thank god! I think I would've lost my patience if I would have had to endure another moment of her than is absolutely necessary. Plus, she didn't really know Emily all that well, so it wouldn't make sense to devote a scene to her to talk about how Emily's death impacted her.
I still think she is a useless waste of space who adds nothing to the show. What's sadder is that even when she is saying something of consequence, I can't help but tune out, because her delivery is just so poor. It feels as though the writers are purposely giving her irrelevant lines to make her annoy us further, even the team did not react to some of the things she said in this episode. She needs to disappear asap, and make way for a more credible character(the return of Emily and JJ would be ideal), and hopefully a superior actress who actually knows how to act and is versatile enough to channel different emotions and expressions through her acting.
Another thing I missed out in my post: With Reid's mystery headaches, and now in the previous episode him wondering if Gideon was right, that maybe the job isn't worth it, does anyone else think they're opening the door for his possible exit? I don't know..he just seemed so broken and desolate. He line about his dad made me want to give him a big hug <3 I know MGG is contracted until the end of season7, but I can't help but wonder.
@Sara Hotch does know JJ is alive. He is in on it. When he went into the hallway at the hospital with JJ her words to him were "She made it".
Of course Hotch doesn't need someone to talk to! He knows the truth! When he was talking to Morgan, I so could see Morgan hitting him if (and when) he ever discovers the truth.
They all looked so broken and devistated. I just want to hug them all.
I loved last night's eppisode. It was so much better then last week's. I was crying at the end.
The Canadian channel didn't show the preview for next week, but I read it. Strauss goes with them to see how they are dealing with the loss of Prentiss??? Does she really have to do that???? I did at one point have a thought. Maybe the unsub gets to her! :P
I loved this episode. It was great to see so much of Hotch and his negotiation strategy with the unsub mother was great. It was good to see him back at doing his speciality, which is bringing unsubs down to where they can arrest them and not just shoot them. I do get so tired of the killing of the unsub instead of sending them through the justice system and having justice truly be served.
The sessions with Hotch were wonderful, listening to our agents express their feelings and emotions in regards to the death of Emily was good. Great ending of them with Rossi and Hotch discussing Hotch's feelings as well as Rossi's. It was apropo for Rossi to consider Hotch in this. He has been a good friend for much longer than any of the others and knew Haley more before her death. He would know more of how Hotch is feeling about losing another female in his life. That female may only have been a co-worker and subordinate but she was still someone that he connected with on a casual level once in a while.
I would love to see a Hotch episode where he truly gets broken down, how would he come back from that? I love to see breakdowns and recoverys, I think Reid is heading towards a breakdown but we will have to see. He is so extremely sensitive and can at times of blinders on when it comes to focusing on what needs to be done. Highly intelligent people have been known to break when too much tragedy has occured in a short amount of time. It will be intersting to see if Reid can overcome his grief.
I did enjoy this episode immensely.
Christy
This episode reminded me of last years episode Haunted when it came to the unsub portion of the story
I liked the episode, mainly however for the scenes between Hotch and the team which were utterly heartbreaking. Reid's meeting with Hotch and his wobbly sad voice broke my heart into teeny tiny pieces. The comment about Gideon was interesting (and worrying), the poor boy is becoming completely overwhelmed and burnt out. Reid needs help and fast. It was nice to see a scene between Reid and Hotch we don't have many of those anymore.
I also loved the scene between Hotch and Rossi and was really glad that Rossi was there for Hotch.
Slightly too unsub centric for my liking (like most of the episodes nowadays) but I have to say that the actress did a fabulous job.
I was very glad that Seaver didn't get a scene with Hotch. I'm sorry, I try each week to feel better about Seaver but I still really, really do not like her. :-(
Also liked seeing more Hotch this week. I may be a devoted Reid girl but I love Hotch and I've missed him this season.
Does anyone know the significance of the episode title? I know they said Hanley Waters was the man who started the high-speed chase that killed the child, but his name was mentioned exactly once.
So now I'm thinking "Hanley Waters" is an anagram that I'm missing.
Any guesses? Or am I just thinking too much?
Wonderful, wonderful episode!
What I loved:
Profiling!
Everyone on the team got a little special moment.
You guys remembered that Hotch is the unit chief and not Morgan.
Wonderful actress playing the unsub.
I can now totally tune out Seaver as if she isn't there.
What I didn't really like:
Every time someone from the team asked a question out loud, Seaver was always answering. Every single time. You writers have to get together and pick a level for her, is she learning or not? Don't just give her all of Prentiss' lines and think it's ok.
What is discussed by the team prior to the briefing they do with the local police is never the same. There was a lot of jumping to conclusions. Car
accident? When did you discuss that?
Anyway, I'm really looking forward to what is going to happen with the team from now on.
Hotch: "It’s been a hard year. We’ll get through it."
Rossi: "Yes, we will."
Oh, the meta.
I feel you, show.
This fan is with you guys until the end.
Alana
Anonymous said...
"Despite getting 13 million viewers last week, Criminal Minds only made 11th place on the Network top 20, bumped from the Top 10 (the spin-off didn't even crack the list last week). On the 18-19 index, Criminal Minds only made 11th place with 4.6."
You know, Anonymous, CM will always get screwed by the network, if it's 10th or 11th place on that list. The cast won't be appreciated, the producers will be forced to make tough decisions and adapt thanks to CBS stupid decisions and we, the fans, will have no say in any of it and will have to suck it up.
So, don't worry.
6 years in and still one of the top 10 each week, still holding strong against American Idol, plus, you can compare it to the spin off, which is only making 9 millions, 10 tops without SVU against it.
@cmwinner - Oh, I know that. It's just that some people before me were saying that it's not what JJ told him and that he should'nt know...yada yada. I just want him to know because I'm a Protch and I just think it'd be an amazing storyline for when (stressing the when) the team finds out and how they will react.
I think it's really telling that Hotch DEMANDED that he was the one to do the sessions. He wants to know where the team is at first-hand because well...they're basically grieving a person who is still alive.
Also, although I wrote in my previous post that the fact that they haven't let go of Prentiss seems like they're building up for it to explode, I just had this sinking feeling that the writers are just wagging us along, throwing us a little bone along the way.
Rossi terrific. Just a beautifully acted role. Mantegna's got something that gives bite and depth.
I just wasn't drawn into this episode. not sure what it was, found myself disinterested in the case! I did love how much Hotch there was in it though :)
I liked that everything in the episode was about grief and guilt. The actress who played the unsub was good. There were nice profiling moments. I liked the team moments with Hotch, specially the Hotch/Morgan moments. At one moment I thought Hotch was going to tell Morgan that Emily is alive. He looked like he wasn`t able to watch Morgan`s grief and pain anymore and he couldn`t even look Morgan in the eye then. Great acting by Moore and Gibson.
Rewatch the episode...everything Hotch said to the Unsub at the end was a response to each of his interviews with his team members. Great writing!
Reid and Garcia made me want to cry! Glad that Morgan mentioned wanting to ge get Doyle, makes me hope they will get him! Poor Hotch, at least he has Rossi to talk to. Loved that Rossi said that the team was the best marriage he ever had.
Seaver was also great last night she is becoming more confident.
Hotch's little speech at the end was so sad but sweet. The team needed to hear that. When Reid and Hotch were talking it alarmed me that Reid said that he thought Gideon might be right about it might not being worth it. I hope Hotch's words helped them all.
I just finished wiatching this episode. Thank you for finally making it a Hotch centric episode. I liked all the parallels, TG's acting is great, as was Shemar Moore's. Rossi is dramatic and cool as usual. Garcia was great too, and Reid.
Reid can always take everything and give it technical meaning. Or make it sound scienctific I mean. Love Reid and Hotch.
I always get a happy jolt whenever Hotch is seen without a blazer or when he's in regular clothes! I love TG and he is finally getting something worth his acting abilities.
This episode was well written. I felt bad for the mom but I gotta say, I really understood the father's need to keep everything hidden and private.
Seaver was still seaver in this episode. Illogically wirtten and talking just to say that she contributes when she really doesnt. Since she's constantly asking questions about profiling though, she should not be delivering profiles. It makes her character even more unbelievable. Hopefully she wont be there for long.
Looking forward to next week's episode. I wonder if it will be anthing like Camus' book The Stranger. Hopefully its got plenty of Hotch in it too.
Although there was a still a little more unsub for my taste; I thoroughly enjoyed Hanley Waters and have come to appreciate Randy Huggins for the way he has captured the nuances of the characters in such a short time. He’s the best writer for the Hotch character, much like Andrew Wilder used to be; and he’s able to balance the team members overall demeanor and emotions in a realistic way. Rick Dunkle is the other writer who captures the passions of characters’ while balancing the action in a cohesive and effective manner.
Since this episode was written by Huggins and Alicia Kirk, I’ve made the assumption that Kirk was responsible for the scripting of the unsub who was ably portrayed by Kelli Williams. William’s portrayal of the grief-stricken, guilt-ridden mother unable to deal with her emotions and anger at what she believed was the authorities’ failure to save her son. The writers contrasted her emotion with that of Morgan’s, who in a similar way, was equally as angry, guilt-ridden and grief-stricken because he didn’t get to Prentiss in time enough to save her.
Hotch is like the hero father, who already appears to have made the adjustment and has compartmentalized his grief enough to be able to run the assessments of his team. The wife doesn’t understand how the father could have moved on so quickly; as Rossi and Morgan questioned Hotch about his assessment of the team, how he’s holding up and who will assess his condition.
Kirk did a far better job with the unsub in Hanley Waters than the unsub in the dreadful Today I Do, where the unsub was overwrought, unsympathetic and hard to watch. Today I Do was immediately erased from my DVR.
I understand why Hotch opted to perform the assessments of the team. As the only person (along with JJ) who knows Prentiss is still alive, he has to be able to control and limit the potential fallout for his team. An outside analyst could recommend some harsh remedy that could possibly not be undone; like breaking up the team, reassigning individual members, or moving them from active duty altogether. Knowing Emily is alive means Hotch has to go the extra mile to ensure that the team endures as little negative impact as possible, even if it means he’s betraying them. BTW, Hotch’s knowledge of Prentiss still being alive was confirmed repeatedly by one of the crew members via Twitter; and I also vaguely remember Paget confirming that JJ and Hotch were the only ones who know during her chat.
The assessments themselves were classic: Reid portrays the innocent rapt with guilt and hurt with skillfulness. You can feel his pain and sense of loss; and his confusion which is making him question himself and the team’s purpose, much like Gideon. Garcia is always moving as her personality won’t allow her to focus on Emily’s loss; but the good times they shared. Rossi and Hotch’s scene was brilliantly written as Rossi briefly flipped the script on Hotch who nearly broke, but quickly recaptured his composure to control the assessment of Rossi. And Rossi’s comparison of his bond with the team being stronger than this three marriages was honest and insightful. It was wise of the writers not to exacerbate a volatile situation by allowing Seavers to participate in the assessment. It would have been irresponsible and insulting because of the passions the character inflames; and because it would have been a reminder of what we’ve all lost by way of AJ/JJ and Paget/Prentiss. As a matter of fact, the presence of the Seavers character is a constant reminder of our loss; especially since the cost has so outweighed the benefit.
cont...
cont...
I loved Hotch’s poignant negotiation scene with the mother and was glad and relieved to see that the writers weren’t compelled to turn it over to Morgan. Hotch was engaging and compassionate; and I love how TG changes the inflection of his voice to denote the various ranges of emotion.
I like the way CM is pairing writers in what appears to be an attempt to provide a well-written unsub coupled with well-developed character interaction and focus; Huggins and Kirk this week, Rick Dunkle and Kimberly Ann Harrison on the next episode. Both Huggins and Dunkle have great skill at capturing and balancing the emotions and nuances of the characters; while the less seasoned writers can focus on the gyrations of the unsubs. It makes for a more compelling episode with great character interaction.
My expectations for next week’s episode are even higher than for Hanley because it’s a Dunkle episode; and he’s the historian on all things CM; and because his character portrayals and script movement are typically on point. Couple that with Harrison’s successful episode, Into the Woods, which was a very balanced, team-focused episode that gave just enough unsub attention; while portraying the child victims as precocious and crafty survivors. The Stranger should be the best Season 6 has to offer—no pressure.
As of this hour:
"Criminal Minds was up 3% to a 3.6 adults 18-49 rating, but Criminal Minds: Suspect Behavior dropped to to a series low 2.1 adults 18-49 rating, down 9% from last week (and only 1.9 adults 18-49 rating for its second half hour, dropping from the first half hour’s 2.2)."
Is anybody at the office at CBS?
TG and SM should absolutely get what they are requesting contract wise. If it were not for TG, SM, MGG, KV and JM, CM would be in a very bad spot now due to the lousy decisions made because of the spin-off. Dump that disaster of a spin-off and get AJ and Paget back on CM!!
I thought of another song that could be on the potential CM soundtrack and is great for characters on the show, especially Hotch. Its Edge of the Earth by 30 seconds to Mars. That and You know my name by Chris cornell are Hotch's theme songs in my mind.
I am a big music fan and I quite like this topic.
Anyway, sdwally,
I really like your insights into the epsidoe and the characters. Hotch really does have such admirable compusure and I think that season 7 should start off with the team trying to find Emily.
This season should end with the team finding out that Emily is alive.
OK, guys, I am skimming big time but wanted to jump in:
Kelly Martin was the young cute brunette who was the big sis in "Life Goes on" with the brother named Cory with Down's Syndrome. Pretty sure - d/n ck. Sev yrs later, she was a resident (?) on ER, dated Carter(Noah Wylie) and was gunned down on the job. Great actress but not as good as Kelly Williams, last nite's unsub who was incredibly authentic and it was so easy to empathsize w/ her.
Loved the grief sessions:
Lin from Ohio: YES! Morgan was approrpriately Morgan: angry enuf and I luv that he talked about going after EP's killer. Also appreciated him listing the "steps" - I love learning these things and it makes us such a part of the show we love to love.
This helped to compensate for his totally INAPPROPRIATE attitude last wk in the cupcake scene w/ Garcia. As I said before, NOT! I don't know how SM could even choke those badly written lines out of his mouth. WAY better this week.
Reid was so sad, so typically Reid, I wanted to hold him to me so badly (don't we all!) but I am dying that Hotch is not picking up on how close to cracking he really is; unless Hotch's own grief is preventing him to be as intuitive as he usu is. Hotch appeared right on track with all the others, and did a fabulous job with Shelly (the mom) at the end. Only someone who is a parent and suffered a loss could have done such a great job of turning such a volatile situ around. JMHO. He's the man and was so in charge the way I like him-oh, yeah, his royal Hotchness was back!
Blue and Carla: OMG, when some lines were blurted from that mouth, I have a hard time staying in my seat. Where does a rookie get this opinionated, outspoken-ness? If she is ever going to be accepted, I think she needs to appear far less cocky. Enuf on that subject...
Optika: heard the song by 30 seconds from Mars just last nite and loved it. Have noted it and will look for it to listen again.
Heard another new artist, Lissie, day before yesterday who I liked alot but have only heard 1 of her songs so far.
I want to learn more about a couple other new bands for our proposed new music list for CM. Thinking that if we can cite a few lines, descibe its tone, that maybe TPTB will read here and get ideas, OR that Criminal Minds Fan will give us some ideas on how to get our list to them. The more I think about it, the more I am convinced that the music is such a big part of the show, and can further its success, as have other shows have becomepopular by playing such cool and memorable music.
TTFN!
But Optika don't they already know where she is at least Hotch does. So why would they look for her. Do you mean without Hotch?
It was a good episode.
I loved the plot with the grieving mother, it was very well played and it was interesting.
I didn't think Hotch would be the one to do the team's assessment.
It did give us nice scenes of the team.
I'll also add that I agree with the others who said they would like to see more scenes between Hotch and Reid.
Their personal interactions were always very interesting (I always loved every scene where they would interact on a personal level) and it has been missing lately.
I was glad for the scene they had in this episode, but I wish it had been longer.
Anyway, the whole team is hurting.
If the team discovers Prentiss is alive, there definitely will be tension within the team, anger and resentment. If P. Brewster comes back I wonder how the writers will deal with that. Morgan will certainly be very angry at first if he learns the true.
To Optika.
I don't know if we'll learn anything about Prentiss during the season's finale.
I don't think P. Brewster will have given her decision regarding C.M. soon enough for that. CBS should decides about the pilots getting picked up on May 25, way too late for Paget Brewster's decision to influence in any way the season's finale (who will have already aired by then).
It's true that there could still do something about the team learning about Prentiss, but the episode should justify that, plot wise. And from what little we know it doesn't seem to involve the Ian Doyle storyline at all (something I'm very grateful for I'll admit).
There probably will be a cliffhanger at the end of the episode and it'll have to be continued in the first episode of the seventh season.
If Paget decides to come back, maybe we'll see Prentiss at the end of the first episode of the seventh season, and things will get sorted out in the second episode. Just a thought.
Michael,
I mean the rest of the team excluding Hotch should eventually be able to clue in that Emily is still alive and figure out how to find her. Season 7 could start off that way.
You are referring to Emily right? Do you mind clarifying that for me Michael. Thanks
Gubegirl,
I keep listening to Edge of the Earth and daydreaming about Hotch lol
I've heard of Lissie. I only know the song When I'm alone which is a great JJ/Emily song.
For Morgon, On this Ting by Adam Deacon or Petrified by Fort Minor, for Reid, Weapon by Matthew Good and for Garcia, this song was featured in her Penelope ep, Holly Golightly's Virtually Happy. Rossi...hmm he is a tough one. I'll have to think of that.
Elisabeth,
you're right but Paget doesnt need to appear in the season finale, just an inkling that she may be out there would be good. The team will surely have issues, but they'll get over it becuase they will understand.
I wonder what Emily is doing anyway, Is she hunting Doyle or just living in Europe as someone else entirely?
Write to CBS about getting a Criminal Minds soundtrack out. Send in track listings too if you like.
We've came up with some great songs so lets do this!
yep Optika i mean Emily ;-)
it is gonna be interesting to watch that unfold seeing the team figure out there is more to the story then they know
Good episode. The only thing I'd say is that it would have had even more impact if it had been a rare unsub-heavy episode amongst majority "whodunnits". But, I still enjoyed it.
The actress who played the grieving mother was superb and I like the way the team's grief was interspersed throughout the show.
Good to see more of Hotch (that'll please my Mum!) and back to his best in the field, although the counselling type scenes suggest that he's not dealing with things as well as he presents to the others. This could be in part due to the guilt he feels about knowing Prentiss is still alive and that he's not the type of guy to be open about his emotions. Could have interesting consequences either this season or next season (if CBS pull their finger out of their @r$e) if he lets things build up.
Reid: He's in a really bad way and either Hotch hasn't noticed or he doesn't know how to deal with a colleague in such a fragile emotional state. His comment relating to Gideon made me wonder if he's sliding rapidly into full-on depression, exacerbated by his worry about the (stress-related?) headaches and the constant worry he'll become schizophrenic. I wonder what'll trigger him to let it all out? Hmmmm, more potentially interesting viewing.
I found a promo for next week's episode - that's going to creep me out immensely (yes, there's a hockey stick behind the bedroom door, just in case).
I was listening to the music more than usual this episode. Did I hear correctly that there was a composed discrete creepy version of "Happy birthday" during the scene in the burger place? If so, nice touch.
As for the CM soundtrack, I can't be much help apart from suggesting facetious tracks for an alternative soundtrack for each character à la Blue Öyster Cult's "Don't fear the Reaper" for Hotch and The Smiths' "Heaven knows I'm miserable now" for Reid.
(I know, it's straight to hell for me).
Finally, I assumed Hanley Waters was a place. Oh dear.
I liked the way each character appeared to be representing one of the five stages of grief. Reid is in the depression stage. His behavior is perfectly normal and not something that needs raise alarm flags IMO.
I thought this episode was a generally good balance of unsub and character interaction. Of course it was heavy on unsub, but at least the team had good moments. It was nice to see the core team talking with Hotch as he did their assessments. I can understand why Hotch would want to do them, since Strauss usually has a negative agenda when it comes to this team. Every team member grieved in a way that was unique to them. Morgan was angry and blamed himself for not getting to Emily sooner so he could save her. Penelope only wants to focus on the good memories and not think about the ugly stuff. Reid was heartbreaking in his grief, sadness and guilt over failing to protect Emily. It is alarming that he raised the specter of Gideon and questioning whether or not this job is worth it. I definitely think the writers want us to believe Reid is heading for a major depressive episode, but I hope someone steps in soon to take care of him. Both Morgan and Hotch know Reid is struggling with his grief and health problems (at least Morgan does). I hope they rectify their seeming indifference to Reid’s distress after Tobias Hankel and intervene soon. You would think they would at least be worrying if he was going to start using Dilaudid again to numb the pain. Clearly Reid hasn’t really been in therapy since his father left him, so he’s been pretty much left to deal with his issues on his own. I really like Hotch and Rossi’s relationship, since it is more of a relationship of equals and not senior/subordinate. Rossi is the one person Hotch can relax and open up to, and Rossi is about the only one that tries to get him to open up. It’s easy to see why Rossi came back from retirement since he is closer to the job and the team than his ex wives (of course they are his exes for a reason). It was good to see the grief link between Haley and Emily’s deaths and how Hotch has also been pretty much dealing with it on his own. You could especially see in the final scene with Morgan that keeping the secret of Emily’s survival might be starting to eat at him. He has to watch his team go through personal hell, because they believe one of their beloved friends is dead. He can’t tell them, and he has no one else to confide in about that to help him carry the burden (because I doubt he’s just calling up JJ to talk about it). His pain is different than the others with regards to Emily, but it is no less heavy than the rest of the team.
The unsub was sad in her grief, guilt and anger over her son’s death.
Yeah the one year anniversary of your son’s death and his final birthday is definitely a trigger to take her rage out on those who she felt didn’t help her son. Of course, if Florida didn’t have a three day waiting period, the only person to die in this episode would have been her ex husband. I did feel it was rather unrealistic for her to just pick up a revolver one-handed and kill four men with it. At least I never thought she had any gun experience, since she didn’t own the gun or have a permit or license. But hey, we needed something exciting to get the episode started and to lure in the BAU. I could see how the profiling might have some leaps in logic, but it didn’t seem TOO far out of bounds to be implausible. That standoff in Sir Burger was scary, because she was emotionally unhinged. That poor boy will never forget his seventh birthday where the psychotic lady made him eat his cake and almost open presents while waving a gun around. Yeah, thanks Shelley for needlessly traumatizing an innocent child.
(cont)...
...(cont)
It was good to see Hotch front and center this episode and providing the calm, cool leadership I like from him. He is able to convey empathy with just a change in tone of voice and facial expressions. He more than anyone else could talk down the unsub. He knows what it is like to be a parent, and he knows how close he came to losing Jack. He knows the guilt and anger over failing to save a loved one’s life and feeling like he should have been able to do more. However, Hotch was right to focus on Damian’s happiness while was alive and to emphasize that happiness and confidence came from the fact that Shelley was a good mom to try and alleviate some of her guilt. Plus he tried to get her to face the fact that accepting a loss and moving on does not mean cutting that person out of your life or your heart, but it is the only way to survive and keep living.
The final scene between Hotch and Morgan was a good counterpoint to that scene. Morgan feels the same amount of anger and guilt over his inability to save Emily’s life and he keeps dwelling on things that he could have done differently to change the outcome. The difference is that Morgan hasn’t devolved into a violent, psychotic rage, and he won’t, since he is not grieving alone, but has the team with him. It will be interesting if the team ever finds out the truth about Emily. If Paget comes back to the show, of course they will, but I have a feeling if she doesn’t, the team will forever be in the dark. I can’t see them chasing after Doyle on their own, since tracking terrorists isn’t the BAU’s typical bailiwick.
@ sf81387 - I wondered about that too (the team representing the five stages).
I'd say on its own Reid's reaction would be OK (ish), but when combined with what's been happening to him prior to that I wonder if it'll end up being too much for him. I'm not suggesting a full-on meltdown, but he'll have to let it out sooner or later.
Yeah, I really do think Reid is headed towards a breakdown.
I mean, I didn't know Reid was in therapy after his father left when he was a child--there are so many gaps when trying to map out Reid's life prior to the BAU. It's nice to have a little more information.
I was a little concerned with Morgan's clinical concern of Reid in last week's episode, but I realized something--the hierarchy of the team. Morgan had to be strong for Reid, and Hotch had to be strong for Morgan when the latter rages.
I just hope Reid is not really heading toward a breakdown.
Maybe things will turn out differently, I certainly hope to see another resolution to his medical problems (let it be a physical problem, please).
Blimey Limey:
love the Smiths: something by them def belongs on the "proposed" list, "Heaven Knows I'm Miserable" fits Reid somehow but another one might be a better generic choice:)
Saw Demonology again the other nite: love that "My Side of the Story (Hodges) this def belongs on the soundtrack along with "Broken" by Lifehouse and the Johnny Cash songs.
Anyone realize that the Tipper song Illabye is used in S 1: The Fox, AND Natural Born Killers AND S 5: Mosley Lane???
LaShawna:
I did not realize that Reid had received therapy after his father's abandonment. Is that what you meant to say or did we misunderstand you? If true, did they divulge this in the epis where Reid's dad is suspected of the Riley Jenkins murder?
Music again: Anyone come up with an explanation as to why orig epis' music may not be included on the DVD'S? Is this a rights/residuals Issue? Do they make substitutions?
I just interpreted what was said in the Reid/Hotch assessment scene to be he had some sort of therapy or counseling after his father abandoned him. Reid said that he hadn't talked to anyone like this since his father left, and at the time, he essentially told people what he knew they wanted to hear. That also seemed to indicate to me he hadn't had any sort of counseling for any of his traumatic issues since then.
Seeing the unsub lose her child early made this episode too predictable and by-the-number.
I was impatiently waiting for them to say , oh there was a loss/accident and for Garcia to hurry up and do her magic fingers/instant data recall thing to locate the Dad. It was a rehash of Normal.
BUT, the best thing was the team talking to Hotch about their feelings.
We as fans needed to hear that Prentiss meant something to them and they are still hurting.
It's like Elle never existed and Gideon barely gets a mention.
I liked how Reid mentioned being in counseling after his Dad left but he managed to get away with just saying what adults want to hear. He really could outfox adults back then to keep them at bay. Poor kid.
The whole reference to Jones when he told Gideon he wanted to walk away from the BAU was making me nervous.
So it seems that the writers are beholden to the wishes of CBS since they had to write JJ and Prentiss off the show. So since all the rest are having contracts up this or next year, maybe the writers are under pressure from above to write possible exit strategies for the cast.
That seems to be the case since they constantly make hints like the headaches and now the team sounds like they're adrift and reconsidering staying on the team.
Yikes!!!
LaShawna: Thanks, I will go back and re-watch this to see just what Reid said. My husband was talking during the epi and I prob'ly need to see most of it again as he could not follow the grief sessions as they were interjected: he thought Hotch was trying to counsel them while they were working the case:) Oh, how naive those non-fanatics are, huh?
Also meant to say that as glad as I am that dealt with all the serious issues last nite, I still cannot understand why that was not LAST week's epi and the other way around? I think someone else here noticed it, too, it just felt weird but I guess better late than never!
I wanted to respond about Hotch almost telling Morgan about Prentiss being alive. He would do that because he is a lousy liar and he does not like liars. He is not expressing grief for Emily in the same way that the others are. He is manifesting held in anger about the fact that she had lied to him when they first met and she joined the team and that she has again throughout the time on the team. If she would come back I don't know if he could feel that she was trustworthy. I think he appreciates her abilities but would have trust issues with her.
The few times that we saw him attempt to lie he was not good at it and I think that is why he decided to do the assessments of the team. He did not want Straus to assess him. I don't believe that he could have hidden his anger about lies. He can with the others because he knows them better and they would not notice his feelings as much because of their emotions clouding their assessment of him. Rossi came close but he saw the anger and the grief for both Hayley and for Prentiss. He did not see that Hotch was lying about his feelings for Prentiss because he is still hurting over the loss of his wife, a woman who had been a part of life for more than twenty years.
Just my thoughts.
christy zachman: very good points, food for thought. Hotch is very dif than the others and he is the boss. and he is a real stickler re: trust. I had thought about future trust issues right away but did not the rest too much thought and I believe you could be right.
LaShawna: went back and re-watched and you are right: Reid states that he was made to talk to someone after his dad left but acted like he was not truly benefited by this therapy and pretty much said and did what he was told to. Kinda like he just went thru the motions. Prob'ly shell-shocked, he was so young.
Gubegirl, I have to wonder about that statement Reid made. I can't believe they really let him come back to work after the Tobias abduction without at least a psych eval. It wouldn't make sense. Again, he would have told them what they wanted to hear, but still -- changing the script from "the last time I was on a couch like this ..." to "the FIRST time I was on a couch like this ..." would have made a lot more sense.
Lin from Ohio: You're right but I don't think he has ever rec'd and treatment or he may not be so stressed. Think he is trying to diagnose and fix himself. Don't they also get counseling when there has been a shooting incident? He has been shot and they all have shot criminals and I don't remember anyone other than Elle getting therapy to return to work. Maybe 'cause "this is TV," they stick that part in when it fits their purpose and is not accurately representation?
Re:less, Reid really NEEDS SOMETHING SOON, and I hope that he gets help before something ir-reparable takes place.
When he gets into therapy, we will use John Mayer's song, "In Repair" for his mantra: "...I'm not together but I'm getting there..."
'Course, JM's "Vultures" or even "Stop this Train" would be fitting for Reid: "Stop this train, I want to get off and go home again. I can't take the speed it's moving in. I know I can't, but honestly, won't someone stop this train?"
Love Mayer's lyrics - they have only used one song of his that I know of:"Gravity" in S2,Honor among Thieves, my least fave epi ever.
Rosalie; just wanted confirm that you were spot on with the quick turn around on the profile. One minute they're were talking one theory and the next they knew she had suffered a loss of child..WTH?! I actually chuckled over this with my husband. But..it is television. I also think they need to have Reid hit his breaking point over all this. I dont want to see him in an insane asylum but just be truly out of character. MGG is such a good actor I just dont know why he and TG haven't received awards?!
In reality, yeah, someone who has gone through a traumatic event like Tobias Hankel or getting shot would have to have counseling. But in the Criminal Minds universe, this doesn't seem to happen. I'm sure Reid had to undergo some sort of psych eval before being cleared for work after his multiple traumatic events, but he's so smart he would know exactly what to say to the psychologist and run rings around him/her. Morgan essentially said Hotch did the same thing, because he was cleared for work only 30 days after being stabbed by Foyet. He said Hotch helped create the questions these psychologists ask, so he knows what he needs to say. I feel both Hotch and Reid are extremely reluctant to ask for help, even if they truly need it. Hotch just seems to bury his emotions under a heavy layer of alpha maleness, and Reid seems to internalize his pain and tries to fix himself. Both seem to have a fear of appearing weak before their colleagues, Hotch because he is the alpha male boss and has to project strength and confidence for the team, and Reid, because he is the baby of the team, and doesn't want to appear weak by asking for help. When either of them do open up to someone they care about, it is almost a lightning shock to watch, for me anyway. You know they have to be on a proverbial emotional ledge for them to do that.
When either of them do open up to someone they care about, it is almost a lightning shock to watch, for me anyway.
Maybe they can open up to each other. We can finally see Reid's apartment where he and Hotch will be shooting tequila and comparing their physical and mental battle scars. Who knows, maybe Sergio the cat will even be there. ; )
I would love to see what all the characters homes look like. We've seen Hotch's and Emily's and Rossi's but Rossi was only for a few minutes in his first episode and in Damged, mostly his bedroom.
I think the episodes where the interteam profiling takes place are very interesting because I like to learn more about the characters. Itgives insight into why they want to do what they do and why they continue doing it.
We've seen Garcia's too. She has a cool place and its right on with who she is.
But more personal information and trivia about the team members would be cool becuase it helps flesh them out in other dimensions and makes them more relateable for the audience. They are people aside from being profilers and I'd like to see who they are when they're not working a case.
YES!! That's what I'm talking about! Hotch and Reid doing shots and confessing their deep dark emotions to each other. Perfect. I would pay good money to see that scene. :)
And I think Reid needs a cat to take care of and snuggle with (yes, he would have a snuggly cat). Or at least a big, warm, stuffed teddy bear to sleep with at night. :)
@ sf81387 - I'd love to see Sergio back again, pmsl at the thought of the cat being the centre of attention at Reid & Hotch's tequila party!
@ Gubegirl - What about another classic by the Smiths for Rossi... "This charming man"? Or "Handsome devil" for Morgan? Haha.
Actually, all joking aside, there's an absolute beauty of a track by the Smiths called "Asleep"; the lyrics are so poignant, although I'm not sure if any of the team are ready to top themselves yet. Anyone who's interested can find it on youtube.
Another track I'd say is more relevant is "Atlantic" by Keane. I think it was on CSI:NY a couple of years back but I could so imagine it playing in the background if they ever showed Reid returning to his apartment after a hellish case. Again, wonderful lyrics. The official video (which is weird to say the least) is on youtube.
From what Reid said to Hotch, I assumed he'd been made to receive counselling when his dad left but Reid being Reid he already knew what to say in order to tell the shrink what they wanted to hear. Although I'd also wondered about psych evaluations after traumatic events at work, he must have had them after the Hankel case and after getting shot. In theory.
Yeah, and how did they make that sudden leap to that she'd lost a child? I noticed that too. Losing *someone*, who is then refined to a child would have been more credible.
@ LaShawna - He can have my Garfield clone...
Other songs are To Build a Home by the Cinematic Orchestra from Children of The Dark for everyone and THe Funeral by band of horses for spencer from revelations.
The only reason I can imagine that leap of logic to the unsub losing a child, is what kind of loss is most likely to drive a woman to a violent rampage? I'm not saying that thought is supported by data (I have no clue), but I'm guessing that was the thought process. Plus, they had to speed the episode along to the conclusion. :)
I just took a criminal minds character quiz and I got Emily!
I don't know if we'll really see Reid going to a therapist.
It'll depend on where they will take the storyline about his migraines I suppose.
We still don't really know what is causing his headaches and Reid himself seems puzzled by that one.
Of course they could have him go through a major depressive episode/nervous breakdown and he could need a therapist help.
But they could also surprise us and give us a different reason for his headaches.
I'm not sure we can completely rule out an organic cause missed by the physicians he saw (a scenario I would myself prefer).
His session with Hotch might just be indicative of Reid being in the depression phase of the grieving process. Morgan is clearly in the anger phase. I'm not sure about Garcia but she could be in the denial phase since she didn't want to talk about Emily being gone (or could it be already "acceptance" since she choose to remember the good things about Emily ?).
So, Reid words during his session with Hotch might just be representative of a phase of the grieving process.
Right now, I just hope the writers know where they are going with this storyline about Reid's health.
If they don't know where they want to go with this story then I'm afraid it'll be badly resolved.
So, let's hope that they planed this in advance and already know what will happen and how it'll happen (instead of figuring it out as they go along with no real pre-established plan).
About Reid's apartment, to tell you the true I'm not sure I would want to see it on screen.
A part of me prefers to imagine what Reid's apartment could be like.
I'm sure that if I saw his apartment something just wouldn't fit or would be missing.
But another part of me would still be curious to see what they would come up with on that front.
There are a lot of things that I prefer to not see about their private life, I think it's best to keep some mystery and to leave some things to the fans imagination.
That said, @sf81387, I love your idea of Hotch and Reid shooting tequila and talking. Those two could have so much to talk about given their respective battle scars.
And I would love to learn that Reid kept Emily's cat.
Optika, I've taken numerous CM personality quizzes and I always get Emily <3!
The soundtrack thing, which was that song at the end of "Fisher King 2"? I can't seem to remember the name, but it's one of my favourite parts of the episode. It always fills me with warmth. Watching Hotch clean the blood off Elle's wall is such a touching and poignant moment, Reid and his mom in the plane is another great moment.
About his headaches, this storyline has been dragging. I'm slowing starting to lose interest, I just hope they resolve it soon. Or just leave it. It's becoming quite lame, I just want the old seasons' Reid back.
heyya,
i understand what you mean about the dragging storyline, but at the same time I am very curious about what the writers have in stor for Reid this time. You'd think they'd move onto Morgon with the unbearable amount of grief but its usually Reid or Hotch.
As for the song, whether you are referring to the dvd version or the tv version, either way Im not sure. But my fave scene was with Hotch cleaning Elle's walls. very sweet and strong moment. I didnt like how Elle blamed him afterwards though. It didnt make sense to me but whatever.
Emily is great to get in a personality quiz. I've only taken it once but I'll take it again at some ppoint.
what about the music from The Fox episode it was really haunting and creepy and probably one of the best episodes in my opinion
I know this isn't artists but it was good nontheless
That song at the end of The Fisher King is The Riddle by Five for Fighting. I've always loved the scene with Hotch cleaning Elle's wall.
The fox was a great episode as wwas outfoxed. I'd like to see what happened with a few of the other unsubs as well.
Yeah i think we will see the unsub from the woods again that killed raped ypung boys and killed them. Really hope the team can catch that sicko soon
meant young ;-)
I've always wanted to see Nathan show up again and reek havoc causing Reid to be torn about saving his life.
I feel that the Reid-H.A. thing will be resolved soon. I think they know we are anxious about it and will comply - they have been leading up to it. I don't want it to be a physical issue -must be psych-it's Reid, for God's sake!
Also feel that they will resolve it at least to the point of having it be under control enuf for him to continue to work - they are missing too many players already to go w/o Reid, don't you think? I am eager to see more and I don't want it to be "dangled" much longer.
Blimey Limey: Love the Smiths and never get to hear them - will ck those tracks out ASAP. The titles are wonderful! If you decide to pass on TJ, you need to stop in San Diego, we'll have a mini CM convention with the DVD's, and analyzing the music! Maybe we can haul a laptop out to the backyard and sit in the jacuzzi under the palm trees with some wine and get real creative.
I am totally into the old 80's stuff and anyone British from Depeche Mode and Talking Heads to contemporary David Gray and James Blunt turn me on.
You would be welcome, too, Optika, and we have a real music fest. After a long hard nite of "work", we'll hit the Original Pancake House for the best coffee, pancakes, waffles and fresh squeezed OJ you have ever had!
Pat: Love Five for Fighting: my husband was shocked to learn he is only one guy! and more impressed re: hockey title (family are Candian hockey nuts)
Michael: Will go back and listen to the music from the Fox. sounds like one I liked.I printed out the list of music from S 1 forward and want to compare it now to the writers for mood, etc. Let's see who's still around that we can appeal to? Some of their own orchestrated-on-the-set has been really good and mood-setting. Maybe we should be talking to the Fantinis or whomever's names appear with the music credits?
gubegirl: not a hockey nut but am a Canuck. A song that always brings Reid to mind when I hear it is Don Henley's End of the Innocence, love that song.
I too am anxious to learn the true about Reid's headaches.
I, for one, would prefer it to be a physical issue over a psych one.
I guess we'll learn soon anyway what it's really about.
in the season finale maybe
Pat: Greetings, Canuck! am not a hockey nut either, but do not tell my son or husband - hah!
Jeez, guys, wouldn't that just stink if Reid's H.A./stress/phobia stuff peaks during the finale but than becomes a cliffhanger? Damn, I think that would really be a drag but I can see the possibility - tell me I'm wrong! What else would keep Reid luv'rs coming back than (if Reid suffers a breakdown)to see if he gets 1.) a proper diagnosis/prognosis, followed by appropriate therapy,
2.) his focus and mental state back on track, which affects his confidence and work of the team (he always mentions his ability "to do his job", 3.) release with no limitations, to return to work, meaning the field, carrying a gun, etc. not just at the office minding the coffeepot as we have seen him be forced to do, like with his leg injury. I'm thinking he may end up needing meds of some sort?
My mind is racing now and becoming boggled...I need some dinner. LMK what you think and I'll ck back.
Forgot:
Pat: love Don Henley. Love that song. You are right that would be nice for Reid.
The Eagles are amazing in person and put on an incredible concert: Henley and Frey pretty much don't even speak, tho - to each other. Sad.
Considering we still don't know what's really wrong with Reid predicting what's going to happen is more than difficult.
But I think that by the end of the season we'll at least know what's causing his health problems.
Optika, for his sake and for ours, I hope they resolve it soon, and I hope that it's a logical resolution, one that will make sense. I like bluesunflower's ASD theory. I think it fits his personality very well, although are headaches related to it? I can't remember :S!
Yes, Pat! The Riddle is the name, the name escaped me till now, I could only vaguely remember the lyrics. Thanks a lot :) Great song! The Fisher King episodes were my favourite season finale/premier episodes. They were fantastic. Ed Bernero did a great job on them.
Gubegirl, I hope to god they don't make us wait till the season7 premier to reveal what's bugging Reid. That will be tortourous! I think Rossi deserves a season finale. I hope the cliffhanger has something to do with him.
Is it because of Randy Huggins that this episode brought back for me a good measure of the enjoyment I'd been losing? The way the team's attempt to come to terms with grief over the loss of Prentiss framed the telling of the mother's grief over her son was effective & well-done. Kelli Williams is a subtle actress who made you feel her character's pain. I'm glad they showed the one-on-one sessions with Hotch, esp that long moment between him & Rossi. The team's been through a lot & it was good to show this reconnectedness between the Unit Chief & the members. Very pleased there was more Hotch in action, calm, empathetic, & authoritative as at the restaurant. His leaving the mic open so that they heard his words to the bereaved mother was a nice touch.
Sorely missed Prentiss esp at the crime scenes.
Seaver in the team confab scenes (in the room with the evidence board) looked quite fetching I thought, but I'm still finding her smug/flat, & the WISTA (why is she there again?) questioning in my head wouldn't let up either as I watched. It could be due to this perceived complacence that I found myself trying to block her out. This ep has made me anticipate that I'll still want to tune in for the rest of the season, but here's hoping my viewing won't have to be accompanied by a sustained effort to ignore a character.
Oh, and Garcia's lipstick shade was lovely.
heyva, pat, optika: I like the idea of a Rossi finale and it would seem he is due; loved he and TG in the "drinking" scene: reminded me of Denny Crane and Alan Shore of Boston Legal drinking on the balcony every nite after a case!
But how many more epi's are there left? Aren't there usu something like 22 or 23 and we have 20 already? Time to 1.) notice Reid,
2.) get Reid to shrink, 3.) get him diagnosed and get him treated? I dunno...I still think the timeline and hints thusfar may be leading up to a Reid break-down/crack-up in the finale. (I don't see them dropping or disregarding it again now again til next season - they know we are sitting here on pins and needles and feel they have dragged it out enuf.)
Maybe it will be a DUAL-purpose finale: something with Rossi and the case at hand AND Reid totally losing it (pls, sweetie, do not pull your hair out - we've all been doing that long enuf over you-know-who and we really like your hair now that we have gotten used to it:)
Asian Fan: like your WISTA acronym; now pls come up with a substitute for her name that we can use without naming her...I really going going Seaver-less:)
DO NOT READ THIS MICHAEL:)
AND: how is is that Garcia's lipstick always looks so great? Even if the shade she is wearing is not my fave shade, it is always applied so PERFECTLY!
I almost hate to say it, but I loved this episode. Although Emily wasn't in it. Which still tears my heart apart. But then again, she was in it, wasn't she? Through the assessment sessions, palpable in each character's own way of grieving. Although "Hanley Waters" was yet another Unsub heavy episode, I think this time it was a case in which it worked well. Certainly due to Kelli Williams wonderful and heartbreaking portrayal of the grieving mother, IMO.
Each character got good moments. I loved all the different reactions to losing Emily, and I loved that we got to see the team connecting with each other again via Hotch doing the assessments rather than having each of them talk to a shrink from outside the team or worse: Strauss.
As a Hotch-fan, I was thrilled to see him get the focus this time and we got to see his old qualities back. Strong, calm, in charge, decisive, yet sensitive and vulnerable. "You need to stop blaming yourself" - only Hotch could say such a line with so much empathy and persuasiveness because that is exactly what he had to do with regards to not being able to save Haley, and Prentiss.
There was some amount of profiling and it was good, although I agree about the funny logical leap with them all of a sudden knowing that the Unsub must have lost a child. Maybe there was a scene cut in which it was explained how they came to this conclusion? Either that, or we are supposed to assume that they figured that out off-screen. Maybe the writers and directors think it's enough for the audience to hear the conclusions in the briefing rather than show how they come to them. I personally would prefer to actually see them figuring it out however.
Season finale: yes, I would love a Rossi-centric season finale (as long as it does not include too much of You-know-who).
Here's to hoping we won't have to wait another 12 episodes until we get a Hotch-centric one again. He's the Unit Chief and should feature strongly in each episode. That's doesn't necessarily have to translate to sceentime (altough I want as much of that as possble), the other characters have to get their share too. I'm talking more about the quality of the stuff they have given him this season. At times I asked myself if TG isn't bored to death with being the background-lurking line giver for others. And to be honest, I think he really was and that showed. TG is a highly skilled, versatile, subtle yet expressive actor, as evidenced in this latest episode. But in many episodes, since "100" really he seemed stony and lifeless. But "Hanley Waters" gives hope that we'll have back our Unit Chief for good.
Sorry for the long one.
Gubegirl,
There are 24 episodes this season, so we have four more episodes to enjoy.
Ok, so i watched this episode twice in a row. The unsub story was well done, especially KW's sensitive portrayal of someone who had nothing else to lose. As much as i loved this part of the story, i did wish that they had dwelt on the sessions more. Can you imagine how much more effective the 'pauses' would have been had they had more time to linger on these bits? Garcia's session was too short, don't you think? Reid was so vulnerable and to me it was interesting from another perspective. I somehow feel that Hotch has always treated him like a fellow adult. Remember Tabula Rasa when he asked Reid in all earnestness whether he (Reid) thought the father would be ok? Hotch has never babied Reid and he I don't know if he even knows how to start now. To me it seems Hotch is being confronted with a breaking Reid he would need/want to mend. Maybe he'll recall the aftermath of Revelations. Wonder where this could be going. Also, that sudden role-reversal at the end with Morgan was poignant. Whom does Hotch go to? Telling really that H broke eye contact right about then. CM started as a mystery/thriller and somewhere along the way i became greedy re the characters. Maybe i'm asking for too much :-)
PS: I agree that this felt out of sequence. "with friends" was forgettable.
PPS: I'm sleepy and haven't reviewed my comments. Do bear with the million typos, etc.
Oh and i was soooo thinking of Pink floyd's "wish you were here" and Simon and Garfunkel's "for emily, wherever i may find her". I think I am going to sob into my pillow. Hubs is going to think I have lost the one marble i had left.
I dont know if anyone has mentioned this song from Revelations, but Rolling Stones' Sympathy for the Devil should also be on the soundtrack.
And there has been enough music showcased in the episodes that warrant a soundtrack for CM.
Gubegirl,
I actually live in Canada otherwise I would love to join you and the others in a musicfest.
I really liked this episode. It was a nice change in the usual "type" of unsub we see and I cried right along with her at the end when she talked about the final moments with her son. That kind of guilt and grief will literally make a person come unglued and I thought she did an excellent job portraying that. Seaver was great in this one she begins to show she belongs on this team. I also loved Hotch in this episode. I especially liked how he spoke to the unsub, yet his words seemed so fitting for the team too. About remember how someone lived, not how they died, about the blame and grief, and about the way those first responders would see that as the day they failed. In many ways, I felt the unsub was not so much unlike how the team was feeling. She was the team's feelings, only magnified.
gubegirl, instead of coming up with an acronym for the "nameless one," how about a symbol like Prince had back in the day, :)
LunaM, I wouldn't mind too much of you know who in the Rossi centric season finale if she dies, or loses all her marbles and does something so stupid that she has to be fired or anything along those lines. Basically, anything that ends up with her leaving for good, I wouldn't be opposed to. But well, that's just me.
She can just disappear and not be mentioned again, I wouldn't even mind pretending like she never existed. She's just drab.
Just saw the eppy it was very good. I see nothing wrong with seaver. Everybody has to keep in mind she is still in development.
Nicolas, there are 4 episodes left in the season my friend, if that character hasn't been developed yet which at this stage is ridiculous, then it is time to say goodbye.
A Rossi- centered season ender would be a change, I'm just trying to think how it would tie into what I read the season finale will be. Any thoughts?
I guess my question can only be directed at the people who have caught wind of the spoiler for the season finale. Didn't want to mention here, but replies would spell it out, so I guess maybe forget I asked so that nothing is leaked to those who don't want to know. Maybe just replies that are general, like what people would imagine or want to see for a Rossi season ender.
Haven't heard these spoilers but add me to the list as someone who would love to see more Rossi, season finale or however it happens. For me he's the best thing on CM by a country mile -- JM has just got it -- but he's seems overlooked by the writers. Feels as though every other character gets their go at a big story, in some instances they've had two or three or more goes while Joe's just hanging round being genial.
So it would be fantastic if Rossi got something to do that would make sense of the show having Mantegna at its disposal. What are they scared of? He's by far too generous an actor to make anyone else look bad. I would be a very happy girl if they give him a proper story at last.
UK viewer
Rhea she has not even been in a whole season. Plus the whole Emily Prentiss storyline also put a stopper to her development
Uk viewer, Joe is a wonderful and verstaile actor that should be used more in the series; whenever he is used in a significant way on the show, he definitely makes an impact which I think goes to the strength of his abiloty as an actor.
I'm hoping that Reid's issue is something physical that can be treated. His surprise, according to Simon Mirren, was supposed to relate to his genetic past. To me, Asperger's wouldn't be much of a surprise to anyone. In Broken Mirror the kidnapper even mentioned the "autistic leanings" of Reid and no one in the room seemed surprised by that, even Reid. This would imply that the team already knew this or it was something they’d considered. I'm also wondering if that's why Reid was given the task of dealing with Sammy. If he does have autism, which from BlueSunflower’s great work, it appears he does, it would be less likely that he’d develop schizophrenia since on the scale they are diametrically opposed. Some genes overlap but not many.
Something from his genetic past that involves headaches doesn't mean it's related to his mother's schizophrenia, or even to his mother at all, for that matter. It could just as easily be related to his father.
A breakdown, to me at least, wouldn’t be a surprise, more like a reaction to what’s gone on with the team this season. Of course, as Anonymous pointed out, I could be totally wrong.
And I really hope it's not the season finale!
Nicolas, if it takes more than 2 or 3 episodes to flesh out the purpose, credibility, and strength of a character on a show that goes squarely to the weakness of that character and it is not wise, fair, or correct for a show of CM's strength to be bogged down by such a character. Prentiss arc or no, if the character had an ounce of worth there would not be this call for develpment as the characters purpose would have been clearly established and fleshed out by now. Also, prior to the Prentiss arc this character was on the show and the weakness of it led people to question why the character was still on the show. Pre and post Prentiss arc the futility of this character has remained consistent.
Any word if Rachel Nichols will be coming back or not?
I actually don't mind Seaver anymore, for all I know, she can stay.
Joining CM MInds: The Album debate a bit late...
Anna Calvi's cover of 'Jezebel' would be good accompaniment for any of the devil-driven unsubs. For the lovely Rossi, my dream singer would be Giuseppe di Stefano -- a bit obvious maybe but gorgeous. Two lovely Sicilians at once.
UK viewer
Lila
i also hope she is but why not she is a regular cast now. So if there is a 7th season she will be in it with the rest of the gang
What I am curious about is Rossi's relationship with Strauss. I feel like there is something definitely there, maybe not so much romantic (yikes, lol) but something to where he can act towards her the way that he does. I loved his first episode where he basically put Strauss in her place, wow, that was something to see :)
Michal, that is not necessarily true. There have been a few instances where people have been added as regulars to only be dropped by the end of that season. I think it depends on her original signing, which can be amended I believe.
Lila, I think it is safe to say that people are more focused on the TG and SM contract situation which I am hoping gets resolved soon!
Rhea: have we already discussed the interview/forum/whatever where this season's finale was mentioned? I'm drawing a blank here but I don't Twitter or go to other blogs so maybe I missed it. I for one would LOVE to know if Reid's condition is any part of the finale but maybe still leaves us in the dark about the extent of it, whether he can return to work, etc. I don't want to put you on the spot divulging something that has been learned from some confidential source, but I'm just wondering.
So, Pat and Optika: if we vacation in Canada this summer (we're due) are you suggesting hosting the "musicfest" up there:) Columbia Lake (fam cabin where we usu reunion) is a lovely location...just not the huge change of scenery I was offering to Blimey Limey who had her heart set on Mexico and will likely need to change destinations.
Cindy: Exactly how did Prince spell that novel name of his and how do we capture the same idea? I was going to suggest zero but if we typed the number, someone might mistake it for a big "o" and that would def not be fitting...plus Ben, Mikey, Kenneth and Carlos may jump back in here...LOL
It's time for a glass of wine here before dinner and I am very tired and probably should not be talking at all...I am rapidly reaching the "guegirl" stage despite just downing some coffee.
I will spend some time tomorrow making a list of the song suggestions for the soundtrack, as there still seems to be some interest. I was able to Bing CM music and find listings by episode if any of you want to do that, that may remind you of great scenes/songs used and we can come up a more solid list of suggestions?
To Pat :
completely agree with you about Reid's problems.
A breakdown wouldn't be a surprise and I hope Reid's troubles will have a physical explanation.
You're right, Simon Mirren's words, about his secret being related to his 'genetic past', does not necessarily mean it'll be connected with his mother.
We know his uncle Daniel died when Reid was very young (four year old I think). Maybe it could be linked to his secret.
The season finale spoilers do not have to do with the characters, but rather the nature of the case. You can find the information here: http://www.tvguide.com/News/MegaBuzz-House-Glee-1031501.aspx
gubegirl, it definitely wasn't any inside information. I was basing my comment on a spoiler article that I read concerning the season finale. It talked about the case at the center of the show, not about any one particular character. Lauren J. posted a link, I haven't clicked on it, but I'm thinking she probably read something similiar to what I did, I just didn't want to talk about it in case people wanted to be kept in the dark about the season finale.
Gubegirl: Only ones I could think of were YKW (as in You-Know-Who) or Pea (thought sequence: needing a substitute for the character's name -> Taboo put on Voldermort's name in Harry Potter 7 -> member of the Black Eyed Peas)...wouldn't it be more emotion-ruffling to rename her, though?
Eleven said: "Hotch has never babied Reid"
You're right, it's one of the things I like abt their relationship. & it would be interesting to see how Hotch reaches out to help Reid mend.
Lila, Michael:
As far as I know, Joe, Matthew, Rachel and Kirsten signed their contracts for Season 7, Thomas and Shemar haven't yet.
Anonymous, where is that information printed? I've never read anything that would indicate that she has been signed onto another season.
MGG nd JM's contracts that they signed before are expiring at the end of season 7; so they haven't signed anything as nothing has expired for them. From what I can glean, KV signed on to the spin-off at which time she may have signed onto another season of CM depending on whether her contract was up for CM.
TG and SM's original contracts are up at the end of this season.
I doubt that she was originally signed on past this season, meaning, that it is likely a situation that the network would look at as far as signing on for more time at the end of this season. But if more time was signed in the beginning, and the network wanted to go a different way, I think there is stuff in contracts that would allow them to release people early. Looking at how this character has fared so far, in my opinion, a re-sign for S7 would be foolish. However, it is anybody's guess how that will all shape up for S7. I think it is a wait and see situation.
CBS better get it together for TG and SM. Those contracts should have already been a done deal. They better not make another stupid move for this show.
@ Gubegirl. There's plenty of CDs by The Smiths on Amazon.com - they're about twice the price as on Amazon.co.uk (~$12 vs. ~£4) but then after you've paid postage across the Pond and import duty maybe not. Very jealous of your palm trees and jacuzzi vs. my soggy lawn and redundant garden furniture, btw! I wouldn't say I'd got my heart set on Mexico, I'm one of these that likes to tick countries of my "visited list" so an afternoon in TJ would consitute having been to Mexico (my cousin is applying the same logic if she's around southern California when I am). I'd prefer Canada tbh, must stop flying over it and actually visit one day!
I'd like to see a Rossi finale, I reckon there's a lot more to the guy than we've been shown. Could his secret come back to bite, whatever his secret is? Hmmmm, anyone care to speculate?
As for Simon Mirren saying Reid's secret relates to his genetic past, I took that as meaning Reid connected it with his fears of developing schizophrenia but that he doesn't actually become schizophrenic (I thought that would be too obvious).
My personal theory is that:
1). Reid's headaches were initially caused by the stress of the job, no social life or "special lady" (it's been implied) so he can let off steam and an edetic memory meaning he never forgets the horrors he's seen.
2). The headaches and visual disturbances made him wonder if he was becoming schizophrenic, which made the headaches worse - vicious circle.
3). Prentiss' "death" was the cherry on top of the cake and now he's sliding into depression, made worse by points 1 and 2.
I hope they resolve the cause before the end of this season, even if the recovery (or whatever) goes into next season.
I really hope the show doesn't capitulate to pressure re. Seaver. It's their show. Someone's got to own it and not just give way to the moaning campaign. That's the creative process. It weakens when you let crowd-pleasing be your only guide. So it's up to them now to make the character work. It'll be interesting to see how they go about it, what the writers and the actors can do to overcome so much resistance. It's more than just the ordinary need to make a character work in this case.
All strength to em, I say.
UK viewer
PS don't mind me: I can't go with the majority view by nature and in this instance I feel the woman deserves some support from a committed CM fan, so that'll be me
@uk viewer,
I too am a committed CM fan and Seaver also has my support.
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