Criminal Minds spoiler thread for "Lauren" starring Joe Mantegna, Thomas Gibson, Paget Brewster, Shemar Moore, Matthew Gray Gubler and Kirsten Vangsness.
**Beware! There will be spoilers in the comments :)
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«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 600 of 804 Newer› Newest»Just checking, you people do realise that the Rossi / Seaver scene was less to do with the sharp end investigation (the fresh eyes malarkey) and was more about Rossi's sense of Seaver's development as an agent?
Heh. The actual canon reason given on the show was "malarkey" whereas some made-up fanwank was the real reason instead. LOL.
Cue the strand of the argument where people say that she's a cadet and you can't train on the job... To which I reply, that's Rossi's kind of training.
Uhhh, that doesn't actually answer why Seaver should be trained on the job, nor does it fit with Rossi's character. It certainly doesn't explain why CM should waste my time watching such waste of times scenes. Or better yet, why ROSSI should be wasting his time "blooding" a cadet-slash-wannabe-agent, when time was of the essence in finding Prentiss.
BTW - if Rossi really believed cadets should be trained on-the-job, he's certainly had several years to start a program. And there is no way PreRetirement Guy Who Works Alone *ever* allowed a trainee while he was at the BAU. Gideon maybe, but not Rossi.
Sorry, there are always the second thoughts after you've finished a post...
If that scene between Rossi and Seaver was really about the profile at the cutting edge of the investigation, why don't they run from the room, shouting, 'We've got new information' instead of just wandering off to costume ('Let's get you a new shirt').
The thing I like about that questioning as a means of progressing thought is that it's about instinct or impulse and about trusting those instincts. Make clear to yourself what you already know. If that's what Seaver's going to be about, I'm glad she's on the team.
To whoever said it was like the interrogation of Garcia in 'Penelope', I agree altogether. It had a lot of that atmosphere and insight. And to that extent it was was thoroughly consistent with the covert human-instinctive Rossi flair.
UK viewer
PS, is it very bad to like Doyle? I like him. Oh, and Shemar looked at his photo on the jet with such a good expression -- halfway between resentment, jealousy and incredulity (a why him? what's he got? type of look?)
The actual canon reason given on the show was "malarkey" whereas some made-up fanwank was the real reason instead.
Made up fanwank!
So there goes my PhD. Reading what isn't on the surface = made up fanwank.
At some point, clarity of mind and instinct have to combine to cut through the crap, sunflower.
UK viewer
Anonymous said...
If that scene between Rossi and Seaver was really about the profile at the cutting edge of the investigation, why don't they run from the room, shouting, 'We've got new information' instead of just wandering off to costume ('Let's get you a new shirt').
Maybe because Rossi knew they'd have time to get her a new shirt since Hotch and Sebastian Roche still had to get to the scene so they could do their little confab? Hmm.
With Prentiss' life on the line, there is no way Rossi would have wasted his time holding anyone's hand (in fact, I find it tough to believe he'd hold anyone's hand even *when* the case wasn't personal), particularly since you, Anonymous, are implying Rossi *already* knew what Seaver was gonna spill - which, BTW, makes it VERY different from the "Penelope" scene, since Rossi *didn't* know what Garcia was hiding and they DID need that information.
Anonymous said...
Made up fanwank!
So there goes my PhD. Reading what isn't on the surface = made up fanwank.
Ohhh, a PhD. *Now* I'm impressed! Clearly that allows you to understand non-existent subtlety better than I do.
At some point, clarity of mind and instinct have to combine to cut through the crap, sunflower.
Yes, it does. Which makes your fanwank so easy to see through.
No, sunflower, ta for getting back to me. I'm implying Rossi knew the area that Seaver was interested in, same as he knew it with Morgan. He was using it for clarity. i.e. this was using the teams' insights progressively to come through to a clearer profile. For me this is evidence of Seaver becoming more integrated into the team's methods, but it's an area that I'm particularly interested in -- the presence of a thought that you haven't yet thought.
The parallel to the scene in 'Penelope' is that Rossi knew Garcia knew something that she didn't know was relevant. Ha ha! It's all on the fly. But you see what I mean. It's that trusting the process of others' thoughts that I love best about this show, when its working. This is what the whole 'profiling' malarkey is about for me.
There are two basic elements of profiling, it seems to me, one cornered by Reid: that magnificent pattern-finding, the other cornered by Rossi: that sure people reading.
Eh, call me a fan.
UK viewer
PS it's going to be really quiet here next week when all the abstainers have started abstaining. We won't know what to do with ourselves to get up a decent conversation!
UK viewer
...the presence of a thought that you haven't yet thought.
LOL. There's a reason I - as well as pretty much everyone else - didn't see it your way, as further evidenced by this *other* delicious "see under the surface" line you gave out:
Shemar looked at his photo on the jet with such a good expression -- halfway between resentment, jealousy and incredulity (a why him? what's he got? type of look?)
LOL, and WTF.
sunflower, I don't mean to be rude, but I am not going to argue with you.
UK viewer
Anonymous said...
PS it's going to be really quiet here next week when all the abstainers have started abstaining. We won't know what to do with ourselves to get up a decent conversation!
Actually, ratings tend to go up for the after "death" episode, since people want to know how the other characters react to the change. The thread will probably have a lot more "one-timers" posting, and I'm sure it'll all be about how Seaver sucks. Which she does, and the absence of Prentiss is only going to make that all the much clearer.
Anonymous said...
sunflower, I don't mean to be rude, but I am not going to argue with you.
Excellent. I'm tired of pointing out all the fallacies of your arguments anyway. If you'd have just said it was the way *you* felt the scene(s) should be interpreted, I most likely would have left you to it. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion.
It was when you tried to tell everyone they were wrong about how that scene went down - particularly since it's got canon lines - is where you went wrong.
Just checking, you people do realise...
Good night!
Im watching the episodes of season 6 and must ask: Where is Hotch??? WRITERS: He is the ledaer not Morgan or Rossi!
sunflower, it's day here, but good night all the same.
There is room for balance on public forum and for alternative views.
UK viewer
Hello, first of all I've only recently started watching Criminal Minds and I'm still watching season 5 so please bare with me.
I've heard this song in several episodes of Criminal Minds involving kids (kidnapping etc). I don't know how to explain it. It's kind of like a nursery song, well at least it reminds me of it anyways. The only recent episode I remember hearing it in is Season 5, Episode 16 when an old woman cremates a box with a boy in it.
Please help, I want to know the name of the song so badly.
sunflower, who have I insulted? I've put forward a view, that's all. If I've put it forward too trenchantly, I apologise. I'm aware that the majority of people here aren't going to agree with me, or think the same things -- there is a lot of high feeling going on -- and perhaps that led me to state things more firmly, just for balance. You seem quite put out now and I am sorry for that. I'll let you get on with it. It certainly wasn't my intention to get caught up in the usual mess that's been happening here lately.
:o)
UK viewer
Anonymous said...
There is room for balance on public forum and for alternative views.
Yes, there is. Next time please try doing it without insulting the people who disagree with you. You started immediately. Ben and the other anti "Seaver haters" can't quite seem to grasp that concept either.
Just checking, you people do realise...
But maybe those who are reacting very strongly against the scene might find it easier to put it into perspective once you focus on that aspect of it.
At some point, clarity of mind and instinct have to combine to cut through the crap, sunflower.
...the presence of a thought that you haven't yet thought.
After watching CM from day one, I am sad to say this will be my last viewing of the Wed night eps. I can't even imagine having to sit thru the bad writing, cast changes and crap that has been this season.
There's been alot of talk on many boards about the Seaver character. If they were going to have us 'warm up to her' it should have already been done. The damage has been done and she is useless in this role.
Last night's scene with Rossi holding her hand...are you kidding me? This is a man who has walked away from Reid mid-sentence because he couldn't be 'bothered' to listen and he's going to hold a cadet's hand???? Rossi's losing his rep as the senior hardass profiler and it's awful to watch. I just wanted to shout at the screen after the scene 'make sure Baby Seaver remembers her lunchbox and milk money before she gets on the bus'....really, and then 'let's get you changed'....MAKE IT STOP ALREADY!
Like I said, I've watched from day one but from now on I'll be watching the great reruns on ION and A&E. The ones where the team was tight and spot on to find the unsub, but Wed night is now an open time slot for me. RIP Criminal Minds, it was a good run.
Hi to the person who runs this blog!
Please do feel free to delete any of these later posts addressed to Sunflower. They don't add anything and it makes your blog messy!
Thank you for your help.
UK viewer
I've been seeing this for weeks here now and I must now say that the addition of this character has not only weakened and dumbed down the show in my opinion by making the veterans seem somewhat inferior and subservient to this cadet's "all knowing powers," but it has brought with it this childish, "I know that's what you are but what am I" pseudo commenting from individuals who feel personally offended that a fictional character is being discussed in a way they disapprove of so they lash back by assigning the title of haters to those who dislike the character. CBS and CM, is this the caliber and subset of individuals hoped to be obtained through the addition of this character?
Listen, I don't like Darth Vadar, Samantha from Sex and the City, Barney, Elmo, and Newman, and guess what I am not losing any sleep over it because I don't have to feel sorry for disliking a fictional character. These fictional characters are not suffering over my dislike of them, they will not have to seek therapy because I have criticized them, they are not bleeding nor are they falling prey to drug or alcohol abuse because their self-esteem has been injured.
Furthermore, I am under no obligation to be tickled pink over the latest cliche ploy to lead me to connect with and like this fail of a character.
Epic episode. I knew MGG would do an amazing job, just like last year. And oh my god, his acting! My heart was already broken enough, and then he cried! I was like "Oh, shi--"
I just know that was Emily. It was her hair, just cut short and dyed brown (from what I could see). And then they zoomed in on her fingers. And it was her voice, she was just... quiet and distant.
I love Rossi. He acts like a father to Seaver, whom I admit I liked this episode. She did good, in my opinion.
OMFG. Yeah, awesome episode.
A said...
I've heard this song in several episodes of Criminal Minds involving kids (kidnapping etc). I don't know how to explain it. It's kind of like a nursery song, well at least it reminds me of it anyways. The only recent episode I remember hearing it in is Season 5, Episode 16 when an old woman cremates a box with a boy in it.
Please help, I want to know the name of the song so badly.
The song list for "Mosely Lane" is here, A:
http://criminalmindsfanatic.blogspot.com/2010/03/criminal-minds-songs-info-for-mosley.html
'Illabye' Tipper 2 uses -- 1. Anita puts boy into incinerator. 2. Amy cowers in room when Anita enters.
Anonymous said...
sunflower, who have I insulted?
Crimineys, stop acting innocent. See my other comments. If you can't figure it out, I can't help you.
OMG Ely, so much WORD to your post!
OMG!! What an incredible episode!!! When Emily listened to Garcia's voicemail and when JJ and Reid hugged in the hospital were just such beautifully sad moments, so well acted!!
I read comments on here before watching the episode (was waiting for it to appear online and just couldn't help myself!)and I have to say that Seaver's part in the episode was nothing like I thought it was going to be going on the comments here!I think it is a legit point that Prentiss is someone the rest of the team have known and loved for years and that without a doubt would cloud you.Didn't think it was crazy that Rossi was pushing Seaver.
This is definitely an episode I shall be watching again!!!
I'm sorry Alison, so then can you answer why that wasn't the case for Hotch? Is it that they didn't have the same type of love for Hotch as they do for Emily?
It's not an answer as to why the team maybe care less about Hotch (debateable) but the possible clouding of judgement here parallels the scene in Minimal Loss where Hotch won't negotiate because he feels too close to Reid/Prentiss. Except Rossi felt able to step up in that instance where here he says that they're losing perspective...
Sorry to go back to a point I've already been annoying about, but it is still possible that the statement could have been a ruse to put Seaver on the spot and draw her out. That's how it played to me any way. It didn't feel like a genuine 'interview'. It was like he was taunting her but guiding her to the point where she got past her inhibititions to actually start thinking like a profiler.
That question aside, I enjoyed this episode in that it explored some parts of Prentiss' life that for me seem to have always been there. By that I mean, when she first arrived she seemed so cool and collected, like she had been doing what she came on the team to do for years prior to her coming there. She did have a composure about her that stood out and made here the strength that she was on the show. Gulp, can't believe I used was and Prentiss in the same sentence :( Anyway, I liked how Reid was so clued into what was going on with Prentiss. From when she first arrived to now, that relationship (brother/siste) has blossomed into something to so endearing to watch and I am sad that there won't be more of those moments between them. I do have to say that I did not care for the way Morgan was set up to react to Emily's not telling them about what was going on. I can understand his anger, but this is someone that he has worked for years with, and though upset and angered, I think considering the danger that she was in that he'd be written as being less harsh. This would have been a nice follow up where maybe he could have expressed his upset at her not being able to confide in him and the team, but again, working with her for so long, he knew how she was in that regard. I think this goes back to, however, how the characters have been farther away from that point of familiarity with one another.
Garcia's voice mail, lovely, JJ not in enough scenes at all, Rossi loved the scenes he was in independent of Seaver. Let me stop and say here that I think it is a shame that Rossi is now being utilized to prop up this character. I love the David Rossi that we saw interrogating with Reid, not the Rossi who is holding someones hand and is now some sort of surrogate daddy. Not that it isn't nice to see Rossi have those types of feelings, it is, but why is it that when it comes to this character there always has to be another character used to try and validate her existence there. I just don't care for that type of thing and it is something that I am going to miss terribly about Prentiss not being there. There was never any hand holding with Prentiss, no surrogate daddy needed. The Prentiss and Rossi scene in Demonlogy was a caring type of scene where Rossi cut to the heart at what was bothering Prentiss and the scene took off from there. It wasn't some, "Come on, you can do it, you can do it." Please don't use the Rossi character like this, please.
Paget Brewster, my God, what a fantastic actress!!! I will miss so much not having Prentiss around. The female agent with grit, sass, experience, dark humor, sarcastic, caring, loving, insightful, supportive. I could go on for days! Emily Prentiss is all of that and much , much, more! What a loss for the show :( MGG, God, what a fantastic director! MGG is so freaking talented it makes my head want to spin off. He and Paget Brewster, in my opinion, are powerhouses to be recockned with because they are talented in so many different areas.
I wish I could say I were excited to see what is up next for CM but I can't. As Seaver will be the only representation of a female field agent (a position that, come guys she really shouldn't have, but I won't get into that here), I can't say that I am looking forward to more "Hey, you can do it" moments from Rossi to Seaver, or just in general focusing on this inexperienced agent to the folly of the other team mates.
I wasn't as blown away by the episode as some and I don't think it even came close to "100" as far as emotional impact goes, but the scene of her getting her breast tattooed certainly rated up there with the Reid and Hotch torture scenes in the [i]"EEK! Makes me want to look away!"[/i] factor.
The episode was very predictable and just not very emotional. I knew she didn't shoot the ear guy. I knew she didn't shoot a child. I felt nothing during the hospital scene, but perhaps that's because I could tell by the way Hotch was behaving that Prentiss wasn't really dead which in turn made the funeral scene equally unaffecting. I guess this will be Hotch's "secret" this season? He kept his promise to Clyde to keep her safe and gets to sit back and watch his team grieve and suffer and not be able to ease their suffering by telling them the truth.
Morgan is really hard on people, especially those he cares about. He really needs to work on checking his self-righteousness at the door and try walking a mile in that person's shoes before he passes judgement. Not sure what to make of the Rossi/Seaver scene. It felt out of place in the episode. I did like Rossi's interrogation scene with the ear guy and I kind of giggled when Reid turned and looked for the other "beanpole" in the room. I enjoyed the scenes between Hotch and Clyde and Hotch's refusal to compromise his integrity for information. I enjoyed Emily's flashback scenes much more than the present day scenes. I don't buy into the whole butch, badass chick thing. That sort of thing makes me roll my eyes on any show. It was nice seeing JJ again, but I was wondering how someone who was stolen from the BAU to go to work for the DOD at the Pentagon ended up at the State Department. I thought JJ's tears and anguish over Emily's death were the most believable. You could feel how much it was hurting her to have to lie to all of them and see their pain.
All in all it was a decent epiosde of television, not great, but entertaining. It didn't really resemble a CM episode, but it was good none the less.
Anonymous, yes, but the point is, Rossi has the wherewithal to have that perspective. If cadet Seaver hadn't of been then with her fresh eyes, what, the whole case would have been shot? I don't know if I will express this well, but my issue is that this cadet hasn't had anything near the type of experience needed to hang at the BAU. So, for this senior, beyond senior officer, to come behind some cadet pleading that she open up her fresh eyes to the team, that is just incredibly ridiculous to me.
It is part and parcel when having this type of job to have the wherewithal to step back, collect your thoughts, and get back into the task at hand (they've show the team do that before). Throwing in the towel and seeking the "sage" wisdom and perspective of a cadet is nonsense. Also, to me, as soon as the words flew out of her mouth he knew it, and so what, he knows this information but instead of getting together with the team to run that information down in this time sensitive matter, he stops for some training exercise with Seaver. The only other option is that he simply didn't have a clue and that is unacceptable to me being that he is who he is. He would have known to step back, collect his thoughts, take a deep breath if necessary, and come back with perspective. If not him, than at the very minimum one of the other veterans on the team, which goes back o my issue of now because of this character painting this team with having the inability, all of the sudden, to not be able to do that anymore.
Lauren will go down as one of my favorite episodes, but 100 remains the standard bearer. This was a thrilling hour of television; and the performances were outstanding; however, not to appear nitpicky, there were a few things that ticked me off and prevented Lauren from being at the top of the list.
1. There was no final Hotch/Prentiss scene in any of the episodes leading up to Prentiss’ departure. All of the team members had an opportunity to say goodbye. Morgan had several. If Laurent was for the fans as MGG claimed, then some of the fans were cheated. Hotch never got a parting scene with Prentiss; and Hotch has been wasted during this entire arc and the season for that matter—much like Prentiss.
2. The wide-eyed ingénue who’s just stumbling her way into brilliance is not working for me. The Seaver character remains out of place on this show; and it was unbelievable that Rossi would turn to her for insight and profiling because the rest of the team was too close. I know this is the writer’s way of making the character relevant; but it underscores the absurdity of the character. The child being killed should have been an easy trigger for an experienced profiler to analyze. For Rossi to turn to Seaver was nonsense. And to offer to hold her hand was far-fetched and insulting; I don’t ever remember Rossi needing to hold Prentiss’ or JJ’s hand as inspiration for them to do their jobs; and I can’t see him offering to hold the hand of a male cadet. This scene was obviously contrived to provide a bridge to greatness for the Seaver character. But this character is more of a distraction for CM and adds no value.
3. The kiss between Lauren and Doyle really grossed me out. I know it demonstrated Prentiss’ commitment to her undercover persona; but I simply went ewwww!
Aside from those few negatives, I really enjoyed the episode for the following reasons:
1. Paget’s performance was simply outstanding; understated, emotional, strong and self-directed, and intense. Why CM waited to give her quality material to work with is one of the mysteries of this series. The writers fail to make use of the skills of its cast; preferring to stoop to the graphic, the violence and an over-indulgence in the unsub; rather than to highlight the quality of its talent. The writers have wasted Paget this season and have only showcased her as she departs.
2. MGG did an excellent job directing this series. He was able to intertwine Prentiss’s shady past from eight years prior, with the present skillfully. And the episode moved with crispness and confidence.
3. MGG directed himself the longest hug in Criminal Minds’ history. The scene where JJ consoled him after announcing Prentiss’ demise had JJ and Spence hugging from the announcement to the cut-away to Hotch alone in the hallway, back to JJ eventually meeting Hotch in the hallway. LOL, I thought to myself, you go MGG, finally got that hug that eluded you in AJ’s last episode.
4. I was pleasantly surprised by the twist that Clyde was the good guy and Tsia was the mole.
5. The scene between Hotch and Clyde seemed prophetic for me. I think Hotch may end up putting a bullet between Doyle’s eyes; even though he said he couldn’t do it. But I remember Hotch from A Real Rain, Psychodrama and 100. He could absolutely put a bullet between Doyle’s eyes if need be.
6. JJ seemed so confident, poised and polished. AJ’s return really did make Paget’s exit more special.
7. I was relieved that Prentiss wasn’t married, didn’t have a child, and hadn’t killed anyone. Her departure, although gimmicky, was sufficient for me because I desperately want Paget to return.
cont...
8. I’m happy to see that Hotch knows! The fact that Hotch, JJ and maybe Clyde are in on it together to protect Prentiss provided some consolation for the fact that there was no final scene between Hotch and Prentiss.
Season 6 has proved to be a season of experimentation for CM. I think by now CBS, Ed and the writers should be fully aware of what works and what doesn’t work. Now is the time to fish or cut bait. Seaver doesn’t work. No matter how much the writers try to integrate and upgrade the character. Seaver is more of a distraction and usurper; and for me, her scenes are more cringe-worthy than poignant. And no matter what anyone says, the fact that her look is so close to JJ’s, is a major distraction and insult for me. This is not an indictment of Nichols; but I find her acting halting.
Paget Brewster’s Prentiss is unique and engaging; and never boring. It is unbelievable to me that CBS would find this character expendable. There’s not another character on TV like her. I know Paget is now attached to a pilot for NBC. And if she really chooses to walk away from CM, then I wish her well. But NBC is a failed network trying to rediscover itself. Even if the pilot is picked up, new shows aren’t given a chance to find their identity. And CM is so successful both in first-run and syndication; and the huge fan following has made Paget its own. I hope all parties come to their collective senses before it’s too late.
CBS, Ed, and the rest of the decision-makers, stop jerking Thomas Gibson and Shemar Moore around and give them the contracts they deserve. Thomas Gibson deserves an executive producer/producer credit, much like Mark Harmon’s, Gary Sinise’s, and David Caruso’s. He’s more than earned it. And here is to hoping that TG will have a greater presence in the upcoming episodes. This shortage of Hotch is getting tiresome.
Sorry meant to say in my last sentence:
"If not him, than at the very minimum one of the other veterans on the team, which goes back to my issue of now because of this character, the team is being painted as having the inability, all of the sudden, to not be able to do that type of thing anymore."
Um, you made a mistake. It was Jeremy who sold the team out, not Tsia.
This episode was probably one of the best this season! Even though Emily is gone and most of the team believes Emily to be dead :(
I was FREAKING OUT most of the time just because JJ was back! and then I really started getting into Emily's backstory and I was just so shocked! At first, I thought that Emily was really dead, but when JJ and Hotch leave the room and when they shared that look at the "burial", I knew that the team was lied to!
I promised myself that no matter what, I wasn't going to cry, but... tears came to my eyes when:
Morgan: Hang on, squeeze my hand baby
*Morgan goes on to say how proud he is to be her friend*
And then the real waterworks started here:
JJ: She didn't even make it onto the table...
*Reid gets up to leave*
*JJ stops him*
JJ: Spence...
Reid: I didn't get a chance to say goodbye...
*JJ hugs Reid*
*Reid Starts crying*
I start BAWLING HYSTERICALLY!
As much as I missed JJ, I am kind of upset that she know something that the rest (except hotch) doesn't. I hope she comes back to reveal what happened! The cast did an AMAZING job and Kudos to the Gube for directing the BEST episode of the season so far!
Paget did an amazing acting job and Matthew did a superb directing job. It was a great episode.
But, it made me miss JJ even more. She was such an integral part of the team. I loved the JJ/Spence moment.
Seaver had way too much screen time. I don't like that Rossi has taken her under his wing. It was ludicrous that Rossi had to ask her for fresh eyes.....puleeeez. She is a totally useless character and should not have even been in the episode taking up valuable screen time from JJ and the rest of the cast!
I can't imagine the show without Prentiss. She is such a strong, smart, clever character who cannot be replaced just like JJ's character.
I will continue to watch the show mainly because of Reid, but it will never be the same.
For those who don't like reading the comments about Seaver, JJ & Prentiss.......that is a major part of the episodes. I hope that we don't see Seaver back next season. I still cringe every time she opens her mouth.
Highest kudos and congrats to our beloved MGG for his directing, which made the most of what for me was a pretty flawed, disjointed script with flat dialog. I'm guessing that the challenge was once again to cram much too much into 43 minutes. So much of the story seemed forced and/or predictable. Lots of action with minimal reaction. Before going further, however, I want to add that seeing JJ was a bittersweet treat. She is such a class act and so beautiful. Also, the casting and acting of Timothy Murphy were both brilliant.
The forced part:
Clearly ordered to propel Seaver into the forefront (despite overwhelmingly negative fan reactions to her), the script has Rossi asking her to crack the case on the basis of her ignorance of textbook profiling and of Emily... say WHAT??? Why didn't they just grab a Starbuck's barista for that? And...too funny that with her FBI Academy training Seaver doesn't even know to duck when gunshots are fired.
The predictable parts:
-"Angry Morgan" doing a 180 flip at the end--but at least he was the only team member who had a strong reaction to learning about Prentiss' past
-Prentiss as "femme fatale" (she could just play the smart, courageous and occasionally sardonic Prentiss; we don't need to see her cleavage in every episode and her bare bra this time...cheap cheap cheap)
-Prentiss getting tortured and beaten (and beaten and beaten)
-The "witness protection" arrangement for Prentiss, with all of the team except Hotch grieving over her "death." (Shout out to AJ for her subtle portrayal of the complex emotions JJ would have felt helping orchestrate this.)
...there's more but I think 'nuff said on that point.
Like the majority of fellow bloggers here, I mourn for the great old days of CM and am stunned and outraged at how CBS has syphoned off resources from a hit show to produce a lame spinoff, and taken a meat cleaver/then added Seaver to what had been a great cast.
Only question is...will CBS commit the resources needed to resuscitate this dying show for a seventh season?
Susan, I think you're right with this:
"Also, to me, as soon as the words flew out of her mouth he knew it, and so what, he knows this information but instead of getting together with the team to run that information down in this time sensitive matter, he stops for some training exercise with Seaver".
I'm pretty sure that's right. Rossi knew it. He wanted Seaver to know that she knew it too. For us, because there's less than an hour, a big cast, and a whole lot of editing, those two or three minutes might seem a really big investment of time spent training a cadet, but actually it was just a short time -- moments really, and it did some good. For what it's worth and I know this is going to drop like a lead balloon with many people on this forum, I think it was well-acted by both JM and RN.
In other news, I loved Clyde! His scenes with Hotch were great, the way he manoeuvred himself into the investigation without breaking sweat. Seems there were a lot of these one-to-ones in the episode where two people negotiated and pussyfooted round the real stuff in order to make something happen. Doyle/Prentiss, Hotch/Clyde and in a different way Rossi/ Seaver. Worked for me. I loved the big range of different characters this episode gave.
UK viewr
Anonymous, sorry, but that is just utterly ridiculous to me that Rossi would stop to do this. Quite frankly, I don't care if she knew it or not. That was not the time or place to do something that she should be doing in a class and learning as a field agent in a less specialized unit for a few years, eventually working her way up one day to be able to land a spot on a team like the BAU.
To the other Anonymous point:
"the script has Rossi asking her to crack the case on the basis of her ignorance of textbook profiling and of Emily... say WHAT??? Why didn't they just grab a Starbuck's barista for that?"
Yes, God yes...
To sdwally's point..
" The wide-eyed ingénue who’s just stumbling her way into brilliance is not working for me. The Seaver character remains out of place on this show; and it was unbelievable that Rossi would turn to her for insight and profiling because the rest of the team was too close. I know this is the writer’s way of making the character relevant; but it underscores the absurdity of the character. The child being killed should have been an easy trigger for an experienced profiler to analyze. For Rossi to turn to Seaver was nonsense. And to offer to hold her hand was far-fetched and insulting; I don’t ever remember Rossi needing to hold Prentiss’ or JJ’s hand as inspiration for them to do their jobs; and I can’t see him offering to hold the hand of a male cadet. This scene was obviously contrived to provide a bridge to greatness for the Seaver character. But this character is more of a distraction for CM and adds no value."
Yes, God, yes...
The whole thing is just freaking absurd!
Smartman--I totally agree with your comments, even as it relates to Rachel Nichols.
However, even though it's not RN's fault that she "got shoved into a nasty situation - bad writing, undeveloped character and an absentee landlord." Your argument demonstrates why the landlord should consider evicting the tenant.
And I totally agree with your comment, could not have said it better; and it requires restating:
"...without Hotch there is no show. Who would be the center? Once Mandy left he became the unsung hero of the show - holding the team together with his stoicism and solidity. I still cant figure out what JM does - he is a great actor but like RN has been given a vague outline and told to fill it in. SM and MGG are terrific supporting players and no one beats KV on any show in town Including Pauley Perrette but lets face it they are truly supporting players. I would have preferred to see the TG and PB show - two fine actors who can carry any material and make it work."
To sdwally:
When Many left I think the writers (who were fabulous back then!) created the senior profiler role and I think Joe Mantegna has done a wonderful job filling it. He hit the ground running and didn't need anybody to hold HIS hand at any time! And...Rossi would never hold anyone else's hand - the whole idea of him mentoring Seaver is ridiculous and needs to stop.
The show is disintegrating into pablum all to accommodate a character that's weak and unnecessary.
A true shame and waste of a great cast....just my opinion.
Sorry - typing too fast. I meant "when Mandy" left...
Fabulous episode! I loved it. Congratulations to everyone concerned especially PB and MGG. Another awesome piece of directing by Matthew. I especially loved seeing JJ back again, just wish she'd had more scenes. Her hug with Reid was beautiful, just what I'd wanted to see in JJ. It's up there with my favourite ever scenes now along with the Reid/Hotch hug and the Reid/Prentiss hug. I was so glad JJ was there for him. My heart just about shattered when Spence started crying. As a huge fan of Reid!Angst I'm very excited to see how Prentiss' 'death' affects Reid and his headache storyline. The poor boy's lost his mother to mental illness, his father walked out on him when he was 10, he lost Gideon, Elle and JJ when they left the BAU and now Prentiss is gone too.
I'm going to miss Prentiss/PB so much. Her leaving is so sad. :-( Just like I still miss JJ/AJ. This episode was evidence for me that S6 has a JJ shaped hole in it. And now there'll be a Prentiss shaped hole too. I'm not a fan of Seaver at all, I've tried to like her, to accept her but nothing about her character is working for me. I just wish S7 would see Emily and JJ returning to the BAU.
I thought the ep last night was good. It ended how I expected (and wanted) it too although I wish we had gotten more scene there. I will probably watch next week just to see how people react although with this show they will probably barely mention her! But after that I don't expect to be a regular viewer. I rarely can watch a show after they take my favorite away.
For next season I am hopeful she will return but not going to count on it. (no spoiler here just my own guess) I can see how they could carry this Catch Doyle thing (uh, he did get away didn't he? ) for a few eps., catch him and then bring her back next season a few eps in. (so she might have time to do that other project) I wish her the best with the pilot but I'm just selfish enough to want her back on CM instead!!
Rossi said Emily crossed the line. In the world of high espionage there really IS no line! Agents are expected to do what they have to do to get the job done (and to stay alive). For Shemar ('s character) to care about that was so sanctimonious, isn't he jumping in bed with any woman who will say Okay all the time? And that is just for fun!
And he acted so shocked that she'd throw a flash grenade into a car with EVIL MURDERING TERRORISTS inside. Yeah, what an evil thing to do! Even I could do that.
Summerhouse, which episodes was it that Morgan jumped into bed with someone? I can't remember.
We've never seen Morgan jump into bed with anyone, but it has been implied that he's a bit of a player.
Last nights ratings for the entire hour:
3.6/13.7 million viewers
Criminal Minds (first half hour) = 13.446 million viewers
Second half gained to = 13.944
Suspect Behavior (first half) = 10.554
second half lost to = 10.155
Not a record, but not too shabby for going up against American Idol.
True, other Anonymous :)
For going up against AI, not bad, not bad at all. AI is a tough rating's monster to slay.
I think it's now obvious that Rossi is mentoring Seaver - he asked her those questions so that she could figure it out for herself. She's on the team because he sees her potential and he doesn't care about the bureaucractic rules about how much training someone needs to be part of the BAU. He sees the potential and he's training it now.
Her presence probably galls Erin Strauss, too.
yep good ratings. Next week is a repeat again. DAMN!
"We've never seen Morgan jump into bed with anyone, but it has been implied that he's a bit of a player." So very true!!
"jumping in bed with any woman who will say Okay all the time?" That's quite a stretch!!! LMAO!!!
kat887.. It galls me that is for sure.
She should be being "mentored" if you like at the Academy and at a field office, not the BAU. But whatever, the BAU has all but become a joke now.
I wrote this on another site, but I feel it bears to be read here too:
I think Reid is going to have an emotional breakdown toward the end of this season--I mean, JJ leaving the team, Prentiss "dead", his headaches, and the stress from all the cases and graphic images accumulated from his years working in the BAU stored in his eidetic memory is going to take a huge toll on Reid.
Somehow, I have this image of a promo saying "A Young Man...With the Most Brilliant Mind in the World...working in one of the most stressful jobs in the country.. but when will it be all too much... (cue quick montage of his parents, Elle, Gideon, JJ, and Prentiss, and scenes from "Revelations" "Minimal Loss" and "Faceless, Nameless", and his headaches, and graphic images)...for his mind?" Cut to Reid holding his head. Cut to short excerpts of the upcoming episode (for the case that will no doubt have heavy involvement from Reid), and then before the announcement of "All-New Criminal Minds. Next Weds @ 9, ONly on CBS" the promo shows an intense close-up of Reid in the middle of a supposed breakdown, screaming louding and grasping his hair tightly.
Just a theory.
Could it be a possible storyline?
After all that's happened to Reid in the past and this current season, with the departure of his two "sisters" (JJ to the Pentagon, Prentiss to her "death"), how much do you wanna bet that an emotional breakdown isn't too far away?
I wonder how the team is going to be like for the remainder of the season--still in mourning, or "business as usual"?
Seriously, I really do think a breakdown is imminent in Reid's future. There's only so much you can deal with before you really lose it. Reid may seem highly optimistic and happy-go-lucky at times, but I don't think he's dealing with the stress as well, hence the headaches. Whatever Reid is bottling up is going to explode sooner or later, like his physics magic film canisters of vinegar and tablets. It might actually be a good thing--to let it all out, and feel a weight lifted away on his soul. Reid's breakdown is coming, sooner or later--I might be wrong, but that's my prediction.
Seriously, I really do think a breakdown is imminent in Reid's future.
You could say the same thing about Hotch, but I guess what Reid said about being a blinker would probably hold true here and that Reid would break before Hotch would, although they're both pretty bad about keeping things bottled up so I suppose either could explode like one of Reid's physic's magic containers at any time.
They've both suffered so much loss, trauma and grief. They need a good scene together where they own up to the fact that maybe it's all becoming too much.
I forgot about Hotch. I'm sorry, I just adore Reid.
I was off on my predictiong for the ratings numbers, but if they're good, they're good--however, I think there is going to be a slide with Prentiss and JJ gone and only Seaver and Garcia left as the female members of the team.
It was really one of the best episodes of the season. I liked of two other episodes too, but this was breathtaking. Congratulations to MGG, man of multiple talents:it can take out the best actors do an episode and tense, poignant and full of action. This boy has talent. lol
Wow, loved it all (less Seaver, of course, she does not impress me).
AJ wonderful, always beautiful and talented and very generous, because after being traded for a younger actress with no talent, she returned to transform Criminal Minds (along with his team, with his family) in one of the best series of today's, not all are so generous, so I love AJ more, she was much more generous than the CBS and creator of the series, was with her, she deserves respect, above all else. Thank you AJ.
Prentiss, I'll miss her, she's a great actress. I'm glad she is with big plans ahead, and where it is, I'll try to follow his career. All the luck for her, she deserves;
All professionals Criminal Minds (cameras, costume designers, producers, finally .. I could not list them),Congratulations to all, was a brilliant job. An excellent team work.
And Joe, you're flawless, is a great actor.
It was really one of the best episodes of the season. I liked of two other episodes too, but this was breathtaking. Congratulations to MGG, man of multiple talents:it can take out the best actors do an episode and tense, poignant and full of action. This boy has talent. lol
Wow, loved it all (less Seaver, of course, she does not impress me).
AJ wonderful, always beautiful and talented and very generous, because after being traded for a younger actress with no talent, she returned to transform Criminal Minds (along with his team, with his family) in one of the best series of today's, not all are so generous, so I love AJ more, she was much more generous than the CBS and creator of the series, was with her, she deserves respect, above all else. Thank you AJ.
Prentiss, I'll miss her, she's a great actress. I'm glad she is with big plans ahead, and where it is, I'll try to follow his career. All the luck for her, she deserves;
All professionals Criminal Minds (cameras, costume designers, producers, finally .. I could not list them),Congratulations to all, was a brilliant job. An excellent team work.
And Joe, you're flawless, is a great actor.
Thank´s to Garcia, Reid, Hotch, Morgan and Joe... i love all...
Marissa I agree with you.
The BAU is not a training office, it is a division of the FBI for professional profilers. Reid is an genius and groomed specifically for the job...and he is the only expeption because you can bet he had "read all the books". Perhaps Mary Sue should come back when she has. If Rossi is interested in being a mentor (which I can totally see) let him do it on his own time and not when lives are in danger. There is too much at risk for a rookie AGENT...not just an SSA in the BAU but a rookie FBI AGENT!...to be on this team.
Seaver needs to go!
does anyone know if the passwords for the chat tonight have been sent out yet?
I never got a confirmation email last week or anything and i dont have anything in my inbox today yet either so i just wasnt sure
something that I just can't get out of my head still today is the fact that the team doesn't know.
Are they just gonna pick it up in two weeks like nothing happened? If not, how the heck can Hotch just let the team be devestated thinking that Emily is dead?
I can see the team, Rossi especially, picking up on it at some point. But jeeze it's just horrible.
Poor Garcia and Reid.
and ROSSI! Rossi crying = so not cool :( Joe Mantegna made me love him even more last night
ok Paget was brilliant as always and it was a great episode, up to par with !)) but not better. Loved JJ in the few scenes she was in and loved Hotch's presence and Reid and Garcia. Rossi was great too and Seaver, her big breakthrough scene/ Yeah right! It was so obvious and it was like Rossi was asking her "whats 2=\+2? What does it =? 4! No character development for Seaver. It was so forced and took away from Paget. Also, has anyone else noticed that in the past couple of episodes, the few questions that Seaver did ask that werent annoying should have been coming out of Hotch's mouth?
Loved JJ coming through for Emily in a big way at the end! Really hope to see them back again! MGG rocked with his directing!
To UK viewer,
Take heart. Try un-hooking from the argument by remembering with whom you are probably arguing. (I don't think there's a minimum age restriction on this site.) That's how I try to step away. But it's hard I know.
"You betcha."
Yes, BAU1919, I got my password yesterday.
Altho' I have to agree that I found the Rossi/Seaver lesson quite contrived, I think I had already prepared myself to accept something along these lines: partly for the writers to backpedal a little and lend some credence to the fact that we all know she is a rookie and "in-training" -whether the BAU is the place for that or not - NOT That is all I will say on this subject because I am sick of reading so much on this subject and I believe it is unduly negative.
I didn't get bogged down by this brief little OTJ trng tho' it seemed abit untimely given the circumstance. It's TV, I remind myself. I was able to move past it to watch the other exemplary scenes.
I say Morgan was being Morgan. We know he can be quick to jump to conclusions -thus he is the first to be kicking down doors. But he has a very sensitive side to him as well and we got to see that later in his scene with the injured Prentiss.
As far as him being a player: in earlier seasons this was intimated:
on the dance floor when Garcia was praising his moves being cat-like while Prentiss referred to him as being more like a dog...and another convo where Reid remarked about how Morgan has girls coming on to him every day - as they pass one admiring him in the hall at work. Then, in Someone's Watching,at the end when he asks Morgan if he's ever been with a woman who he would want to stay with? Morgan replies "you calling me a dog?" Reid says, no, "not at all, it's just that I have never seen you the same woman twice."
Morgan goes on to explain that in their line of work, they have little time for relationships.
I have never had the feeling that Morgan was really a playboy - but he could be. I think after his brief, close relationship with Tamara, he could get serious if he met the right person and it fit in with his life/work. That's MHO.
Prentiss was his female counterpart and his one, true partner and probably there were some underlying feelings there that were never allowed to be explored by either but I think a little of that came out in this epi: He was def acting jealous and a little judgmental as a wronged lover might early on in learning Prentiss" dirty little past", but came back around after he had had a chance to cool down and you could see his feelings for her as he spoke to her while she lie "dying."
Anyway, that's my take - I think MGG played this up and did a great job, as he did everything in this epi because he knows these people so well: both as co-workers and the roles they play as actors - who better to do such an accurate depiction? I cannot wait to watch it again to catch all that I missed and those moments I want to relish like Reid's stricken face at the end.
Sigh...pls tell me that this is not the last of the quality CM I so look fwd to? I would miss it so very much.
kat887 said....
"To UK viewer,
Take heart. Try un-hooking from the argument by remembering with whom you are probably arguing. (I don't think there's a minimum age restriction on this site.) That's how I try to step away. But it's hard I know."
I'd certainly say this is true with regard to the individuals who use such profound and age appropiate terms like "haters." Although, I have a sneaking suspicion that you weren't targeting them in this post. Forgive me if that is not true.
If not, how the heck can Hotch just let the team be devestated thinking that Emily is dead?
I'm sure it's hard for him, but for Emily's safety and their safety he'll have to keep it to himself as long as Doyle is alive and a threat.
well now i'm said, i was really looking forward to what paget had to say...wonder how i got skipped?
BAU1919, maybe you will get yours today. You should try e-mailing them to see what is going on. The chat is tonight so you still have time.
This episode was amazing :)
Upset that the time have to think that Prentiss is dead though....hopefully back next season?
I felt really sorry for Doyle though!
I think Seaver's character has a lot more to come. Glad JJ was back for an episode but it will make everyone miss her again! I really hope Paget returns next season. It was definitely Prentiss at the end, no doubt about it :)i think she will be back :) awesome episode!
i hope so, Cindy!
BAU1919...resend your email with BAU1919 in the subject line and I will make sure you get the password. Jill is has not been available for the last couple of days so the close date for the password request was Tuesday morning at 4AM eastern. I have access to the cmfchat email box and will send it to you if you put your handle in the subject line so I know who you are.
Thanks!
LOL Diedre!!
I'm sure kat887 thinks she is being witty by trying to insinuate that some people that post in this thread are childish and immature.
As for the password, I am not familiar with a lot the people who's requests have gone unanswered. Rock/hard place = me :(
There is absolutely nothing badass about Seaver. She's a dumbass character who cant hold a candle to the finetuned brilliance of Emily and JJ or even Garcia. She may be doing the job that she was given but she should not be on the job and it was a pity acceptance from Hotch that was done offscreen too.
Emily, JJ and Garcia,even Elle are the true badass ladies of CM. Well, not really Garcia but she's still great.
Seaver needs some love. So here it is she was great in this episode.
And i can only see her get better now that she will not stand in the shadow of Prentiss.
I see great character development in the future for seaver.
Kimmy's right. Seaver has some major badass potential. I've seen RN do some of the most delicious sarcasm I've ever seen on screen. And from what I understand, she's had some serious combat training from her action films that I can't see the writers not wanting to utilize in the future.
OK...I really liked this episode and found myself getting teared up with Emily when she listened to the voice mail from Garcia. I think MGG did a great job directing and love the fact that JJ was part of this episode and "part of the team" again, even if for only one episode. What I DID NOT like was Seaver. Get real...NONE of the other agents are whiny babies with an "I can't" attitude. The fact that Rossi had to figuratively shake some type of sense into her makes me wish she would have cracked completely under the pressure and left because she can't handle the work. I really disliked her character before, but now...please make her go away! Garcia dealt with with being shot, Reid dealt with drug addiction, Morgan dealt with false imprisonment, Prentiss dealt with Doyle and Hotch dealt with LISTENING TO HIS EX WIFE GETTING KILLED and did not break. All Seaver had was some guy getting shot in front of her and getting sprayed with blood and she crumbles! WEAK...send her packing, PLEASE!! If CBS has burned the bridges with AJ Cook and Paget Brewster, at least find a STRONG female character before this gets any worse!
A Criminal Minds Fan who hopes Seaver goes away!
I've seen a lot of Rn's stuff too and she's not a great actress. She has her moments but she's wrong for CM and so is her character. It does not fit especially compared to the others. Rn has had combat training and she was ok in GI Joe but she's not the same character. Seaver is a whiny baby who just doesnt get profiling. I think that being a fan of RN's other work is clouding ppl's judgment on her work on this show. Its not soley Rn, its the terrible writing of the Seaver character.
and holding the hand of a 30year old woman who supposedly has had great marks in her academy training...pathetic!
Agreed Hotch Fan, RN is not a great actress. I didn't like her on Alias and she is ruining CM for me. Even with the departure of Paget and AJ, if they had brought in an actress that could ACT I would have been able to accept her. And I'm sorry but I don't see the "delicious sarcasm" that anyone is talking about. You want sarcasm? Emily Prentiss hands down brought it. Seaver makes me laugh all right, and I don't mean that in a good way.
I would love to see JJ and Emily back and kickass. JJ is a perfect shot and its certainly beenimplied that both women could take down a bad guy in a hand to hand.
I am not "a fan of RN's other work." I've only seen GI Joe and thought that was trash. Once people started talking about the similarities to The Inside, I looked up a couple scenes and thought RN was brilliant in them (Jenna-this was the sarcasm I was referring to, not in CM).
So it's not cloudy fan judgment, it's just recognition of the potential that has yet to come to fruition.
I am not "a fan of RN's other work." I've only seen GI Joe and thought that was trash. Once people started talking about the similarities to The Inside, I looked up a couple scenes and thought RN was brilliant in them (Jenna-this was the sarcasm I was referring to, not in CM).
So it's not cloudy fan judgment, it's just recognition of the potential that has yet to come to fruition.
I continue to see CM, because I believe that after all these changes, you begin to weave a good story to the end of this season and the beginning of the next, and link to Doyle, Hotch and the possible return of Emily.
I also wish to see the consequences of the death of Prentiss on the team.
I know many are upset about Seaver, but I will not support the show, then six left, five are my darlings.
I for one, enjoyed the Fahey character. I thought he provided some much-needed comic relief in this episode. For instance:
"How about you, beanpole?" ::Reid looks around::
::Reid sniffs the air:: "Hoodrat"
"You know when a cigarette is really good? After sex with me."
Wow, they promised a hell of a send off for Emily, and I thought this certainly fit the bill. It was so different from a standard Criminal Minds episode, but that was to be expected concerning the subject matter. At least the show didn’t entirely abandon profiling, since that was Emily’s key mission and the key to discovering what Doyle’s true end game was.
This episode definitely highlighted the action, but also did not skimp on the character interaction. Everybody had something interesting to do. I was glad to see JJ return, though I thought she worked for the Pentagon, and not the State Department. Who cares, small price to pay to see her back contributing to the team. I especially loved Reid, Morgan and Rossi in this episode. Hotch was good as the team leader and I liked him leading the mission and trying to get Doyle to talk. He was the Hotch we know- deeply concerned and caring about Emily, but silent about it, and focused on the mission at hand. It was interesting to see Morgan both angry at Emily and concerned for her. He definitely felt betrayed over the fact that Emily withheld everything about Doyle from the team, particularly when he kept trying to get her to open up to him. But in the end, it was so touching to see Morgan as he found Emily. He was so concerned for her well being, but so proud over everything she had done at the end of her last mission. Reid was my favorite sensitive genius, and of course he was the one who made the “LR” connection to the cover names. He was so broken up at the end over Emily’s “death”, but I was so glad to see JJ call him Spence and give him a much needed hug. She’s always been his big sister and close friend and it was good to see her there comforting him when he needed it the most. I thought Rossi was definitely on fire this episode, and he had so many great moments. He knew exactly what was bothering Morgan and he knew what buttons to push to get him to talk. But he was the one who deduced that Emily was taking the fight to Doyle. He was very good with Ashley was well. It was interesting to see him display such a protective, paternalistic attitude with her, and it was interesting to see him push her to the breaking point to get her to mention the family annihilation angle. He knew the answer of course, but he had to force train her to say it. This was probably done to justify her placement on the team to the audience.
(cont)...
...(cont)
And of course there is Emily. This was a great highlight for Emily’s skills and capabilities, and why she was such an asset to the team all these years. I loved seeing her go all badass in Boston with grenades and machine guns. I guess her background really was CIA, but at the end of her mission, she transferred to the FBI. At least that is what I took away from this episode. I guess her entire FBI background had to be generated, but now I can see why she fought so hard for the BAU, and why she came to the team ready to profile. After all, her entire job with JTF-12 was profiling terrorists. It’s kind of a funny symmetry that Emily’s first full episode with her on the team, and her last episode was both terrorism related. Her first mission with the BAU was to help profile a terrorist, and so was her last one. I liked the flashbacks giving us hints of what Emily’s mission was, and in the end, how she saved Decklin from his father’s influence. It also certainly explained her compartmentalization skills, because she had to live a double life as long as she was conducting this operation. She’s always been caring and protective of those she cares about, and we really got a chance to see how much the team meant to Emily, and how much she meant to everybody. I think this might have been the first episode we’ve seen Emily cry, and it’s not surprising that it was Penelope who could bring about the tears. Penelope has that innocent, adorable, happy charm that you can’t help but love her and the care she shows for others.
I am glad that the show left it open for Emily to return, but I knew that going on. I was glad to see JJ and Emily together in Paris for one last get together. I presume Emily is now undercover trying to catch Doyle. If Paget ever chooses to return, I’m sure Doyle will conveniently die, and if she never does return, we can presume that Emily is around the world chasing down a terrorist. I couldn’t tell if Hotch knows the full story, though I presume he does. So of the entire BAU, he’s the only one who probably knows that Emily is alive. It’s probably better for the team if they truly believe she is dead. Her “funeral” was so sad, because the entire team was shattered she was gone. I feel that way now that Paget has left the show. I hope she returns in the future sometime, but I do wish her success with her future endeavors.
To Paget, if you'll get to read this: I hope you were happy with the send-off they gave Prentiss. Her absence on CM truly leaves a void. I have a feeling you just want to move on from CM, but I'll still harbor the hope you'll find your way back someday.
To AJ: It was wonderful to have you back even just for an episode. JJ's final scene with Prentiss was comforting somehow. Hoping Season 7 will have a pleasant surprise for us...
To the CM writers, collectively: I don't see how the way that you wrote the Seaver character in (as a cadet) can allow you to develop her character in the coming episodes in a credible way, and a way that does not insult the long-term viewers of the show. Having her continue to be a BAU trainee/baby profiler, asking obvious questions & being taught Profiling 101, will result in continued slowing down of the show's profiling give-and-take & continued dumbing down of the other erstwhile expert & savvy, now nannyish BAU members. But having her turn into Super Seaver, raw cadet/ soon-to-be rookie extraordinaire, whose profiling powers far surpass those of the more experienced members of the unit and whose input determines the solving of their cases, is not believable either and again creates out-of-character arcs for those unit members. And in Lauren, you write a scene for Seaver (to inaugurate her "coming out" as a profiler, I guess) in which both the abovementioned scenarios play out. Which is I think why it comes off as doubly ridiculous for some fans. I don't think you'll hear the end of the dislike for Seaver if you keep pushing her down our throats in this manner.
To my mind the scenario that could be credible, therefore acceptable to devoted fans is if Seaver goes off the show for a bit, to give the impression of time passing, then comes back in Season 7 if she has to but with substantially more years of experience and expertise under her belt. At any rate the actress who plays Seaver is about the same age as JJ (or even MGG), so it wouldn't be unbelievable for her to have racked up those
years & qualifications. You can be creative if you need to be and have her age faster than the other unit members, just so she can come back more experienced & qualified (wasn't this seemingly done for LaSalle on the spin-off?). I am pretty sure the opposition to her existence/presence on the show will be stilled then; even possible criticism re: her wimpy portrayal will be lessened because she'll expectedly be more mature and
confident then. If you really must keep the Seaver character, why not
"re-introduce" her this way. Because this other way you're going, creating scenarios where she's either Baby Ashley or Super Seaver, just isn't working. You worked hard to get us hooked on CM; now that we ARE invested in the show & its characters, I hope you'll take in our input about all we've found awry on the show in the recent past because what's behind it is a sincere desire for the show to find its way back to its old brilliance.
Loved this episode. It was so fast-paced, full of twists and emotional. I cried way too much. Paget is an amazing actor and MGG is a brilliant director. I loved the way he transitioned from the present to the past and abolutely loved everything about the Paris scene.
I'm not a fan of Seaver but I didn't mind her in this episode. I was really happy that they acknowledged the fact that she is not as close to Prentiss and not as emotionally affected. I would have hated it if she was shown to feel the same sorrow as everyone else. I know that there have been cases in the past where the team members have been personally affected because another team member was in danger but I felt this one was different. They learned a lot of new information about Prentiss - she wasn't who they believed she was for 5 years. Not only were they worried for her safety but were trying to process all this new information. Why not use fresh eyes if they are available. It's not like she solved the whole case and took over the episode. I think the focus remained on Prentiss as it should have. I think I feel the opposite of everyone else when it comes to the Seaver character. Most people are saying that the writing is terrible but the actress is good. I have to disagree, the writiing wasn't great in introducing her, I admit but I don't think the actress is delivering her lines well. The whole Narsasitic boyfriends line in this episode was just not done well. I don't know what it was about it but it just didn't seem right. I didn't have a problem with the line but with how she said it. I could picture Paget or AJ delivering the same line and achieving the intended goal. I'm not saying she's a bad actress, I've seen her other work and she's not bad but does not work for this role for some reason - just my opinion. I feel the same way about Forrest Whitaker in the spin-off, excellent actor but not right for this role. Maybe Seaver will grow into the role as time goes by.
I loved how Morgan was so upset at the beginning (and yes he seemed like a jerk but that's his role, always questioning others) but by the end he was all soft while holding Prentiss's hand. A really sweet scene. I also loved the scene where Prentiss was listening to GArcia's message - really emotional. The scene with Reid and JJ hugging was amazing. I cried so much.
What an amazing episode. I think this will affect Reid quite a bit. I think it will also eat away at Hotch - knowing that she is alive and watching his team in pain. I also like the fact that JJ is a big part of this and gives me hope that she may come back even if it's in a guest starring role.
Not saying everyone has cloudy judement on RN but I am saying that some do, specifically people who keep accusing Seaver dislikers of hate and not being able to offer up any valid reasons as to why Seaver belongs. There are no valid reasons for Seaver to be on the team. Most people can counteract them on the spot becuase the character is so badly written.
As for RN's acting, some like it, some dont. I thought THe Inside was a great idea for a show and had great potential but it had messed up writing and RN was not a good choice to play Rebecca Locke. RN cant pull off Clarice Starling. She was ok in Alias though.
Emily still seems to have gotten the short end of the stick, figuratively I mean. Her sendoff was too... it wasnt up to scale and Emily and Paget both deserve better. MGG did a great job directing it and everyone, save for RN, did a great job with the material. I cant wait to see Emily and JJ back on CM, and I am convinced it will happen one way or another. Now we just gotta get Hotch back to his leadership role.
i agree with whoever said that Emily went all Sarach Connor on Ian Doyle's team, with the grendaes and the huge gun and all. That was a fave Meily moment. Too bad they didnt continue with her one woman army thing.
THE DEADLINE TO REQUEST THE PASSWORD WAS TUESDAY MARCH 15 @ 4AM EASTERN TIME. IF YOU REQUESTED THE PASSWORD AFTER THAT TIME, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO RECEIVE IT.
I love this episode and thought Paget did a fantastic job as did MGG, and I am really sorry that it was her last. But I have to say am I the only one who thinks the way Prentiss left at the end it would make a great TV show of her traveling and going after Doyle aka “The Fugitive”. I think it would make a great show and Paget sure can do action really well. Maybe it’s just me :) Love to know what you guys think.
wow... they created a great ending for Paget... love the fact that Emily's not dead... so the path is open for the character to come back or not...
til then I wish Paget all the luck she needs for her new show... will definitely have a look into it...
CU sindee
So, first : thank you Paget for the years you gave us on Criminal Minds. You'll be greatly missed and I wish you all the luck in the world with your future projects (no matter what you choose to do).
The episode : it was a great and emotional one.
I was glad to see JJ back and sad at the same time since we know it's a one time thing (I'm still hoping she can come back full time).
The plot was good and interesting.
I guess we know what Doyle's intentions are : he'll want to find his son no matter what.
I was surprised to learn that Tsia's fiancé, Jeremy, was the one who sold the list to Doyle. I certainly didn't see that one coming in "Sense Memory" (when we learned he died).
A big part of me regrets the fact that Hotch is the only team member who knows about Prentiss being alive, but I also understand why it had to be this way.
Prentiss will be safer if her team (minus Hotch and JJ) thinks she's dead.
I guess Hotch is also protecting his team, he wants them to remain in the dark for their own safety.
Prentiss already tried to fool Doyle with a faked death, so he's probably going to be suspicious about her "second death".
If he thinks she's still alive and suspects her former colleagues to know about her whereabouts and new identity, they're going to be in danger once again.
I'm not even sure the whole team will learn about Prentiss being alive at some point.
If Paget doesn't come back for the seventh season they might never find out the truth.
I loved Garcia's message to Prentiss about them being in that dark place with her, waving flashlights and calling her name.
On a side note, I think MGG did a wonderful job at directing the episode and managed to highlight the reactions of the characters in a realistic and emotional way.
Some fans talked about Reid's headaches and I too am really curious to see where this story will go.
I'm still hoping a physical cause for his symptoms can be found, something the doctors missed so far.
I would be really disappointed if his headaches are "just" caused by the emotional strain and stress of the job.
Maybe there's a physical cause for his problems (I hope) but the emotional impact of the recent events is going to exacerbate his symptoms.
The plot was a bit hard to follow but it was redeemed by a few good intimate moments among the team.
Kudos to Matthew for helming a lovely send-off to Paget. She shined in her moments and will be missed.
There was so much to like in this episode. Garcia’s heartbreaking voice on Emily’s voicemail – and her reaction to it. The words were absolutely beautiful “We’re coming for you.” Sweet, and perfectly done.
I was really struck by the visuals on JJ’s return, the great angle on her entrance and her new look – very put-together, professional, powerful. She was much more casual when she was on the team; the change was a clear indication that she’s not just sulking away over at the Pentagon. Nice, nice choices. (I’m gonna credit MGG for this.) I do wish she’d had a lot more screen time, though. Or, you know, that she was coming back for good.
I loved the scene with Prentiss playing with the child. So sweet and natural. It was a great send-off for Paget overall. Very powerful, and some outstanding acting from her. Kick ass indeed, and smart, and as ruthless as the criminals. The flash-back scenes were terrific.
Not enough Hotch, as usual, and too much of him being grim. I caught a rerun the other day where Garcia is babbling on the phone and as she hangs up, he grimly says, “Remind me to have her drug tested.” It’s a throw-away line, delivered dead-straight, but really funny. I wish we had more of that. (But after Paget’s departure, I’m seriously hoping TG doesn’t see an old rerun of “Dharma and Greg” and say, “Oh, yeah, I really liked doing comedy, too …”)
Morgan was himself, hot-headed and passionate, and that was terrific.
But Seaver. Seriously, when you point a gun at a character and a good percentage of the fan base screams, “Shoot her! Shoot her!” you have big problems. Big. Problems. The hand-holding scene felt manipulative, OOC and stupid to me. It was actually painful to watch. And if she doesn’t have the instinct to duck when the blood spatters, she’s not going to last long with this team.
So, anyhow – I almost hate to ask this, but now what? Are they going to bring in a new character to replace Prentiss? It almost seems like they have to, but I haven’t heard any speculation about that. It almost has to be a woman, right? I hate to see Paget replaced, but – they’re going to replace her, right? We’re not really going to pretend Seaver can replace Prentiss, are we?
I really want to continue liking the show, but to quote John Adams, “I have such a desire to knock heads together!”
Erm -- I was just thinking that I should have said something about the great grave-side scene, which was really touching and beautiful. And the headstone ... hey, wait a minute. Except when they're burying Grandma next to Grandpa under a single marker, the headstone is never carved and set prior to the burial.
(Yeah, I had to nitpick. But at least they didn't have dump sites north of Cleveland like that other show. Heh!)
oh just give it a rest with the complaining about seaver. She is NEW to the team lin you never been new at a job before Lin. She has to learn get it in your brain.
Mikey, why don't you give it a rest with trying to dictate how others should post about the show and/or the character.
You like her, we get that. I and others don't think her character is a fit for the show, so just get that. We don't tell you not to profess your like for her, so please don't try and tell us not to point out things such as the things that sdwally and Lin from Ohio have.
Lin,
I've seen some other comments about Seaver's lack of ducking and had to comment. This was a sniper using a silencer from long distance. Seaver wouldn't have heard the gunshots. From her perspective, she would have just seen blood appear out of nowhere. Even Fahey looked like he had no idea what happened. It took Rossi a few seconds too.
Mikey, you need to be respectful here or you can find another forum to post. You can disagree with people but telling someone to "get it in their brain" is where I draw the line.
You all can fight back and forth about whether a character does or doesn't belong all day long but I will not allow personal attacks.
Got it?
I will delete the next one I see.
Thanks
Kris
And I don't just mean from Mikey. We are all adults here. Play nice.
Thanks!
Lin from Ohio, you got me a little stumped with the John Adams quote... going to have to Google it :)
Thanks for putting that out there Kris!
People disagree, people agree. Digest it, debate it respectfully if you wish, then move on.
Rebecca --
I'm sorry, I've mislead you. It's not really John Adams (probably). It's the character's line from the musical "1776". ;-)
Bloody hell - my source provides me with the goods pretty sharpish and there's over 500 comments already!! I've skim read them, so I apologise if there's anything I ask which has already been covered (and I've missed it).
What can I say what hasn't already been said?!
Paget Brewster was amazing.
MGG did a superb job with the directing.
The Seaver & Rossi scene irked me, it just seemed rather contrived. Nuff said.
Obviously JJ knows about Prentiss' death being faked, and I'm assuming Hotch does too after their "silent conversation" outside the waiting room. However, to me the rest of the team appear to think she's actually dead? Either that or the characters are good actors?
Not enough JJ; the scenes where she presented the information just showed how much she is missed. I hope PB returns next season, but if she chooses not to I hope her new show succeeds (shame on you CBS).
I thought she'd genuinely been killed off for a few minutes (my stiff upper lip was about to start to quiver) so I loved the twist at the end. Anyway, who says they were in Paris?! Google "Blackpool Tower" (sorry - couldn't resist).
I also assume Doyle escaped? He did well to get past a load of Feds and a SWAT team or five! Does this mean he'll be back sometime soon, or maybe next season? (rhetorical question).
Yeah, on the whole I loved it and can't wait until the next episode. When it is? I've gathered it's a repeat next week, so my source has at least a week off. I'm looking forward to seeing the fallout - someone said they reckon Reid's going to have some sort of breakdown over this, I would only think that could be the case if he genuinely believes Prentiss is dead.
~~ Rubs hands together in anticipation ~~
p.s. Sorry about the ramble.
The contents of the brackets should have read:
(I really should get myself a new name)
btw...
I did not recieve the password for the chat with Paget either and I sent the email (multiple times) before the 15th.
Lin from Ohio, good thing I can back on here was going to start the Google search soon, LOL
Disappointely Confused, the Reid breakdown/headache thing that you read was someone just putting out there what they think should happen with Reid and his headaches and maybe a possible breakdown in the future, nothing that is officially been said for an episode.
This episode was EPIC!!! I will admit, I started crying when Morgan was talking to Prentiss while she was "dying". I loved Garcia's message,When Morgan talked to Emily while she was impaled and Reid at the very end.
Honestly, I think that Emily is not coming back and Doyle won't be shown again, which really frustrates me.
I have such a mixed variety of emotions: frustration and sadness that Paget was cut for no stupid reason, curiosity about what's going to happen next, and hope that myabe, just maybe Paget will come back.
Yes, there were bits of the episode that annoyed me, like the fact that JJ wasn't shown enough, but it was epic.
It will be interestin to see how the team reacts in further episodes to one of their own "dying".
I won't stop watching but it's more out of curisoity.
Overall, I really liked the episode, but I am extremly disapointed that it is Prentiss's last (being that she "was" my favorite character. I wish good look to Paget in all her future plans
P.S. I love that you have a "Source, " LOL
Diedra,
Actually I was referring to my belief that there are teenagers posting on the site and there's really no reason to get into an extended argument with a teenager over a TV show. Just state your case and move on.
Paget Fan...if you still have not received your password. Put Paget Fan in the subject line so I know which email belongs to you.
Thanks!
Kris
Hello everyone :))
I'm sorry but I never participate to a chat before and I wanna know when the chatroom going to be open ! (I try the password and for the moment it doesn't work so I'm kind of nervous)
Thank you !
I really love that episode, Paget was wonderful, I'm so sad now CM never be the same anymore. I'm so mad after CBS to have destroy that wonderful show.
Emily Prentiss was a terrific, beautiful, smart, kind, badass woman ! I'm gonna to miss her so much. She's the best role model ever.
I stop here because I'm not good in english and unfortunately I can make a constructive comment like you :(
French viewer
Matthew Gray Gubler's directing was astounding, and the return of A.J. Cook just showed how vital she is to the BAU and how idiotic CBS's choice really is. And Paget Brewster, oh my gosh, Paget. Not surprisingly you gave a stellar performance that will be in my memory forever. Every tiny look, sound, and action conveyed emotion and was simply flawless. Thank you for 5 delightful years; you and Emily Prentiss will hold a dear place in my heart forever. I just can't wait to see what the future holds for you, and I will be there right behind you.
It was a good solid 6 years Criminal Minds, full of love, laughter, fear, anguish, amazement, and admiration. But the next episode on March 30th will probably be my last.
I had fun watching Hotch,Prentiss, Reid, JJ, Gideon, Garcia, Morgan and Rossi dig deep inside the mind of the criminals, but after losing some of the best minds, I don't think I will be able to continue.
I don't dare to join you anymore.
Best of Luck,
Alexis.
@ Rebecca:
My "Source" is vital - firstly the UK is a few episodes behind and secondly I (through choice) only have the free TV channels so don't have the channel on which CM is shown in this backward nation. ;-) (The first season was shown on one of the free channels so I got hooked - and then it moved. How rude...). Luckily I have my contact who does their Garcia-esque computer thing for me on Thursdays.
I gathered the Reid's headaches and possible future breakdown was speculation, although I'd come up with the same theory. I hope they don't brush it under the rug now, although there's not many episodes left (six?) to find out the rest of the team's secrets.
I did some googling - looks like it'll be a couple of weeks until my next fix.
OK, I love it! Love to have something like a fanfiction turn into canon...I LOVE IT!! I'd love for a Emily/Hotch moment, but I love the send off, I want to see her return, if as a guest only, but see her again. Anyway, CM just lost another regular viewer, I'm turning in occasional one. I miss the old team dynamics and the strong female presence, and the good vibe between them.
i this will be the last season now paget is gone and aj maye thomas gibson and shemar moorethanks to cbs
After watching a 3 month old all day, I get on here to read some insightful comments and get some mature conversation and see more of the Seaver - bashing retorts: Mind you I seen NEXT TO NO Seaver bashing, only the continual disppointment by CM Fanatics of the character Seaver's role Yet, there are still several posts that say next to nothing but to leave Seaver alone, she is only a trainee, stop the hating, etc. and next to nada about the show, the other actors, MGG's terrific directing or anything POSITIVE..
Today it would appear to be a combo of anonymous (as usual) and Mikey. Earlier this week, it was Ben.
Mikey, let me just make a suggestion to you, sweetie, why don't you and Ben get together and start an "RN as Seaver" Fan Club? Or because RN may not have future with CM since CM may not have a future, maybe just an RN Fan Club? You can develop a website for persons of like interest and do what you can to promote the actress you like and respect so much. I mean this.
Defending her here does nothing to promote her - it only makes staunch CM fans mad because the overwhelming majority know here that she is not a fit for this show. No amount of "training" from Rossi or otherwise is ever going to change the circumstances that allowed her to ever become a member of this team. Not in our minds, anyway.
This is not sarcasm, guys, this is the truth, and I am sick and tired of reading all the drivel about this subject expecially in light of Paget's recent departure that leaves most of us feeling emotional about. We are discussing our missing JJ, Paget, the rest of the cast's acting, the directing of Matthew, etc.
Please go find a more positive way to display, demonstrate and promote Rachel Nichols because this in not the place to do so.
I am a regular poster who always names myself but will post this as an "unsub" today just because that's how I'm feeling.
For those of you fortunate enuf to chat with Paget tonite, pls give her our very best: she did a wonderful job, she can walk away proud, we will follow her to her new show (still hoping she will come back of course) and that we love her very much. Thanks!
Anonymous 44
I really liked this episode the best out of the whole Ian Doyle/Emily Prentiss story line. MGG did a great job directing this episode. The ending did surprise me, but I knew it would either go one of two ways: they'd either kill her off completely, or they'd find a way to leave it open to a future Emily sighting... but without Ian Doyle being caught and Emily still alive (though I think only Hotch and JJ know this), I think the CM writers have left their options open to bring them back in another epi. Great show. Curious to see how the show carries on without Prentis and wonder if they will bring in another new team member down the road...
Anonymous 44, I love you!
Just gonna say Mantegna just retweeted this
destinyisms @RachelNichols1 You should not be suprised by all the support. You were awesome last night. You and @JoeMantegna are so good together!!!
Well even though the episode was great, im still really upset that they took Prentiss off the show! Seriously? Hoe many cast members are they gonna take out before they realize the show was perfect the way it was?! Im gonna miss emily. But maybe they will think about bringing her back? I hope! I wish the rest of the team knew about emily still being alive at the end. That might have made a change for the future shows. Maybe she will come back and maybe the show will be just as good as it was meant to be :) let's hope so!
Kenneth, you just went to what Anonymous 44 just wrote. Please consider doing the fan club or website or whatever.
Look the fact that JM tweeted that makes absolutely no difference to me. I think that the character is a fail, an epic fail and no tweets, pictures, videos, etc. is going to change my mind and I suspect other people's mind. I'm sure if you start a club, you can put stuff like that on it. I think that would be cool, but please, take another look at that post and consider what Anonymous 44 said seriously, please.
madeline take a chill pill. The guy just posted a retweet that Joe Mantegna don't understand the dislike of Seaver
I am understanding that you guys will not understand because you just don't. you don't get the point and you will just continue to make people angry. But maybe that is what you want.. have at it then. But let me say that your actions speak louder than anything you can/will type here.
If you don't understand the dislike and the reason why people don't think she is a fit Anna, I'm sorry, but you simply haven't been reading anything that has been writing in any of the threads here. It is almost unbelievable to me that at this point someone would say that they don't understand. Not agree, okay, but not understand.... A quick read would tell you why, there are plenty of posts to read about that very topic.
Anonymous and Madeline,
I'm not a huge fan of Seaver, but I disagree with what you are saying. It seems very much like you are declaring this board an anti-Seaver club and telling people who support Seaver to go somewhere else?
If we can come on here and post reasons why we dislike Seaver, they should be able to post reasons why they like her. Who cares if they also like RN? This board is about the cast as much as it is about the characters.
Because as Anonymous 44 said, it is never anything but stop "hating," which for the love of God is so stupid, or stop disliking Seaver/RN, never anything about the rest of the cast, the show, nothing positive as Anonymous 44 said which makes it seem that they are not interested in any other project than that, and to the postes point, that is not accomplishing anything but making people angry because there is no regard to people's opnion, absolutely no sense that they have read any arguments posted by people that have issues with the character, nope, just a knee jerk reaction to anything they deem is negative. If that is the case, then this is really not the place for that. Time, I think, would be much better spent, as Anonymous 44 stated, in starting a dedicated site for RN instead of coming here and constantly getting into ridiculousness like calling people "haters."
Anonymous 44 the moderators seem pretty vigilant about deleting disrespectful comments. Otherwise people should be free to post whatever opinions they want, even pro-Seaver opinions as much as some people may not like it.
Laura J., I think the point was not so much being disrespectful, but rather, the usefulness of just coming here to get into a situation where they are saying stuff like people are haters while not saying anything at all about the show, the rest of the cast, the episode, nada as Anonymous 44 stated. I have seen that myself, it is just a knee jerk reaction to when someone has a criticism about that character.
Of course, this is my intrepetation of what Anonymous 44 said, Anonymous 44, please correct me if I am wrong.
Sorry about my typos in my previous post.
I meant Lauren J., sorry...
Listen, I agree that none of the Seaver conversation is really that useful, and neither side is convincing the other by going back and forth endlessly. But there are a lot of "useless" anti-Seaver comments by your definition. So I just don't think it's fair to single out one side to shut down, because it's both sides that are the problem.
I think that Anonymous 44 should speak to what you posed as he/she is the one that made the comment and would be better able to explain what he/she meant and why. I would just be guessing and that is probably not good.
A relatively good episode considering this season as a whole but nowhere near '100'. I thought that Paget was marvelous and I'm very relieved that she didn't die, whether or not the character returns. Like sdwally and others have observed, I am both concerned and sick of the lack of Hotch this season. TG is a wonderful actor and the undisputed leader of this team. You always know when he is in the room (which is just as well considering the writers seem intent on trying to push him to the background). There were so many opportunities in this arc to give the fans some H/P moments (in a non-shipping way) yet they chose to rip us off and give us nothing.
Paget, you will be sorely missed.
Thomas, if you go, I go too.
Madeline: you are exactly right. TY very much. I truly don't know why someone would care to continue to post here and rarely say anything positive about anything significant.
Once you have stated your point, there seems to be no confusion about your likes and dislikes but truthfully, the dislike FOR THE MAJORITY who have remarked about Seaver is for the character, not the actress, and I don't get why anyone would care to continue to argue their point about something that so many of us see differently and have for so long? MONTHS, now.
I say, if you are actually RN fans, then go where she can benefit from your devotion.
THIS blog is for CM devotees who really care about this show. And I don't think the moderators should have to act as hall monitors to continue to reiterate the same warnings to the smae people. I think it is a waste of time and find it to be juvenile as well.
We all have manners as well as opinions, I say USE THEM. And your common sense as well.
Not too much to ask now, is it?
Anonymous 44
Anyone else feel like Ben, Mikey, and Kenneth are all the same person? All their posts sound the same to me. I'mjust saying.
lauren j.:
You are right, also, there has been way too much spent on both sides of the Seaver issue. I don't remember when I last made such a comment - for me, it has all been said, time and time again, and this blog is for those sincere fans of the show, of which I am still one. I may not like the Seaver character, but I don't see that continuing to go on and on IN EITHER DIRECTION has done anything but anger people here and I just don't see what that accomplishes - certainly nothing fun, and that's a big reason I come here....to share a love/interest in a show we have in common.
Anonymous 44
jenna: the thought crossed my mind. I also thought there was a third one but did not look for him.
And I thought I didn't have a life...could these guys truly no have anything better to do?
Don't answer that...
Anonymous 44
I think those who are pro Seaver as well as those who are con Seaver should be allowed to have their say on the subject. If the guys seem to like her because she is a hot blond, well I can't blame them, I tune in for MGG. However, I do think it is not too much to expect that each side be respectful to the other. Just because I don't like a particular character doesn't mean I should be labeled a hater. That is rude, especially since all the Seaver detracters have given reasons ad nauseum why we don't think much of the character and all the pro Seaver people can give us in return is, "Wait, she'll get better." It never took me half a season to warm up to any of the other characters and let's face it, if I haven't warmed up to her by now, it ain't happening. But, you're entitled to your opinion, just refrain from all the hater language. It doesn't appear to me that those who don't like Seaver are calling you names.
I thought Lauren was a very good episode and MGG did a great job of directing it. It was too bad we didn't see more of JJ on her return, but I understand that this was Paget's night as it should have been.
I'm glad they left it open for Paget's return or at least the return of Ian Doyle to reek havoc on the team.
Loved Garcia's VM and Reid's hug with JJ.
Thanks to all the cast and crew for their work on this emotional episode and to Paget for giving us five years of the great Emily Prentiss. She cannot be replaced.
Wow what a fantastic episode full of suspense to bad we had to lose prentiss. But glad she didn't die.
And finally ashley seaver woke up. It had to take someone to get shot right before her eyes lol.
After Rossi pushed her she was really up front with the answers. So glad she is finally coming into her own.
Now i see her grow into a very strong person on this show. She will only become better and better now
Poor Boston. CM picks on Boston.
Remember the pilot episode? Remember where Adrian Bale blew up those agents and hostages? Yeah -- that was Boston. And I think there was another episode there, too.
The BAU should just refuse to go there from now on.
Thinking about it, there are quite a few parallels between Seaver and Rossi that go to explain his interest in mentoring her. Apart from the past history they have in common, there's an unconventionality about them -- a not-doing-things-by-the book approach. But most importantly, there's that sense of making things personal. It's been bugging me who Seaver reminded me of when she went (foolhardily) to apologise to the family of the murdered woman. It's Rossi of course with his driven need (seen a few times) to make amends for events that were not ever his fault really. Seaver's relationship to her father's deeds stands like Rossi's relationship to hurts he could not prevent.
Then add to this the way Seaver's thoughts came tumbling out of her under duress. She's an emotional thinker, very different both from the dry Hotch approach or the cerebral boy genius Reid. Her style is decidedly Rossian.
Then there's that strand that comes from MGG's interview where he says that for Rossi losing Emily is like losing a daughter. The timing of Emily's lost is guaranteed to underpin the father/daughter quality of the Rossi/Seaver relationship.
Any way, I really like the two of them together and think it'll be good for the show. Mantegna and Nichols together make a decisive new feature for the writers to deploy and involve in further stories. Another string to their bow. Exciting in this time of change to have this strong flavour to add.
I'm feeling really quite positive about CM after watching that great episode. It didn't close down the chance of Emily's return and it was a rolicking good eppy.
UK viewer
Doh! 'lost' = 'loss'. ('Emily's loss'.)
Must remember to proof read.
UK viewer
UK viewer said..
"Her style is decidedly Rossian."
Is this show becoming some sappy melodrama where inept, inexperienced, unqualified, and totally without merit cadets are being added into the mix? Is this supposed father/daughter relationship going to continue overshadowing the need for any experience, depth, and expertise at the BAU? Are the side show follies with this character that do nothing but degrade, diminish, slow down, and transform the other characters into sorry shells of their former selves going to continue? If so, could you please let me know now CBS and CM so that I can delete CM from my DVR schedule now. Also, if this poor excuse for a supposed female agent is not shipped to some field office come season 7 where she belongs but rather returns to continue this sappy melodramatic side freak show that completely ignores the universe of specialization and expertise that you set up, please let me know now so that I'll know that CM will not make any sort of appearance on my DVR schedule come season 7 or any other season after that where this pathetic excuse for a character will be on the show.
'Supposed female agent': that would be one hell of a secret. Intriguing
UK viewer
@ uk viewer
You spoke out what I was trying to figure out. I was warming up very much to Seaver but I didn`t know why until your post. I agree, Seaver a not-doing-it -by the -book-person. And she has that sense of making things personal and the need to make amends of things that are not her fault. Seaver is an emotional thinker like Rossi and I have to add Morgan. I have always been drawn most to Morgan and Rossi because they are emotional profilers, natural profilers.
zagi, that's so funny! I've always grouped Morgan and Rossi together too without thinking why exactly but your 'natural profilers' is good. And there's another link to Seaver in that. If Morgan's a natural, it's likely his skills come in part from his history of childhood abuse where he had to watch adults closely to decode their behaviour and try to keep himself safe. Seaver will have had some of the same experience with her father.
I enjoy the other aspects of profiling -- Reid's code-breaking/pattern-finding genius and Garcia's technical rapidity, but it really is this people-reading that is most fascinating element for me on CM. People watching is something you just can't get tired of!
I remember what you said about not wanting Rossi to be just tied to this one role, zagi, and I strongly agree, but Mantegna has always gone a little bit ignored by the writers (to my astonishment) so if this story gives them a reason to write for him more and to boost this natural profiler side of things, I'll be a very happy watcher.
UK viewer
PS delighted to have a positive conversation on here. Really really delighted
Swamini from India…
Wow!! It was a great episode. “Lauren” goes on to show yet again what an exceptional actress Paget really is. (It was a treat to see Prentiss playing two roles- 1. Loving & caring person, and protective of her BAU family and friends , and 2. Tough agent with skills and capabilities to bring down Doyle).
MGG has did a great job at directing. Glad to see AJ Cook back but for a short yet vital role in the episode.
My fav moments:
*Emily going after Doyle with big guns and grenades.
*Emily playing with Decklin.
*JJ comforting Reid.
*Emily’s reaction to Garcia’s VM.
*Morgan’s scene with Emily holding her hand and urging her to fight.
*Rossi and Reid’s interrogation with Fahey.
*JJ & Emily scene in the end…
This episode was a perfect combination of action and emotion. I definitely want to see what comes next.
Paget you will be missed. I wish you success in future endevours.
To those fortunate enough to take part in the chat with Paget, are the chat topics off-limits to non-chatters or is it possible to post after-"Lauren" news or other interesting stuff here? Paget isn't tweeting often these days and it would be appreciated if we could be updated on how she is, her plans, etc., if there are no restrictions on such sharing. Thanks in any case.
To all the 'positive' posters who have decided that Seaver should be Rossi's new 'daughter' - you've GOT to be kidding!?
This is a show about FBI profilers seeking serial killers! We don't want/need personal storylines to make this a better show. We definitely don't need 'daddy Rossi' trying to teach 'baby Seaver' how to do the job! It was a great show to start with until they (powers that be) got rid of the best writers and two very strong and capable characters. Unfortunately, it's gone down hill since all of this began.
To the ones who think that we (true and long-term fans) just don't like Seaver because she resembles JJ - you can give that up, too. If they had gotten rid of two male characters or one male and one female, we would still feel the same way. The Seaver character (and possibly, but I won't say for sure, the actress as well) bring absolutely NOTHING to the table! No emotion other than being a cry-baby and an inept ability to relate in scenes, no talent or dept to the character no matter how badly written is has been for her, and definitely no experience as an agent, no knowledge of profiling, etc, etc. Do I really need to go on?
I give you credit for seeing something there that interests you - that's what TV viewing is all about. But the reality is that many viewers, commenting on many boards, have made it very clear that this character is NOT a positive addition to this show/cast.
Just my opinion....thanks for listening.
Oh, and let me just add - Seaver has absolutely NOTHING in common with Rossi. They are light-years apart in personality and profiling capabilities. Especially, since Seaver has NO profiling capability whatsoever and Rossi was a founding member of the BAU....
Ah c'mon, Nanci, there's something in common. They're both carbon-based bipedal lifeforms. That's a start.
There's more there than that though, IMO. There has to be a reason why they connect. We just don't see it yet. Why is Rossi ready to mentor Seaver when he wasn't ready to do the same for Reid, at least at first? Reid's less in need of hands-on coaching of course but there's also less that Rossi can give to Reid. Reid's already got what he needs in spades and he has a different kind of brain to anyone else in the immediate environment. But Seaver's giving off something that everyone's favourite 'goateed fella' seems to key into.
To be accurate, I don't think it's strictly the father-daughter relationship that either I or zagi were talking about but rather a particular profiling style that we'd like to see more of on CM. But I'm not going to say any more about that cos I don't want to be putting words in zagi's mouth.
UK viewer
PS loved your list of good bits swamini
I don't see anything in common except that they are both breathing. I am sure that the writers will unfortunately try to cook up something that will not only undermine the Rossi character as he will now be the team babysitter for this ridiculous character, but it will continue to invalidate the rest of the team members expertise and experience, not to mention that of the BAU.
This is just an absurd character that is helping to bring down a once great show. Well, if this babysitting, hand holding junk is what CM has in store for the rest of this season and next, count me and my DVR out and I'll just have to chalk this up to yet another show that I will no longer watch.
Even though I don't like Ashley at all, I do agree that Rossi has a very protective, paternalistic attitude toward her, and I'm not sure how I feel about that to be honest. It was odd to watch Rossi so protective of Ashley when they were talking to Fahey. If he doesn't think she is strong enough to handle some verbal sexual harassment by a criminal, then she is not strong enough to be in this unit. Correct me if I am wrong, but Emily withstood Karl Arnold and didn't need Hotch to step in (I can't remember those scenes from "Outfoxed" perfectly). JJ put up with Jacob Dawes in "Riding the Lightning" though Hotch was not too pleased when he wanted to sniff her hair. Couple that protectiveness with him literally holding her hand to try and get her to think, and it seemed a bit over the top to me. I hope the writers don't bring anything else like that again to the shows, because if I have to see Rossi babysit her through her tenure at the BAU, it will just continue to underscore her lack of qualifications to be on the team. And I agree that Ashley thinks way too emotionally, and I also hope to never see her go apologize to a victim's family in the name of the killer's family. That made me cringe during that scene, because she had no right to do that, and she was so wrapped up in her own emotional pain, that she could not do her job at all. She will have to learn emotional distance if she is to be effective.
Moving on to something completely different. Did anyone else notice all the parallels to Revelations.
1) Flashbacks
2) Team desperately searching for
their friend
3) Team member tied to a chair and
tortured
4) Having to watch a murder on the
Internet.
5) Garcia's wonderful speech - you
must be so scared, alone and in
the dark (Emily/Reid) and of
course the heartbreaking line
to stay alive, we have
flashlights and are calling
your name. We are coming.
(The cemetary scene when
they are coming for Reid)
Just my thoughts as I was watching again.
Yeah, I kinda thought of some Revelations parallels with Lauren too, especially with Prentiss tied to a chair and tortured, just like Reid. In fact, one thing I thought might have been going through her mind was "Was this how Reid felt? When he was kidnapped by Tobias?"
I'll have to rewatch the episode Anonymous, but those seem like some good parallels between those two episodes.
OK, UK viewer, I understand your need to find something positive re:Seaver character. It's OK, we all have our opinions - it's just that the 'winning' (Charlie Sheen!) opinion is that Seaver is bringing down our favorite show.
That said - I totally agree with you Meredith. I can't watch Rossi's role being dumbed-down to accommodate a character that just needs to be 'relieved of her duties'. If that's what they're going to write for Rossi after not giving him anything worthwhile to do for awhile now - what a slap in the face to the talents of Joe Mantegna! Or...is it because no one else on the 'team' (i.e., actors) wanted to babysit this newcomer...? Hmm....
On the positive side, and I'm really tired of 'hating' on the Seaver character...just get rid of her...I still love CM, have some hope for a return to what the show was originally created to be and just want more Rossi, Reid, Morgan, Hotch and Garcia. That's really all they need to keep this show great (if they can't get back Paget and A.J.)....
LaShawna,
I'm afraid you misinterpreted the roof scene with Fahey. Rossi was not "protecting" Seaver through his indignation toward Fahey's comments. Rossi and Seaver were playing, as Fahey put it, "sexy cop/ bad cop." The entire interchange was an interrogation tactic. You have one cop act really mean and intimidating so the suspect feels drawn toward the nicer cop and spills the beans to her.
You were not watching a bumbling FBI agent and her overprotective mentor holding her hand. You were watching two skilled interrogators acting in tandem to extract information.
Nanci i don't agree with your negative view on ashley seaver at all.
Let us who like her like her. You can't change our minds like we can't change yours.
So just leave it at that.
I myself after this weeks episode sees big character change in her and only for the better.
Anonymous,
Regarding your explanation of the roof scene.
It's possible that they were playing sexy cop (was that Rossi'?, LOL!) and bad cop (obviously Seaver LOL!) - but in all honesty, it's hard to determine what's really going on where Seaver is concerned as she hasn't done ANYTHING to prove she knows what the heck is going on since she started!!!
As for being protective of her during the interrogation, that might be but again, she's been so bad at everything that she's been involved in, it's very hard to determine what part she's playing in any given scene.
I didn't get the bad cop/sexy cop routine at all - I might be jaded when it comes to this character but really, it's hard to find her credible at anything. She has no experience - did SHE know it was that routine...? I didn't get that...Sorry.
Nicolas
I let everyone view the characters as they like - again, like I said earlier, that's what TV viewing is all about.
Liking the character means you're in the minority here but that's OK with the rest of us.
I don't see ANYTHING remotely resembling a growing of this character in future episodes. If she was going to 'grab us' the time has come and gone.
Anonymous said...
"LaShawna,
I'm afraid you misinterpreted the roof scene with Fahey. Rossi was not "protecting" Seaver through his indignation toward Fahey's comments. Rossi and Seaver were playing, as Fahey put it, "sexy cop/ bad cop." The entire interchange was an interrogation tactic. You have one cop act really mean and intimidating so the suspect feels drawn toward the nicer cop and spills the beans to her.
You were not watching a bumbling FBI agent and her overprotective mentor holding her hand. You were watching two skilled interrogators acting in tandem to extract information."
No, LaShawna was right. Seaver is not skilled in anything, let alone interrogations which was quickly proved right after the Faley roof scene when Rossi literally had to hold her hand to get her to spit information out. She said "No, no, I can't I haven't read all of the textbooks yet." Does that sound like someone who is at all skilled, confident, experienced or for that matter at all qualified for the BAU? The JJ and Prentiss examples that LaShawna brought up were right on target and a perfect contrast to the ridiculous Rossi and Seaver scene. It waa a bumbling scene by a cadet who has absolutely no business being in a unit like the BAU. Nanci, I am with you, just get rid of this character already as it is all sahdes of stupid for a show that was once so intelligent like Criminal Minds.
*shades*
Erin,
Totally agree! I forgot about her 'emotional' line "I haven't read all the textbooks yet"...SERIOUSLY!? If someone was holding a gun to her head (or another team member's) is this really the backup support they want?!!
She isn't qualified, plain and simple.
Nanci,
Before the rooftop interrogation, they pretty much said they were going to use that tactic. Seaver said they should let him smoke to get him to relax, and when Hotch asked if that would be enough, she indicated that she also had some experience in talking to narcissists.
Then when they were on the roof it was very obvious. The language Seaver used ("after all, you're the man aren't you?") was CLEARLY sexy cop trying to lure him into a false sense of ease.
Since Rossi already played bad cop in the other interrogation room (grabbing the ear), that's what he continued to do to push Fahey more toward Seaver.
But yes, I agree that Rossi is very much "sexy cop" ;)
Thanks for explaining - I really didn't pay attention that closely - the episode was very intense and there was a lot going on.
I remember she did say she had experience with naricissists...dating them and all! (teasing!)
Yea, Rossi's hot and I really hate to see them use him as babysitter...just isn't right on so many levels.
Sexy cop routines, cadets that haven't read all of the textbooks and have no damn experience, "BAU babysitting, hand holding camp," come one Criminal Minds get back to the days when you had a kick ass team full of people that had the chomps to be there, back to the days when the scripts were written with subtly and intelligence. You are becoming just like all of the other crap crime dramas out there but worse because at least the ones I've seen don't add a completely useless and inexperienced character on top of their crappy scripts. They at least stick experienced cops on there, still crappy scripts, but at least the characters make sense in the crappy show.
Oscar,
Absolutely! I was just thinking the same thing!
I just want my favorite show back. I can even tolerate a few 'bad' scripts, but for the love of all that's holy - bring this show back strong and capable!
Nanci said:
"I forgot about her 'emotional' line "I haven't read all the textbooks yet"...SERIOUSLY!?"
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that. You haven't read them all? Then why would we EVER see you without a textbook/Kindle in your hand? On the plane, walking down the hall, in the bathroom -- you landed this sweet assignment that more senior and qualified agents would kill for, and you're not racing to catch up as fast as you can?
What an dramatically over the top and fake finale for an episode. Geez.
Can we have Emily back now and erase all of this nonsense that the Network caused, please?
Sonia
Lin from Ohio, but that would then highlight how she should absolutely not be there. Experienced agents would kill for the spot that she has, the kicker is they actually deserve that spot because they have read all of the textbooks as well as have the experience to back up that textbook knowledge. And before anyone brings it up because I am sick to death of the comparison because there is no comparison, Reid is a genius to the highest order, skills and intelligence not seen by many and whom very few have. If Seaver proves to have an IQ of 187, an eidetic memory, can read 20,000 words a minute, has 3 doctorates, then I'll personally pull up a chair for her at the BAU table. She doesn't even come close to this, so adios, the character is dumbing down the show!
"I forgot about her 'emotional' line "I haven't read all the textbooks yet"...SERIOUSLY!?"
Seriously, can she read them all, learn by heart, learn to apply that knowledge and than in 10 years she actually applies to the BAU and see if she makes in, PLEASE?
Please show, get your own background/history together. Come on, marathon in my house if we have to.
You tried with Seaver, no ones is buying it. Admit your damn error like damn grow ups and undo this mess and if you have to, try again.
Or even better, get Paget to stay and AJ to come back and we can all forget this season crazy.
Can we have a kick-ass 7th season, please?
uk viewer, you are right. I did not want Rossi`s role in the team be reduced to support Seaver and I still hope that is not going to happen.
I also was very opposed to Seaver at first and I voiced it several times. I still think that a fresh out of the academy/or still in the academy agent or whatever her status is should not be in the elite unit that the BAU is.
But Seaver is there and I made my peace with it and with her and I started to like her.
If Rossi mentoring Seaver gives him more screen time I`m going to enjoy it. And I am not talking strictly about a father-daughter relationship between Seaver and Rossi. I like Rossi`s and Morgan`s natural, more on feelings based profiling style and I would like to see more of that in the show. I like their "thinking outside the box" approach to cases. I liked when Morgan or Gideon encouraged Reid to think outside the box. Rossi will teach Seaver to not only go by the textbook and with that he will bring out her "emotional thinkig" and encourage her to be an emotional profiler like he and Morgan are.
To stay on the threads topic. I liked "Lauren", but I enjoyed "Valhalla" more.
If I had ever given my boss a line "I haven't read all the textbooks (spreadsheets, drawings, timesheets, etc.) yet"...I would have been out on my you-know-what looking for another job - where I WOULD have read all the textbooks (spreadsheets, drawings, timesheets, etc.)....what a joke!
Does anyone think the cloverleaf that Doyle branded on Emily will be important if/when this storyline ever gets resolved? I wonder if Doyle will somehow use it to track her down...
Along those lines...I wonder what her tattoos are? Any guesses? Or do we already know from a previous ep that I'm blanking on?
OK, enough Seaver talk -
Anon - I would also like to know the significance of the tattoos (sp?) and the cloverleaf.
I think they left so much 'undone' that I'm hoping that it means Emily will return to find Doyle and explain the other questions we have from the episode.
Another note: I've read here that JJ told Hotch, at the hospital, that Emily didn't die - I must have been overwhelmed...LOL! I didn't see that either. I just wondered what she said. Makes sense, tho - cause I really believe it was Emily in Paris with JJ. That, too, makes me hope for Emily's return....PLEASE, PLEASE!
I think the general consensus is that JJ told Hotch something along the lines of: "I could go for a Shamrock Shake." and Hotch said "I know."
I actually thought that last scene in Paris was poorly done. I think the idea was to keep us guessing as to whether or not that was really Prentiss? But it clearly was, so why not just show her face? It came across like OTT melodrama.
Someone earlier mentioned the chat with Paget. Is that something that one of them would like to discuss here? I doubt she said anything about returning as I am sure she is gearing up to shoot the pilot episode to be shopped to NBC. Donald Sutherland was just cast to play her dad I think. They seem to be casting that in a way to heighten the possibility of it getting picked up by the network.
Would also like to know the significance of the 4 leaf clover for Doyle. It obviously has some significance. I think a 4 leaf clover is supposed to symbolize luck, but other than that I don't know.
I'm pretty sure the significance of the tattoos/cloverleaf was explained in Valhalla. Ian Doyle was the leader of a breakawy IRA organization and he all the members of his organization had the tattoo. I can't remember what the meaning of it was, I'd have to go rewatch.
According to those on Twitter who have seen the actual script, there was no scripted dialoge between JJ and Hotch. For all we know AJ could've been asking Thomas for potty training advice. The dialogue wasn't important, it was the intent behind the scene which was to show the audience that Hotch and JJ had schemed to fake Emily's death. I knew immediately she wasn't dead as soon as I saw how Hotch was behaving.
And of couse it was JJ and Prentiss in Paris. That has also been confimred. According to Paget, that final scene was a big hug to the fans.
I was on the chat last night with Paget. I believe I'm allowed to comment about the chat here in the CMF Blog.
She said that the final scene with her and JJ in Paris with her back to us (note: the shot of her thumbnail gnawed off revealing that Prentiss is the mystery person in the shot with JJ) was her and AJ's "hug" to the fans for the outpouring of love and support they've received.
Personally, I can't imagine the roller coaster of emotions Paget (and the entire cast) felt as they filmed this 'final' episode and all season long. They've already had to deal with the loss of AJ and now they lose another family member.
I'm a bit sad that Paget's last episode didn't involve Emily with any of her CM teammates. Aside from Shemar in the next to last scene and MGG directing, she didn't get to 'work' with her friends those last few days on set. I guess that was what Valhalla was for. PB got scenes with all of her castmates (except for TG). I'm still wondering why she didn't get a special scene with Hotch.
PB did an extraordinary job of portraying and conveying all of those emotions into an incredible performance on Lauren.
Kudos to MGG. MGG should helm more episodes. If/when AJ and Emily return (one can always hope), he should be given the reins for the reunion episode. Hopefully, it will be an episode that wraps up the Ian Doyle storyline. Probably a two-parter episode.
Thanks for letting me ramble.
Thanks! Anonymous, was there any sense that she was leaving the door open to come back to CM if the pilot should not be picked up? Although, I really feel that the pilot is going to be picked up.
sf81387: "The dialogue wasn't important, it was the intent behind the scene which was to show the audience that Hotch and JJ had schemed to fake Emily's death. I knew immediately she wasn't dead as soon as I saw how Hotch was behaving."
I was thinking about this and I'm not sure how to interpret the scene. Did Hotch and JJ scheme Emily's fake death and going into hiding together or was it that Hotch just "knew" by looking at JJ. And JJ realized that Hotch had caught onto it and that's why she follows him into the hallway and talks to him?
Will that ever be revealed? I guess not. Not would mean Hotch would actually get something to do this season. I'm still disappointed every team member got a kind of good-bye scene with Prentiss except Hotch. That doesn't feel right, IMO.
Just watched Lauren! Liked it! MGG did a great job as all of the actors/actresses. Glad to see AJ again but will miss Paget :(
It was a good episode but my all time favorite remains the same: 100. That was the most moving episode of TV that I have seen in a long long time!
There was scripted dialogue in that scene with JJ and Hotch:
JJ: We did everything* we could
Hotch: I know.
*JJ either says everything or all. I'm not at home right now so I can confirm but you get the drift.
I believe this was initially supposed to be at the funeral scene. Hotch watching over Emily's headstone (through the miracle of television the headstone was completed in time for the funeral) and they have this coversation alone at the cemetary. I guess they changed it to the hospital during the rewrites.
Just thought you might be interested.
You guys, Donald Sutherland = this pilot is definitely getting picked up.
I guess we'll know for sure around the end of May!
That is what I am thinking Anonymous. I would be shocked if the pilot didin't get picked up.
I was thinking about this and I'm not sure how to interpret the scene. Did Hotch and JJ scheme Emily's fake death and going into hiding together or was it that Hotch just "knew" by looking at JJ. And JJ realized that Hotch had caught onto it and that's why she follows him into the hallway and talks to him?
We'll never know for sure, but based on his conversation with Clyde and his promise to keep her safe I'm going to assume he was in on it all along.
Him keeping that to himself while having to watch people he cares about grieve while still trying to be an effective leader could be interesting to watch, but I'd be surprised if the writers do anything with it.
sf81837 said...
"Him keeping that to himself while having to watch people he cares about grieve while still trying to be an effective leader could be interesting to watch, but I'd be surprised if the writers do anything with it."
I'm curious why you think that. I'm thinking it is because there are things that they have failed to pick up before with Hotch. That is what I think, but not sure if that is what you meant also.
sf81387 and Roshini,
Check out TG's recent interview with EW for hints as to how this might play out in the next episode.
So relieved Prentise didn't die. It makes her going out more bearable, Whilst I'm miffed and unhappy with the changes, I still enjoy CM enough to continue watching. I know it's t.v and not real life etc etc etc, but, other issues aside, fans are going through various stages of grief...sort of...
Anyway, enjoyed this episode, loved the twists, nice directing. Like Joe M find him very warm and engaging and like Rossi but sometimes..and I say sometimes..his acting is a bit twee for me, it occasionally lacks depth but as I said its only sometimes and I like the actor and I like the character. Question...and I have searched the threads to see if this has been asked but could not find it, so apologies if this came up and I missed it..there are a lot of posts..Prentis joined the BAU 6 years ago (Morgan said he'd worked with her for 6 years - I would have but it at 4 or 5). When she joined she said she had nearly ten years experience in the FBI? I assume Interpol was before that - i don't know. The scene with Doyle asking her to not marry him was 8 years ago which means it was 2 to 3 years before joining the FBI. Any views??? If this has been discussed and I didn't look hard enough I apologies, just cut and paste it for me with a note to Wally. Ta
Ok so I have been on this forum and several others and even in the past few weeks, ever since Seaver came on the show as a recurring character, promoted toa regular... well, majority of the fans who post anywhere do NOT like her. And when you have this many fans, true long term fans who understand the dynamic and feel of the show as well as the characters better than many of the new writers, you have a serious problem.
Seaver is a ridiculous character for a show that has been made up of many strong willed, strong persoanlity characters who are more than qualified to be profilers. The show has set a standard for itself and now its faltering. Just get rid of Seaver.
I do beleive that you can get rid of her and redeem her at the same time. I am a big fan of Terminator The Sarah Connor Chronilces, dont know if anyone used to watch it before it got canned but in the second season, Riley, played b Leven Rambin came o the show. RIley was seriously disliked and didnt really fit on the show either. But in her characters death, there was a tragic purpose served and the character was redeemed.
I suggest killing Seaver off and doing it in a way that redeems her and bringing back AJ and paget. Though it seems that Paget may now be a bigger longshot than AJ, since she now has a pilot. I still hold out hope though.
Forever AJ and Paget. I loved AJ as the cool, calm and collected professional she was in Lauren. What a grand entrance too! And I really want to see Emily again. I think she added a really cool, badass flavour to the show. I would like to see more of the espionage style in CM and more of MGG's directing. Maybe he can write an episode too.
I noticed one other poster making a reference toEmily going all Sarah Connor on Ian Doyle's gang, so true! Loved that!
Roshini - I say that because the Criminal Minds creators/writers/producers, etc. are very lazy and sloppy when it comes to character depth and continuity and it would probably bother me if this were a character driven drama. But since it's not I just enjoy CM for the popcorn entertainment that it is.
I've seen the interview anon and since that episode has already been shot what he says might actually happen, but I can't help but recall TG's preseason interviews and how we were going to see how Hotch not taking the time to grieve over the loss of Haley was finally going to take it's toll on him and well, with only six episodes left, I don't really see that happening. Hotch has basically been left unscathed by all the trauma, but I suppose we're supposed to believe that Rossi telling Strauss he's having a hard time with Jack and him disappearing for an entire episode is Hotch being affected by the trauma.
Anyway, that's why I'm not really all that hopeful that we'll see much in the way of the team reacting to the loss of Emily, but that's fine because it's really not that type of show.
I never fell in love with CM because of it's great character depth so while I have fun being sarcastic about it's lack of depth, it doesn't bother me and I still enjoy the characters for what they are. : )
They really should build on character depth though. WRITERS, OKEASE BUILD ON CHARACTER DEPTH!
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