Criminal Minds spoiler thread for "Corazon" written by Katarina Wittich and starring Joe Mantegna, Thomas Gibson, Paget Brewster, Shemar Moore, Matthew Gray Gubler and Kirsten Vangsness.
**Beware! There will be spoilers in the comments :)
Wednesday, January 19, 2011
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471 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 400 of 471 Newer› Newest»I liked the episode, and am interested to find out where Reid goes next for help with his headaches.
I don't get the character "Seaver". I know she was supposed to be a kind of "Clarice Starling" person, but that character was fiesty, intelligent and determined. I can't see the character of Hotch agreeing to someone like that on the BAU. She was timid wooden and really added no insight. The characters and actors on CM are Big and each holds its own from scene to scene. Ms. Nichols acting was timid and she gets swallowed up. It seems like she does not believe her character and her line delivery shows that.
Eiayay
Derailed, Revelations, Memoriam, Elephant's Memory.. these were Reid-centric episodes from before that jump leaps and bounds from what aired last night. Sorry, but this episode was a fail for me and I am beyond tragically upset that I am saying that. Anonymous, I too believe that the writing as of late is worthy of skepticism and a lack of faith that some have expressed her and elsewhere. It is one thing if a season has had 1, 2, maybe 3 bad episodes, but this has been happening in my estimation since midway through season 5! But I blame myself for coming back week after week expecting what Veronica so aptly wrote was the caliber of writing that this show used to pride itself on.
I'm not sure what to think of this episode. I don't how this story will go down for Reid and I'm worried about that.
That being said, Matthew Gray Gubler's acting was really great. He was always good, but this was his best performance ever. I hope they do the actor justice in upcoming episodes.
Amen Sarah!!!
Ha ha, here is part of a review about the episode, not a particularly good review by the way and I have to say that I too didn't care for this episode, that I think says just about it all when it comes to Seaver. and no, I don't have a problem with Nichols, this character is just uber bad and painful to watch:
" I think it's fair to say that the powers that be who control 'Criminal Minds' want to shove Ashley Seaver in our faces as often as possible. They are certainly managing to do that. The trouble is, the character is so completely ridiculous and unbelievable that fans are not going to be able to warm to her, regardless of how often she appears on screen. Having her come up with a large part of the profile was infuriating. Having her participate in the briefing with the Miami police officers was an insult. Has everybody forgotten that this girl is a trainee agent with barely any FBI background, not to mention an almost complete lack of any of the necessary qualifications or experience to join such an elite unit as the BAU. Where is Erin Strauss when you need her to be raising hell?"
Love it.. where is Erin Strauss when you need her :)
I always thought of this board as one of the least critical places of the show. So to see all this negativity definitely says something. Unfortunately, I'm on the negative side of the fence too. This episode was just too far out there. The Reid stuff doesn't interest me. We've seen enough of him in peril over the course of the series. Seaver, well, I don't think I can say anything that hasn't been said already. And no, it's not because of any feelings I have about JJ's departure.
I understand that writing staffs turn over and shows can't always maintain the high quality of earlier seasons (for various reasons). That's just how it goes. It still doesn't make it any less frustrating for dedicated fans though.
I was hoping for a little Prentiss development in this one, but I guess I will have to wait longer.
Yes, Anonymous, I think it says what Sarah wrote. Sarah, when you listed all of those previous episodes, I really just wanted to cry in anger and frustration because I just don't get how CM got to this place.
Before, when we had character-centric episodes, all the others were still treated with respect and written well. Not so last night. I do not begrudge the Reid fans their episode, but I strongly object to Hotch's total lack of role. Thank goodness TG is talented enough to make the most of it. Thank you Thomas! I guess I'd also better say ty for the Hotch/Prentiss pairing at long last. Storyline had potential and was ok, but I'm missing our team interaction.
I can only hope Paget's storyline is handled with respect and that tptb come to their senses and give TG more to do. If both of these actors decide to leave, I'm done. So frustrating!
I was okay with Reid getting attention this episode as he's been totally ignored last season and this season so far. I agree that they can make character driven episodes and still showcase others. They haven't been able to do this so far and I think this is why we have seen so little of Reid. The episodes have always been about others. They need to find a way to balance everyone's presence.
I do think MGG did a good job in this episode. I didn't expect his acting to be so superb. It was as good as Thomas Gibson's acting who I always considered the strongest actor.
Since when is Criminal Minds about one character? Agreed, the show can have character centric episodes, the ones written before were good, but all in all, this is a show about a team and to make it work, we have to see a strong inter-play between all of them.
You know why the Reid-cenrtic episodes that Sarah listed worked so well, because they were infused with elements of all the characters, (and to add, certainly not ridiculous characters like Ashley Seaver), the strongest parts of those characters that not only drew you closer to the Reid character, but to the rest of the team as well.
I love Dr. Spencer Reid, his character is wonderful, but the show has to be more well rounded than that; and it was before. Agreed, the last scene was terrific, but to what someone else said, why did we have to wait until the end for that jem? Plus, I saw only shadows of team interaction, certainly nothing like was written before team interaction wise.
I really don't understand why some people didn't like this episode. I thought the writing was good but the direction was a bit wierd at times. The was too much flashing of the same scenes over and over. Other than that, I loved it.
Sarah, I miss the quality of the writing of the episodes you listed. Alejandra, think I will cry along with you.
I am sticking around to see Paget's exit, then I am out. I hope to God that Paget's exit is written with some integrity and respect.
Well, not as amazing as I wanted the epi to be, but at least it was not terrible. Kinda average overall.
Things I liked:
1. More Reid
2. Reid and Morgan together
3. A little of everyone else - no one was left out.
4. That Reid's medical situ was not resolved which means it should be dealt with more in future epis -I would hope!
5. Weird but interesting subject matter
6. Reid conducting the interrogation: he held his own quite well, even during all the chanting and craziness.
7. Weird and scary visuals - wow!
What I didn't like:
1. OK for Seaver asking ?'s but then she looks and sounds SO out of place at the profiling. Not right that they act as if she has been doing it all along. Inconsistent & too soon for that and not credible. Also, insulting to the rest of the team.
2. Reid rubbing his eyes out! Too much of this, IMHO. Severe headaches may cause abit of that but there is usually more head lowering and holding, and even the other senses can be affected if it's vascular or migraine in nature (i.e. sound is just as disturbing as light; may feel sick at your stomach, etc.) Wonder about all these visual symptoms, but I do not believe the voodoo was any part of it, think that was just for effect and to tie into the subject matter. Were they really hallucinations? Interesting.
3. Wish that Reid had confided to one of the others, to play up the family element that we all so miss with our favorite people. Seems like that would have been an easy thing to do. Writers?
4. Reid being alone during his testing: he is so afraid of learning he has schizophrenia (which could be why he is not confiding in his co-workers), he is beside himself and is making him more stressed and sicker than ever with the stress hormones kicking in. Did anyone even notice if he even took so much as an Exedrin? Since he was working, you would think he would be trying something to feel better.
Wonder what will help him to realize that he is not becoming schizoid but maybe needs to treat migraines, food allergy, enzyme problem or whatever. It will be interesting to watch it get diagnosed and play out. Hope in the meanwhile, he chooses to trust his team members and let them provide the support he needs right now because the poor kid feels so alone!
Glad I did not get on in time to see derogatory statements about Reid. Agree that they get removed. But I have also had a post deleted earlier that I did not think was out of line: I commented how I would I console poor Reid after seeing the pic of him alone on the bench. Did not say anything offensive. I think the blog administrator must use discretion if she thinks a post could cause the topic to digress from the discussion about the epi itself. And that is her right.
Hey, at least we're not all going on and on about Reid's hair anymore, have any of you noticed? And, NO, this is not an invitation to start that up again! We have much more important things to discuss, like whether our favorite show is going to make it, right?!
No time to read all the comments now but have to comment. WOW!!! I thought last night was awesome. I found it extremely captiviting. Loved the opening scene and closing scenes. Will rewatch tonight with hubby.
I wish there were a way to go back or to side split the screen so that I could see all of the names of the people I want to credit, so sorry if I forget anyone. Well, starting on this page, Sarah, wow, I had flashbacks to the episodes you listed and started to get very sad. For anyone who hasn't seen the episodes that Sarah mentioned, please do yourself a favor and see them, they are truly great!!! Deborah, couldn't agree more with everything you said and this is coming from a hardcore Reid fan. A comment from the other page that has been touched on here, Veronica, Veronica what can I say other than I also sadly agree with what you wrote and like Sarah, blame myself for coming back week after week expecting that which Criminal Minds so consistently gave us in the past. Now, this is where I am going to forget who wrote this and replied, anyway, the fact of not having faith in the writers. It is like the Einstein quote (it is not known for sure if he said it, but it is most attributed to him), "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." This is what is happening on a weekly basis at CM, I agree with Sarah since midseason 5, the same lack of writing prowess expecting the same results storyline and character and team development wise. But then, as Veronica said, this show is no longer being written in that vein.
Where I wrote, "the same lack of writing prowess expecting the same results storyline and character and team development wise," I meant to add that which had been delivered in the past. Sorry, forgot to add that to my comment.
I rather enjoyed the episode, the storyline was alright, but I was hoping for a purely physical explanation for Reid's headaches.
I wanted it to go along the lines of a brain tumor.
Now, I think they'll be a follow up for this storyline. Julio gave Reid his bracelet ("Orula's ide")to protect him and told Reid "I don't need it anymore, but you do". So I guess we'll hear about it again.
Am I stupid if I hope that the the brain scans from the MRI weren't done correctly or weren't read correctly by the doctor (it can happen) ?
It could be a nice follow up if we learned Reid was misdiagnosed for a reason or another.
If in the end Reid is physically sick (and if it's a serious sickness like a tumor), it could be an interesting cliffhanger.
Julio's "spirit" told Reid he had 'bad eggun' spoiling his head and that he needed to do a 'cleaning' quickly.
So he was trying to warn Reid against something he can fight against.
Badd egguns represents the spirit of the dead and ancestors. That reminds me that we don't know what Reid's uncle (Daniel) died from.
I'm still hoping for a medical cause to Reid's symptoms and that surgery (who could be part of the 'cleaning') might help him.
Sorry for the typos, I should have reread before posting. My bad.
I am not a Reid fan, but I don't care if he has a centric episode, as long as everyone is there. There... as in, supporting Reid, encouraging him, worrying about him. In this episode the team was so lackadaisical about the severe headaches, the out of character silence re: odd facts and trivia. I guess it has been so long since Reid was in an episode the other characters really could have forgotten about him
This episode was so bad it made me angry. Sad. It was just bad, and a disservice to the cast and crew and their efforts from the past.
I was dodging in and out of last night's episode out of a sheer lack of interest. However, after reading some of the comments here about the last scene with Reid at the doctor's office, I fast forwarded to that scene again. I liked that scene; the opening scene was good too. Everything between the opening scene and the last scene was cagey and contrived.
Has been said before, but once Paget leaves, I am gone too and this is from a Hotch/Reid fan. Although, I must admit, I am very scared of what is going to be written for Prentiss based on what has been airing so far on Criminal Minds.
So I just watched the episode again and found it more interesting the second time around. I have a theory of what I think is going on with Reid. Before I start that, I have to say that I thought it was going to be a tumor as well so I am glad they took the unpredictable path.
I think that he has been to this area before as a child. What he is seeing is memories and not hallucinations. Perhaps he had headaches as a child and his parents or father feared for his mental health and looked at alternative ways to cure him. A lot of people who are not even spiritual look for alternative cures in desperate times. Maybe at this time his headaches went away (for whatever reason). Now that his headaches are back, the memories have returned as well. It would explain the visions as well as how he was staring at the family photo for so long. Maybe the father in the picture was someone he had seen before. It still doesn't explain what is causing the headaches but certainly explains the visions. Just a theory. What do you guys think?
Preach it Sarah!! I feel your pain. From start to finish, this episode was just painful to watch. There were glimmers of nice MGG/Reid moments (love the Reid character), most notably, the last scene with the doctor. But the rest... Don't even get me started on Seaver, I think enough has been said about this dreadful character, except I like the "Where is Erin Strauss when you need her to be raising hell" quote from the review that Emily cut and paste here (Emily, thanks for that little bit of comic relief!).
I want to say that I will hold out to see Paget's exit, but I don't think that I can sit threw another Criminal Minds episode. I will try next week, but if that ends up being bad, I don't think I can return. Trust me, for anyone who knows me, this is a shocking statement for me to make. I never, ever miss the nightly episodes of Criminal Minds on ion, no matter how late they run, and the CM marathons, I am always front and center when they run them on ion and A&E. I'm thinking that I will primarily stick to those venues for watching Criminal Minds.
I just checked the ratings for this episode--12.13 million. Wow, what a drop. That's over 1.5 million less than 25 to life and it is the lowest rating so far since "Reflection of Desire"--and that was a good episode (in my opinion, plus I'm a film major). Is this the start of Criminal Minds's slippage in the ratings. I was looking at the ratings of previous seasons, and this is among the lowest-rated episodes. Criminal Minds used to get like an average of 13-17 episodes an episode (with a 26 million peak for "The Big Game) and it has already descended into 13-14. Now, depending on how the rest of the season would go, it could fall even further, below 10 million, the cut-off for success (I think, I don't know much about television ratings system). I'm gonna keep watching and keep a close eye on the ratings. Is it over?
I think that American Idol was on as well so that may be why. It's still a pretty good rating.
I didn't want to write anything because I am just so upset at the path that CM has gone down. Sarah, bet you didn't think you would be quoted this often, but like the others that quoted you said, my heart sank when you rattled off that list of CM episodes (may I also add LDSK to your list). Those episodes were a pure delight to watch and I miss seeing those types of wonderfully written episodes. I am afraid that the days of me expecting those types of episodes from CM are over and as such I feel like I need to stop watching the newer episodes because when I do it makes it that much harder to watch the older episodes on TV. For it makes me sad to see what was then versus what is now.
Anonymous 1, where did you get the ratings from? Yes, they are still good ratiings, but a dip like that is something that should be monitored. It is by no means off the rails, but it should be checked. We'll see how the rest of the episodes fare in the ratings.
Wikipedia, but I followed the link to site that had the information and it had this:
Criminal Minds hadn’t had a new episode since December, and its 2.8 rating was a series low and was down 15% vs. its last original.
15%. How much of a decline is that?
You know what sucks, American Idol is going to be on at the same time as Criminal Minds until early March. That show gets crazy ratings and may take away the younger audience. The spin-off will be on after American Idol ends, so I'm thinking that their ratings will be higher. I hope not. Considering Criminal Minds was on at the same time as the American Idol premiere, I think it did pretty good. SVU's ratings were much lower and it wasn't even on at the same time as American Idol. I think that a shows ratings do decline a bit over time but I think as long as it doesn't dip too much more, it will be okay.
CBS also wants to promote the spin-off. It would help them if the original was doing well so I don't think they would just cancel it. I don't even know why I'm saying that as it is nowhere near being canceled. The ratings are not low at all.
Thanks for your source Anonymous. I can't say with certainity, but a 15% ratings drop does not seem like a good thing, especially, of course if it is a trend that continues building on itself from episode to episode. Hopefully, someone here is TV savvy and can break that numerical ratings dip down to us.
I would just say that it is something that should be looked at, not that it is horrific, but I wouldn't think that the network wants this to keep building on itself. One a many show start with this type of dip, then if left unchecked, sometimes spirals out of control.
cont.......
But to that I have to add that if the writing keeps up this way, and they continue to tinker with the cast, well, then I don't know. They should just keep an eye on things.
This episode didn't explain a lot so I will have to wait for future episodes to see how I feel about the Reid storyline. I liked the case and loved how they used profiling to figure out who the unsub was.
Matthew Gray Gubler's acting was amazing. He truly deserves an emmy nomination. I loved the crazy laugh he did at the end before he hit the unsub over the head. I also thought his performance in the scene with the doctor at the end was fabulous. To be honest I didn't think that he was capable of acting this amazing. He was always good but this was just was just so superb. I think I may be overlooking other aspects of the episode because I was completely blown away by his acting.
Anonymous @(2) Yeah, I think the fact that American Idol is running at the same time as CM is not a good thing. But, then again, I think that the ability of American Idol to sustain its ratings will depend on the strength of the new judges and contestants moving forward.
One thing is for sure, CBS and Tassler need to stop tinkering with CM (although I personally wouldn't mind if they tinkered with it by bringing back some of the old writers and eliminating the Seaver character). I don't think this show will be able to sustain any additional major hits.
Oh heavens above, now we are Seaver haters. Again, please look at the criticism's of Seaver and analyze them critcally. While you may not agree with every point, there are some that I believe should be addressed and brought out to the open. Her character has a lot of potholes and it has nothing to do, at least for me and I suspect many others, with her being new. It is the strength, or lack thereof, of the Seaver character itself.
"One thing is for sure, CBS and Tassler need to stop tinkering with CM (although I personally wouldn't mind if they tinkered with it by bringing back some of the old writers and eliminating the Seaver character). I don't think this show will be able to sustain any additional major hits."
Agreed! Give TG more money, TG & MGG more screen-time and hope to god it isn't too late to convince PG to stay.
Sorry for the typos.. I am a bad typist.
Anonymous, I don't think people dislike Seaver because she's new. Hate is too strong a word. I think we're dissatisfied with her character because her inclusion in the BAU defies logic. One moment she is over emotional, ready to cry at the drop at a hat. The next week it's as if the previous week didn't exist, she is totally disconnected from the team. Then this week they have her asking rookie questions and she's suddenly out there with the team presenting a profile, which to me is laughable, it's like she's a different person every week. Not to mention that the one or two lines she gets here and there break the flow of the show and ruin the team dynamics. Perhaps if they'd brought in a new character who had a bit of experience and merited a place in the BAU people wouldn't have been so averse. It's not the actress' fault but I think the writers are doing a great injustice to her character. Just my opinion though :)It's like they just put together a new character hastily and have no idea how to develop her.
I thought Matthew's acting was superb. as always. I liked seeing Reid & Morgan together again. I like that Morgan & Hotch were concerned for Reid. Not a whole lot of interaction, but compared to zilch which we've been getting I'll take it.
I wonder if Reid is psychic too since it looked like he was getting visions of the fence and things he hadn't actually seen, but the too many flashes of ick, were kind of confusing.
I'm not sure where the headaches & hallucinations storyline is going but I don't want Reid to miss any episodes because of it.....or go down the schizophrenic path. That would not be entertaining to me at all.
As far as the useless, JJ look alike, she can leave immediately. She adds nothing. She only takes lines away from the rest of the cast. She can't replace JJ. The only person who can replace JJ is JJ.
Make Seaver go away. Please?
I am going to throw my oar in the Carlos, Tammy, Veronica, Sarah and Deborah buckets (there are others, but those are the ones that stood out for me). I think these individuals encapsulated everything I would say, and perhaps even more.
I don't mind at all that there are character centric episodes, they certainly have been done in prior seasons and quite superbly. This one fell short for me because of many aspects but the one that stands out the most is the lack of team interaction, or even team concern. Comparing the concern from earlier episodes on the part of the team to now, well, there is no comparison. Prentiss saying "Hey, what's wrong with you, you are never late" to Reid, Hotch and Morgan throwing a couple of concerned looks and saying "Are you alright Reid," Rossi giving longing lokks of concern to reid at the end, and maybe I missed it, but I didn't see any concern on the part of Garcia (if I missed that, I apologize). In my opinion, these "interactions" do not add up to the level of concern you saw in this team in seasons prior, which not only was great, but definitely added to the sense that this group not only functioned well as coworkers, but also as a "family unit." Now, everyone seems to be disconnected from each other, something that has been happening on the show for quite some time now.
Don't know if this dynamic, or loss of dynamic, can be repaired because there is no sense that the writers are keyed into this gaping hole. I say this because week after week we get practically the same type of "interaction" between team mates.
Well, that was the most obvious flaw in the episode for me, there were others, but I thought I would just share the one that was glaring for me throughout the run of this episode.
I was totally absorbed with Corazon episode! I liked the storyline and the acting was brilliant - MGG was simply awesome, just like the guy from the interrogation room. Don't know where did all these negative comments came from, for me it was probably the best episode of this season and because of the voodoo aspect - the most memorable. Nice work guys, keep it going! ;)
Somehow this conversation is revolving around the new character of Ashley Seaver over and over again. People will have their opinions for or against. I happen to dislike the character (again, nothing against the actress). I believe the people here have explained over and over again why exactly they dislike the character and I happen to agree it wasn't the most fortunate idea to have her introduced as a picture perfect all capable cadet who does obstacle courses on her lunch break. If the responsible people refuse to understand the points that have been brought up over and over again and continue to ignore it brushing it off as something transitory due to JJ's departure, it shall be their mistake and ultimately it'll be their downfall.
People are not haters just because they happen to dislike a character. They have the right to their opinion, just like the ones who like Seaver have the right to theirs. And you know what? It's not just the JJ fans who dislike the character. It's EVERYBODY. This fandom seldomly agrees on something, but now about 80% of people dislike the character and the way it's been written.
That being said, I didn't mind the character that much last night for the simple fact that I didn't see her that much and could block her out very easily.
The issue this season is that the writers are continuously dropping the ball. Last night's episode wasn't terrible, but it wasn't the CM I came to expect. And the worst thing is that they seem to be looking away on purpose. They seem to think they know exactly why we dislike some things and why we are being negative about them. I would have subscribed to that opinion had I noticed that only a part of the fandom was unhappy about it. We all like or dislike an episode/season more or less depending on who our favourite character is. But the thing is that in this instance almost EVERYONE is saying the same thing. Don't brush it off. For the sake of CM, don't just brush it off.
And after all that rant, let's get to last night's episode finally.
I think it was high time Reid got an episode of his own. This season has been centered too much around Morgan. I would have hoped that Prentiss in her last season would have had a chance, but I guess I was expecting too much. Hotch is too much in the background, Rossi is absent for much of the episode and then has silly lines when he does make an appearance(like the one he had when they discovered Reid's kevlar in the room..."this is not good"...you think? brilliant deduction Sherlock!- that's not the level of writing I expect from CM writers, but then again I might be expecting too much)
It did feel weird that with all the profilers around no one noticed Reid's struggling. He was a good actor faking the headaches but he wasn't very good at covering the fact that something was wrong. Reid going after the unsub alone was OOC. That's something Seaver would do not Reid. I think Reid had his scare enough with Tobias Hankel to know not to go in without back-up and without letting the others know what he was doing.
I just wish we had more stability on the writing team, I wish that the new writers would put more effort in getting to know the characters (although this one did pretty good for a first try bare a few OOC moments). And I wish I didn't expect so much of CM. I guess I wish I was back in Season 4 when I truly loved every episode. It's just been downhill since the 100th episode.
Anyway, here's hoping for the best but fearing the worst for the future.
Honestly, cancel the show and put everyone out of their misery. This season has just been a massive downward spiral. Absolute garbage.
Clara,
"It did feel weird that with all the profilers around no one noticed Reid's struggling. He was a good actor faking the headaches but he wasn't very good at covering the fact that something was wrong. Reid going after the unsub alone was OOC. That's something Seaver would do not Reid. I think Reid had his scare enough with Tobias Hankel to know not to go in without back-up and without letting the others know what he was doing."
EXACTLY- the whole Reid/Tobias story, besides being beautifully written, impressed for Reid the dangers of going off alone without telling anyone- he almost died in that episode!! I remember in an episode shortly after that one, even JJ said to Reid, no matter what, we don't split up, reid said something like, oh yeah, don't worry, I know that. So what is the deal now. I think the deal is what you pointed out, no stability in the writing and an expectation, at least for me that somehow, someway, CM can get back to the writing of season 4 which in my opinion was CM's best season!
I think your other point in your comment goes to what Amanda just wrote about the lack of team interaction. I think that is why no one seemingly picks up on Reid's angst (or they do in a very surface level). It as if strangers are working with each other instead of people that have been through hell and back with one another.
I'm sure CM's ratings are probably the lowest they gotten in the demos (2.8) against American Idol. It previously held up much better as an alternative to the AI juggernaut. As a matter fact, Simon Mirren said he thought CM could take a few ratings points from AI this season, since Simon Cowell left.
What Simon Mirren didn't say was that the producers and CBS would screw with the cast, the writing and the legacy of a series that worked well as it was, and could only get better with better writing and emphasis on the characters.
Even though AI's ratings are down, CM fared much worse because of all the unnecessary tinkering and screwing with our cast.
CBS and the producers are determined to prove that CM is not a character-driven series, but one that is driven by formula. They're wrong. While the network coddles the stars of the other dramas and comedies, TPTB and producers are determined to prove that the stars of CM are interchangeable and replaceable. They're not.
And the attempt to throw erratic, illogical, and unrealistic writing into the mix has made CM a sub-par viewing experience, which is causing the audience to look elsewhere for quality.
Erica Messer, Shemar Moore is not the answer. He's good, but the Morgan character is not and should not be the lead. There has been way too much of Morgan and Garcia this season.
We keep pointing to the quality of 100, there have been no episodes close this season or last. But Andrew Wilder alone created the character of the Reaper; and his Omnivore has also not been equaled. It took at least 5 writers to craft 100, while Wilder alone gave us many memorable episodes. CM desperately needs Wilder back, or someone of his caliber.
CM needs to put scripts in Thomas Gibson's hands that are worthy of his talent; and stop giving him the nonsense that he's been getting this season,or not getting at all. Treat him the way you treat Forest Whitaker, Mark Harmon, David Caruso, and Simon Baker. Stop making the cast of CM feel as if they are expendable, replaceable, and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. They are the most important asset you have.
Finally, Ed Bernero, you need to get on your hands and knees and beg Paget to reconsider not staying for the rest of this season. The way things are going; CM may not survive once she's gone.
Paget's presence is more needed now than ever. If CM thinks it can compete with AI, it needs to give the viewers and the fans some stability and quality we can hold on to. Right now all you've done is take things away. It doesn't make any sense.
Ashley Seavers was ill-conceived. If you're replacing a character with a similar character, the new character needs to have super human powers and walk on water. Seavers is timid, inexperienced and her presence on screen is off-putting. You needed to have gotten someone with a completely different look instead of JJ-light. It's insulting to the audience to trade in the old model for a newer model of the same make. These are women, not cars.
Ed, they sent you to the spinoff to right that ship before it sank; in the meantime, Messer, Mirren and CBS are sinking the mother ship.
I hope with your new deal for your new series, and your position as showrunner on the spinoff, you have not entered into some pact to allow the mother ship to falter. Retake the reins at CM, re-up Thomas Gibson with the kind of contract and leadership that is worthy of his talents; convince Paget to renegotiate her contract for Season 6,because you and we need her to now; and rethink the Ashley Seaver casting. If you can't eat crow and bring AJ back, bring in someone more in line with a Ziva Davide, rather than JJ-light.
sdwally, by far, your comment is one of the best I have ever seen posted on this blog. A million thank you's for these words.
I pray that your words are taken into consideration before it is too late.
Wow, strong opinions, I see. I actually really liked this episode as a whole. And I totally get Reid confiding in no one...it's consistent with the way he's always been (even since season one with "The Popular Kids" - when he was having nightmares). Reid has always been terrified of the idea that something is wrong with him, and reluctant to let anyone know about it or even face his issues himself. I doubt he's developing schizophrenia at his age, unless it's something he's had all along that's now getting worse - or unless it was triggered/brought on by his drug use. The headaches/hallucinations were interesting though and I thought it brought more compelling elements to the episode (and totally justified Reid's wandering off without his vest, IMO...I've had crushing migraines before and they can make you do strange things, especially combined with all of his other stress).
If I have to offer a critique (and this is understanding that I'm not exactly qualified to do so), it would be that the writing is feeling a little...how do I put this...incomplete. We're getting a lot of cool elements, but they're not being applied nearly as well as they could be.
Like, for example, imagine that you have a competent, experienced, driven new team member whose father was a prolific serial killer. That's potentially very interesting. But she has to be more than "that one killer's daughter." Seaver so far is just a bland, kindly young lady who's completely defined by something that happened 10 years ago. She's stuck. If she were a fully-formed, well-rounded, and professional profiler like the woman from "P911," for instance, but she also had this crazy thing in her past, then she would be extremely interesting and might actually add a lot to the show. It could even inform her character. Maybe she's more aggressive because of it. Maybe she's less aggressive because of it. Does it freak her out to get inside the heads of killers? Is she afraid she might have
As it is, she's a classic "new kid on the block" character, the kind of character you usually introduce so you have a reasonable excuse to give lots of exposition (ie, explaining what profiling is and how it works - things experienced agents wouldn't have to tell each other, but that the audience might need to know). The problem with this is that it's season 6, so the audience pretty much knows what's going on at this point. So her questions and the agents' explanations become unnecessary and redundant. Since her character literally doesn't do anything else, she becomes this weight sitting on the plot, slowing everything down. She was kind of interesting when they introduced her, but now we have nothing else to go on.
To a lesser extent, they missed some potential with the ritual stuff in this episode, as well - there was a big missed opportunity with the 'priest' speaking while believing himself possessed. He could've actually (inadvertently) revealed some kind of interesting, plot-furthering information, like something about the location of the younger man they were searching for, or something about the crime. Instead it was some awesomely mystic stuff that freaked Reid out, which is cool, but they could've done both (as they've ably done before). You'd just need the priest to say something that Reid feels applies to him, but that Rossi or someone listening recognizes as applying to their suspected unsub.
But overall I really, really liked this episode. One of the better ones this season IMO.
sdwally.. 3 Cheers!!! Hope to God someone out in CBS and CM land get to read what you wrote. More important, that they do something about you wrote.
I also LOVED all our guest stars this episode.
Also, dare I hope that Jane Lynch will ever come back to reprise her role as Reid's mother? I know she's all tied up in Glee now and probably about 30x as expensive a guest star as she was back in season 2, but still.
sdwally, what you wrote was simply wonderful! Let's see if CBS and CM will develop the presence of mind to fully process what you, and no doubt many others, are saying, and have said, to them. May be a long shot, but I really hope that they do.
I'm not going to comment the epi, as English is not my first language and usually I lost part of the plot while watching for the first time.
About the ratings, several things happened last night:
- American Idol premiered; always a ratings monster, the first day of the season more so.
- Live to Dance, the CBS show at 8:00ET, got soooooo bad ratings that surely damaged those of CM.
- I've been told that there was very little promotion of the new epi of CM; that after not airing the JJ rerun last week due to the Tucson disaster maybe helped for people to miss this one.
- For reasons unknown to me, last night CBS coverage was down from its normal numbers, so adding insult to injury...
So, so far the time to get scared has not yet come (and I'm talking about the whole season, as the average is more than good) ;D
There's a lot more of Reid in this one episode than we have seen in the last two seasons put together. Great acting on his part. Seaver remains useless, basically.
Then the plotline was a lot of mumble-jumble, voodoo, weird mo-jo going ons. The first two suspects had so much red herrings thrown at them. It got obvious they were set up. Messy crime scenes, evidence turning up at the suspects' home.
Yep, got a rap for that! Then, Reid so quickly figuring out that the professor did it was too fast of a wrap-up.
The weirdest thing was why did Reid go into the house all by himself????? Why didn't he call down to the rest of the team to go with him?? You can argue that the leader's spirit was calling only to him but geez, couldn't the spirits do him a favor by saying, pssssssst, bring your buddies with you! The professor is the worst serial killer in town when he kept turning his back on Reid and couldn't defend himself against an agent who had his eyes closed through most of the confrontation.
As for the ending, ARGHHHHHHH!!!!! We're left hanging with the secret still!!!!
Well, organic reasons are now ruled out with the clear MRI so it's not a brain tumor. They're hinting at psych problems or even the thing is still hanging in there since he is wearing the bracelet given to him.
Sooooo, how many more episodes are we going to be left hanging before it is resolved??????? The next episode looks unsubs-focused so will Reid continue to look downcast and squinty-eyed or will the subject be dropped for awhile?????
Enquiring minds are wondering how the rest of this season will pan out!
Hi Maria, you did pretty well for English not being your first language :)
I don't think people are necessarily running scared because of the ratings dip, they are just pointing out that CM can't afford to keep on doing what they have done thus far with show in terms of writing, cast shake-up's. Sdwally said it best, i would love to quote everything in sdwally's post, but the one I think that is related most to possible future ratings is this part:
"Finally, Ed Bernero, you need to get on your hands and knees and beg Paget to reconsider not staying for the rest of this season. The way things are going; CM may not survive once she's gone.
Paget's presence is more needed now than ever. If CM thinks it can compete with AI, it needs to give the viewers and the fans some stability and quality we can hold on to. Right now all you've done is take things away. It doesn't make any sense."
Also, this one
"I hope with your new deal for your new series, and your position as showrunner on the spinoff, you have not entered into some pact to allow the mother ship to falter. Retake the reins at CM, re-up Thomas Gibson with the kind of contract and leadership that is worthy of his talents; convince Paget to renegotiate her contract for Season 6,because you and we need her to now; and rethink the Ashley Seaver casting. If you can't eat crow and bring AJ back, bring in someone more in line with a Ziva Davide, rather than JJ-light."
Would love to quote the whole comment, but I think those go directly towards future ratings.
To Anonymous:
Thanks! Writing, reading and, if I don't rush it, talking, are not a problem at all. Listening is a very different thing: my problems pile up as I cannot practice as much as I should.
To Sdwally:
Wonderful recapitulation, and even better how you have said it all. Now, to cross our collective fingers and hope it's read, understood and taken very seriously by TPTB.
This episode is by far the worst episode yet. I really really tried to like this episode but it was just so boring. I lost interest five minutes in. It was confusing, the thing with Spencer was weird and as for Seaver... what a joke. She's not a profiler so why was she giving the profile? Hope next week is better
Didn't finish my sentence there, somehow. Should say, "Is she afraid she might have sociopathic tendencies herself?" Anyway.
I think everyone's making really good points here, by the way...does anyone from the show still read these comment threads?
I really think people here are being too critical of the episode. I think everyone is till upset at JJ leaving, and are misdirecting their anger at that towards the new episodes. I really liked the episode last night, and while I'm also sad that JJ left, feel that Seaver deserves a chance too.
It was definitely nice to have some Reid screen time, and I look forward to seeing how this story-line develops.
sdwally, your point about Andrew Wilder, completely on target!! I maintain that this was the single most dumbest move on the part of CBS and certainly the biggest hit for Criminal Minds.
Criminal Minds is the #8 rated show and the #4 scripted show behind only NCIS, NCIS Los Angelas and the Mentalist. The premier of American Idol was bound to have an effect and since CM is also one of the highest DVR'd shows out there the numbers will change. I think it haa to be admitted the show still does extremely well and the decision to watch or not will be a personal one on everyone's part. I really enjoyed last night's episode and I will continue to watch CM.
The one word I have about Ashley Seaver is...WHY? Why was her character allowed to continue past her first episode? Why was she written in the first place? And most importantly, why will she be joining the BAU right out of the Academy? This has been brought up over and over again, but I feel the point needs to be hammered home for the writers and producers of Criminal Minds. Over and over again the elite nature of this team was emphasized. Both Elle and Emily had been in the FBI about 10 years before they were able to join the FBI. Emily had a wide variety of postings, and Elle was a sex crimes expert who had the highest solve rate in the Seattle field office three years running. And both of them STILL had to earn their spot on the team and work hard for acceptance. So again, WHY is Ashley able to join the team now? She has no special skills ala Reid that would justify such a posting. She doesn't have the necessary background to be a profiler. I would imagine if she did have something like that, it would already have been mentioned. She's been pretty useless up to this point. The only good thing is that because she is such a bland, pointless character (at least at this point) that I can just easily ignore her and hope she goes away.
sdwally, I am going to repost some of your epic because it is very well thought out and written.I totally agree and lend my support to your points. CBS/Ed, I hope you are reading!
"Shemar Moore is not the answer. He's good, but the Morgan character is not and should not be the lead. There has been way too much of Morgan and Garcia this season.
CM needs to put scripts in Thomas Gibson's hands that are worthy of his talent; and stop giving him the nonsense that he's been getting this season,or not getting at all. Treat him the way you treat Forest Whitaker, Mark Harmon, David Caruso, and Simon Baker. Stop making the cast of CM feel as if they are expendable, replaceable, and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. They are the most important asset you have.
re-up Thomas Gibson with the kind of contract and leadership that is worthy of his talents; convince Paget to renegotiate her contract for Season 6,because you and we need her to now; and rethink the Ashley Seaver casting. If you can't eat crow and bring AJ back, bring in someone more in line with a Ziva Davide, rather than JJ-light."
I truly hope tptb are listening, or made to listen. I hate that this is happening to what used to be the best show on television.
@sdwally I couldn't have said it better myself! You are SO RIGHT!!
This was especially eye-catching:
"CM needs to put scripts in Thomas Gibson's hands that are worthy of his talent; and stop giving him the nonsense that he's been getting this season,or not getting at all. Treat him the way you treat Forest Whitaker, Mark Harmon, David Caruso, and Simon Baker. Stop making the cast of CM feel as if they are expendable, replaceable, and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. They are the most important asset you have."
I whole-heartedly agree, and might I add that, if anything, CBS is treating CM like a two-bit show; they don't seem to realize that there are fans out there who tune in and take this show seriously, and seeing some of the stuff that has been brought out this season, like the plot holes, the less-than-believable UnSubs (With the exception of this recent episode, as well as a few others this season)and such. Let me name a few memorable UnSubs: Frank, Tobias Hankel, George Foyet, Mason Turner, Billy Flynn, Ted Bryar, Randal Garner, Roger and Anita Roycewood... What happened to UnSubs like that?
TG, and even JM, SM, MGG, KV, PG... They ALL deserve the same treatment of Harmon, Baker and some of the other actors on other shows; CM is just as good as NCIS, with characters that are just as believable (Except maybe Seaver). The Mentalist is half the age of CM, and how many times has Jane been kidnapped or put in danger? And who really watches the CSI's; they were fine until Grissom left, Warrick was shot and two unrelated spinoffs were created; at least CSI: NY is believiable, but CSI: Miami just isn't cutting it for me.
And don't get me started on other actors, who should be tarred and feathered for what they're doing with the fame they've gotten (*cough* Charlie Sheen *cough*).
They have all given performances of 110 percent and MORE, which means that they deserve something worthy of those performances; look at last night, MGG totally shined as an actor; that man deserves an Emmy, or an Oscar for the performance he gave last night, it was so good! And his directing skills are out of this world; I've watched Mosley Lane so many times that I've memorized it, and I love every second of it! I thought it was one of the best ever!
...And finally, I have an idea for CBS: Why not have us, the fans, write some episodes? I'm sure there are a few people out there who would love to write their own episode, so why not give it a shot?
Seaver bears a strong resemblance to the character in one of Bernero's proposed shows... where a lady is on the fugitive task force because of her unique insight since she was on the lam with her mom the fugitive.
pathetic episode. pathetic character. Seaver is cutting the legs out from under the team, the cast and Ms. Nichols, who could have been welcomed a little easier if she was given something written by an actual CM writer and not Joe Public off the street.
I don't know why nobody liked this episode? I liked this episode. The only part was...everyone guessed it Seaver! Why is she giving police a profile? What does she know about profiling? Rossi, Prentiss, and Seaver all go check out that guys living arrangements, Seaver asks, is that blood? No it's ketchup...what do you think it is? I literally started shaking my head than. And when Reid asked her what the weather was like in Miami, she said 75..I guess, I actually murmured to myself of course you don't you don't know anything it seems like. Other than her, it was a good episode
Breen, please please please be the one to write Hotch's secret revelation episode!
I have to say I really enjoyed that episode:
1. Finally a good Reid one ( now we need a good Hotch one!)
2. Seaver learnt to shut up.
Compared to the last to disastrous (for lack of a better word) episodes this was definetly good, if it keeps going this direction then we maay be back on track soon. SO WELL DONE!.
I still have to say though, sorry I know we have been through this before... we need JJ back, I will never understand why they cut the one role we absolutley needed because as the laison she could be more emotional and subjective than a profiler which added balance and heart to the team and the show. I think this is why it seems to have lost its way, so come on CBS u screwed the pooch, now bring her back!!!
Will be interesting to see how the Reid story develops after this one as it is extremly unlikley to be schizophrenia since if he had inherited the genetic predisposition he would be very likley to have the physical manifestions like enlarged Ventricles that would have shown on the scan, so can't wait to c what is actually going on !
Please keep going like this, get rid of Seaver and give us some Hotch backstory ) still waiting for something about his childhood as hinted to in "Natural Born Killer" or what we did not see in the flashbacks in "Faceless Nameless"
Thank you again CM team for a good episode !!!!!
To the Anonymous who can't even put a name to the hating posts. There is a difference between hate and dislike. I would recommend the Webster Online Dictionary to look it up. As I said earlier, I believe that most of the opinions in this thread have been supported by valid points and arguments. And people are entitled to their opinions. The opinions won't change no matter how many times you re-post your "throw yourself off the cliff" posts. Please respect other people's right to express an opinion, even if you don't like it, and stop calling people names.
I think the low ratings were because it was the first night of American Idol with 2 new judges. People are curious. I was but I turned it off after the first hour to watch CM. It will be interesting to see DVR results. American Idol is cutting back to one hour episodes for 3 weeks starting next week so that should help. In past seasons, American Idol has cut into the same time slot as CM at the end of the season for finals not the beginning first night.
The ratings for CM used to be in the 16 and occasionally 17 mil viewers and they haven't hit 15 mil since the first episode of Season 5.
Adding to the brilliant episodes that someone mentioned earlier....Fisher King had to be one of the smartest episodes ever, Angel Maker was another on at the top of my list. And I also agree that just because the episode is centered mainly on one character, in the past, the entire cast was still very much involved.
I never watched CM until last season after I started to watch the reruns on ION & A&E. I found myself glued to some of the episodes. I feel like the writers of most of the episodes of the last two seasons forgot what made the earlier episodes so special.
Wow, skimming through the comments one would think this was a Seaver centric episode. I work retail and have absolutely no police or FBI training and I was able to figure out that the unsub was praying on the weak so I would assume that someone who is in training and has been paying attention to what was going on would too. I admit there really was no need for her in this episode, she really didn't do much, but then again neither did J.J in season 1.
I really liked this episode. I had problems with headaches for a while and eventually went for a CT scan only to find out that nothing was wrong, so I really felt for Reid. I loved how Hotch and Morgan and Rossi showed concern about Reid. A bit of the family feel to the team returning. I loved that we were not shown who the unsub was within the first few minutes. Loved to see genius Reid use force to get the unsub. The actor who played Julio did a great job. One thing I did not at all like is that Garcia was doing the briefings again after an episode or 2 of not doing them. Of all of J.J's duties that she could be doing, that is the one, aside from giving press conferences, that I do not buy the squeamish Garcia doing. I find it unbelievable and makes me miss J.J every time, and makes me like Garcia less.
Cathy
I think many people have posted excellent opinions, comments, and observations; and I must say that I liked this episode - though perhaps not for the reasons others have.
The first thing I want to say about this ep is that I thought the directing and editing was fabulous. I enjoyed the flashes back and forth that made it look like one thing was happening when it was actually another - I'm not sure I can explain what I mean, but eg., the flashes between Reid and the ritual situations that made it appear that he was having visions. I think these "back and forth" flashes made the audience (well, at least *me*) question what was actually occurring.
Also, I wrote down the beginning and end quotes, as well as everything the guy in white told Reid. Did anyone consider *why* the episode was titled "Corazon"? Or why the quotes refer to evil, happiness, the choices one makes, that the "most beautiful things in life cannot be seen or touched-they must be felt with the heart", and why the guy in white told Reid "listen with your heart - not with your head"....Interesting....And what is the "bracelet" protecting Reid from? Himself?....
Though I have seen this type of storyline recently in a old "MacGyver" rerun, and fully expected Reid to be a chemically-induced "zombie" as what happened on "MacGyver", and I also knew who the unsub was as soon as they introduced the character, I thought (hopefully!) the storyline and character interactions were put on the backburner in the episode, being used as a method of bringing the Reid issue to the forefront, rather than as a stand-alone episode. (Although, unfortunately, the writers seem to have been doing this too much this season, i.e., using the storylines to bring someone or something to the forefront and ignoring the characters, their interactions, and all previous CM eps.)
I also agree with whoever said that Reid automatically jumped to the paranoid schizophrenia conclusion when the doctor told him his headaches and hallucinations were psychosomatic due to mental or emotional distress. Of course he would jump to that conclusion - it's been worrying him his whole life! (Although I was hoping his secret would be more of a "doozey" than simply the schizophrenia issue - so many people have come up with fascinating guesses for Reid's secret!)
As for the lack of resolution at the end of the ep, as I said on Twitter: ..."It honestly left me w/my heart racing=scared, confused, & empathetic for Reid." Despite any issues that people had with the episode, I think they'd have to admit that Matthew did an awesome job in this ep.
Also, I am another person ignoring Seaver. The character is too unbelievable, and, as I said on Twitter, it appears that CBS is making Seaver look so much like JJ in hopes that non-fans will not notice a different person is here. I read an article once about how when they changed the actor portraying Darren Stevens in the old before-my-time 1960's(?) TV show "Bewitched", that no one noticed. I think they've plunked Seaver in like that, too, hoping no one will notice (NOT!), so I'm ignoring her.
I agree that CM has changed greatly since the change in writers and the loss of my personal fave, Andrew Wilder, but I'm adjusting to the new situation as best as is possible. Things will never be the same no matter how much complaining is done - obviously "ratings" is the only thing CBS cares about - not the audience and not the actors - so the obvious choice is to adjust or leave. As of right now I choose to stay - not to support CBS - but to support the cast and crew.
*BTW, this was all gleaned after watching the episode once. It will be interesting to see what else I get from the episode and/or if any of my observations change, once I watch it again.
I liked certain parts of this episode, others left me waayyyy confused!! I liked that it was Reid-centric but I just don't like Seaver being there asking her questions that even I know the answer too! And she makes me miss JJ a lot! I definatly think CM needs to get its act together and quick!
A lot of mixed emotions here. I have to say that I actually liked this episode. It was entertaining from beginning to end and is making me want to watch future episodes.
I guess everyone can agree on one thing. Matthew's performance was amazing. He really highlighted his excellent acting skills.
I am sorry but in the end if it had not been for MGG's amazing acting, this episode would have failed.........so I ask only one question, if he, MGG and the character of Reid, was not currently in this show would it survive..........and IMO the answer is no..............so please bring back our Team..........remember there is no "I" in team, they work as a unit and not as one episode showcasing one of them........we need the original writers back who created these characters and know them........
ok, it was so much expectation about this episode most of all about Reid's secret all of that to end up with what?? possessed or some hallucinations??? Seriously does CM writers think fans are dump?? OMG! Come on!!! the episode was Lame seriously! the writing is bad. They had it all to air a great episode!! and they blow it out!! that episode could have been a great memorable one but instead of that it just turned out to be poor.... Sorry!
Just had to say, not only did MGG look absolutely gorgeous, his acting was also amazing. His been in the background so much lately< I forgot how good of an actor he is. His performance at the end with the unsub and then with the doctor were great. His best performance ever. I hope he gets some recognition for it because he certainly deserves it.
Well, I'm late commenting. Not that it really matters.
good god was this episode painful. just the epitome of painful. it was like a craptacular combination of "The Serpent and the Rainbow" and "Dominion: a Prequel to the Exorcist" and what we ended up with was something so godbloodyawful that it's really somewhat difficult to put into words just how, exactly, bad it truly was.
oh andrew wilder. how we miss you.
(and the fact that Seaver was made up to look so very similar to JJ was just insulting. actually Seaver herself is just plain insulting. her coming up with a large bit of the profile...are you kidding me? she's a damn trainee. if they're going for the whole Jodie Foster/Clarice Starling angle, they're failing pretty epic. and every time I see her, I'm reminded of just how much I'd really and truly like the network to butt out and leave our show alone to do what they do best.)
ugh, and a preview for the damn spinoff just came on TV. The source of all our contention, that bloody spinoff. Really, who wanted that thing besides the network?
lord. I hate to say this, but thus far, I'm staying for Paget and once she leaves as well, I'm goin' with her.
It's amazing--in the worst possible way--that such a wonderful, well-written show has been turned into what we have now in such a short amount of time.
Whether things change or not as the result of expressing an opinion here or elsewhere, I think it is vital to do so. To do otherwise, is just to accept that what is how it is. Yes, the networks listen purely to ratings, but there are instances when what a majority of people have said has factored in a change; granted not as often as we all would probably desire, but it does happen, so keep expressing, complaining, however you want to phrase it. That being said, here is my opinion. Sorry, but I did not like this episode. I liked the final scene with Reid @ the doctor's office, but the rest of the episode failed to deliver the team presence that other character centric episodes, for as someone stated, this is a show about a team and as such the whole team should be featured interacting together and around the character being spotlighted. I really like what Amanda said about the lack of team interaction making the characters seem almost like strangers (her comment was awesome and would definitely read, re-read it) and how when there is strong team interaction that brings out what is special and great about all of the characters . These characters have always functioned like a family, but now, not so much at all which is really unfortunate. Also, the writing, sorry but the writing this season, or really since after "100" wow, disappointing considering what was delivered before and what as fans I think we have every right to expect and request. Fans take time out to watch the show, purchase episodes, bring in advertising money. Literally without viewers they would have nothing, so I for one say stand up and expect quality. Now, the writing will not always hit the mark, but it has been off for way too long. I am not going to speak about Seaver because others have done so better than I would. No show is devoid from slipping in the ratings. Shows as good and better than CM that were flying high for a while, one day, crashed and burned; shows that were following the same path CM is now following. These things don't happen overnight, it is a gradual process that typically starts with writing, then cast changes, change in airing time, etc. Many factors, but all combine together to destroy a show. Not saying CM is there, just saying no one should naturally expect that it will stay that way because now their ratings are good. Got to keep quality control in check no matter what and with the writing lately and the addition of th Seaver character, CM has got to keep things in check before it slips out of their hands. Has happened before to other shows, there is no reason CM is different from any other show. Finally, sdwally, my hat goes off to you. Your post, truly wonderful. Thanks!
Sorry my formatting is off, typing from my phone.
Okay, what's with this airing CM promos the day AFTER the new episodes are aired, rather than immediately after? What's in place? Is this a demonstration of CBS's contempt?I don't know.
how did I miss the twitter announcement that Seaver was added as a regular? maybe I had my blinders on ;)
Bad or good, I can't watch the show with her on it. I just can't. She rubs me the wrong way. So I won't watch the new episodes. But I can still enjoy the reruns!
I think everyone is looking for flaws in the newer CM episodes simply because they do not like the cast changes and as a fan who has watched since the beginning I am not pleased with CBS’s decision but have learnt to accept it. There have been a great deal of inaccuracies in previous seasons but we all chose to ignore them. Discrepancies are going to happen; they happen with every show, you just have to look past them.
Now last night’s episode was one of the better ones, it did actually wow me a few times. Although the Reid/Tobias issue and his addiction to drugs will not be topped I think allowing him to have a medical condition is a good path to go down, if done properly. I don’t think the writers necessarily have to make his medical condition being schizophrenic however, they could relate it to the stress of the job. I have known profilers who have worked for the FBI and the job does get to them physically as well as emotionally and mentally. Although they did touch upon the emotional and mental aspect with Gideon and Greenaway I think that the physically toll the job takes on profilers will be something to consider.
If people think by not watching the show CBS will reconsider their decision, you are sadly mistaken. They will only cancel it and replace it with something else, as a fan I truly hope this doesn’t happen.
Ohj good Lord above, this is not simply about not liking cast changes. The cast changes have been horrific, yes, but they serve as only a symptom of what is at the base wrong with CM and that is the writing. Discrepancies, yes, they wil exist now, have existed in the past, and will most likely in the fiuture. But this is not just about discrepancies here and ther, these are flawz that have basically altered the characters themselves; not good. If this continues, I for one will not just sit back and accept the slop CBS and CM are serving up. I will tine out; others can chose to continue watching, but I am out.
Sorry, my keyboard is acting up.
No worries about your keyboard Anonymous, I think everyone got the gist of what you were communicating and I wholeheartedly agree. Others may indeed to stay with the show (some may not have a problem at all with it so that is not even an option), but I will not continue giving CBS and CM my time if what they are going to continue to give me in return is drivel.
Sometimes looking past things is necessary, other times looking past things is disastrous. I can't help but to think, and I can be entirely wrong, that looking past things is what got us network slots almost entirely filled with horrendous reality shows. Looking past things is what makes it so difficult for pilots to get picthed, aired and picked up. Looking past things is what networks rely on so that they can continue degrading shows to the point of no return, meanwhile the viewers are being shortchanged and the networks are lining their pockets.
The writing has never been the best to begin with. Come on the writers have had numerous opportunities to develop characters but did not.
I mean to each his own. You can stop watching and try to continue fighting against CBS but it is a battle you will not win.
To the Anonymous above Gina:
you are so very right, and I completely agree with you.
This is not just about cast changes. This discord is about the fact that so many aspects of CM have changed for the worst, and because those changes were completely unnecessary to begin with. It's about the network being hubristic narcissists who think that the fans will just blindly accept whatever they throw at us. The writing's gone downhill since the bloody spinoff took some of the show's best writers, a beloved cast member was axed for no discernable reason at all (keeping the show 'fresh'? indeed.), a clone was brought in that we were automatically expected to love and adore, and the storylines are starting to sound like bad "Law and Order" fodder.
This episode certainly didn't improve anything. Reid didn't confide in either Morgan or Hotch about his headaches? Honestly? lawd. And having our unsub be a character we saw all of one scene of was insulting as hell.
the fact that this has become CM makes me truly sad.
I'll stick with CM as long as Hotch is around but if Thomas leaves then so does this viewer. I know that won't make a difference to CBS, but sure as h*** makes me feel better.
I am not fighting against CBS, it is just that my time is not something that I am willing to give to CBS to waste. And yes, there have been times when the writers have dropped the ball with respect to character development in the past, but now, there isn't even any character development, it is more like character assassination.
I am holding out for Paget's exit, if things don't change, I am out. That is a personal decision that I don't expect anyone else to follow, to each his own.
I agree with Noel. As long and Gibson is still on the show I will continue watching but once he leaves...
About the episode, didn't hate it or love it, it was just ok. Wasn’t all that bad but let's see what I did like:
- A Reid centric episode, been a long while since we had one. MGG did good with the material he had.
- The case was interesting, I like the actor who played the suspect that was being interrogated by Reid.
- Hotch was back! Misssed him, I hope CM will never have another Hotchless episode.
What I didn't like:
- Seaver, since when did she go from a cadet to a full fledge profiler? What was the deal with her being a clone of JJ? THAT was the creepiest part of last night episode!
- Why is Hotch in the background? Why wasn't he acting like a unit chief? Was he demoted again?
- What happened to Rossi and Prentiss? Why don’t they have much to do this season? Yesterday they had barely anything to do.
If I would give this episode a mark it would get a 9.0 for acting and 6 for writing.
The writing, this is what make or breaks a show. CM used to have it. I used to joke CM had only one bad episode per year now it gets about 3 or 4 in what 12 episodes?! If this was any other show I would just shrug it off and wait for the next one but then I don't care about other shows like I do with CM. CM can do way better but for that to happen, Ed and the writers must read the fans comments and do something.
I will point this:
There is no family feeling anymore. Yesterday was a great example of that. Reid was obviously in pain but no one noticed! They are not just profilers but in Morgan's case he is Reid’s friend, he barely commented on Reid behaviour. I’m watching reruns on A&E, we are so far away from how the team reacted to Reid getting beat up by Tobias. CM writers , you need to get that family feeling back.
end part 1
part 2
the team interaction is almost nonexisting now. I miss the girls having a night out, Morgan telling Prentiss about his buildings, Emily telling Hotch she had dated worse guys than Viper, the team playing cards on the plane, I miss the talks that Hotch and Rossi had. Now I feel they are all strangers, I miss THE TEAM.
I miss Hotch a LOT. He is the best character on the show, with Reid, and yet he is now in the background. What show does that? What show can afford to have their main character fade in the background? Only CM would do that. NCIS, CSI, Mentalist and many other shows would not do that, they would use their best characters because they know those characters are their strength. Imagine NCIS without Gibbs? You can't can you? Why are we getting CM without much Hotch in it? sdwally said it best, let me quote her;
"Erica Messer, Shemar Moore is not the answer. He's good, but the Morgan character is not and should not be the lead. There has been way too much of Morgan and Garcia this season. "
Morgan is not good enough to be the lead and frankly, I am tired of this season focusing on him. Who goes for the utility player when they have two great hitters ( Hotch and Reid)?
Again from sdwally:
“CBS and the producers are determined to prove that CM is not a character-driven series, but one that is driven by formula. They're wrong. While the network coddles the stars of the other dramas and comedies, TPTB and producers are determined to prove that the stars of CM are interchangeable and replaceable. They're not”
Totally agree, 100%! I watch CM NOT for the unsubs, I like good cases, interesting unsubs BUT I make sure to sit down every Wednesday night at 9:00 to watch CM live because of Hotch, Prentiss, Rossi, Reid, Garcia and Morgan. If CM wants to simply do away with those characters then it will be goodbye CM for me. I will accept Paget’s decision to stay or leave but if anyone else leaves, especially Thomas Gibson, I will just stop watching. There is only so much changes I can take before I had enough and move on.
I could go on and on but CM writers, Ed, CBS, please read sdwally post, it is way before mine, she hit on the head what is all wrong with CM this season.
I will finish with this, Ed, writers, CBS, I’m posting this not because I like to bash all of you over the head ( well in CBS and Nina Tassler’s case, yes, her firing AJ and offering Paget that stupid reduced contract was such a bad decision.) I’m posting this because I watch the old reruns of CM on A&E and I can see every Friday nights that CM can do much better than what it is doing this season. I do care about CM and I hate seeing were the show is going.
Dawn
final update for Corazon's ratings--only 12.02 million viewers. That is very low, and barely breaking 12 million. I'm getting worried now. That's the lowest rating so far for this season, and I'm afraid of even lower numbers for future episodes.
CM, what is going on? S6, I feel like I am in the middle of an episode of "Lost" hoping that either it has been all a dream, or that I will end up in heaven with my fellow CM fans. To begin with, I was super excited that this was pegged as a Reid-centric episode, but wow, this is what we get as a Reid-centric episode. All of the episodes that a previous commenter listed (Sarah) were examples of what I thought we were going to get because Matthew Gary Gubler is such a good actor that he can perfectly carry that kind of exemplary writing. But with lackluster writing in place, there is only so much Matthew can do with what he has to work with. Next point, team interactions, there weren't any. The disconnection between these characters is severely gone from the scene and it is a crying shame because it was exactly these interactions that made watching this team work so enjoyable, it was make them a family. Rossi, what happened to Rossi? The character that once seemed to knowledgable, now just seems to sit there waiting for others to make points and draw conclusions. Why is Garcia still presenting cases? It is not good. Morgan, lately, we have been getting a, I don't know, angry Morgan, gone are the days when the character had a personality that was mixed with a wide range of emotions, not just anger. Hotch, he is still leading the team, right? Sdwally said it best,
"CM needs to put scripts in Thomas Gibson's hands that are worthy of his talent; and stop giving him the nonsense that he's been getting this season, or not getting at all. Treat him the way you treat Forest Whitaker, Mark Harmon, David Caruso, and Simon Baker. Stop making the cast of CM feel as if they are expendable, replaceable, and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. They are the most important asset you have."
Hip, hip, hooray for this comment! People have been stating that Reid has been gone from the scene (which he has), but in many regards so as Hotch because the leader that we have all grown to love and respect may be there physically, but it is as if his leadership chops have been busted.
continued...
Now, with much frustration, Seaver. Before I say anything about Seaver though, can the whole "You don't like Seaver solely because she replaced JJ" card be scrapped. I mean really, it is like the individuals who are bent on saying this have not read one word of the opinions people are giving about Seaver. Well, with that, onto Seaver. I think the first question is obvious. Why is Seaver up there with the rest of the team providing the authorities part of the profile? Were we not led to believe from 25 to life that she was there to complete her remedial training, that she is a cadet? Are we to believe that 10 years elapsed from the time 25 to life aired from yesterday when Corazon aired? Seriously, it is insulting that you apparently think that viewers would not catch onto this because really that is the only way that I can explain Seaver being placed out there to provide a profile, you must believe that the viewers are as disengaged as the writers and TPTB at CBS. I know that sounds rough, but honestly, I am growing weary of all the maneuvering being done to insert this ill-fitting character into the show. I wouldn't be surprised if she started leading the team while Hotch is out of the office, I mean, you have her profiling in record speed, why not become Unit chief as it obviously takes no real elite background to be a profiler at the BAU, how much experience can it take to lead this team... I am sure she will be graduating soon and getting a nice shiny gun to boot, but sorry, she shouldn't be at the level of profiler even with her Academy diploma and shiny new gun.
Any chance of some people buying anything that you try to serve up with regard to Seaver after last night's episode is sketchy at best. The unbelievable entrance to the team as a "consultant," then now her "graduation" to profiler, come on CBS and CM we are not comatose! Your attempts at trying continually shake this character into our consciousness is simply not going to work, quite the opposite, it is angering people and may cause them to walk away. I, like others, would hope you rethink this character making a return for season 7. If you are planning to recast a female, please not a Seaver character, but rather someone who makes sense, not a super Cadet with prodigy profiling powers (stealing the term prodigy profiler from a previous commenter).
I know that I am going to sound like an additional broken record to you, but so be it. The writing has significantly decreased (Andrew Wilder, we do indeed miss you) and characters like Seaver serve only to remind me how badly the writing and integrity of the show have been diminished. I hate to say this, but assuming that Paget is leaving (which is sounds like she is), I think I will have to depart with her. But you know, if the writing keeps decreasing at the rate that it is, it is highly doubtful that I will even stick around for Paget's exit :/
Anonymous
"final update for Corazon's ratings--only 12.02 million viewers. That is very low, and barely breaking 12 million. I'm getting worried now. That's the lowest rating so far for this season, and I'm afraid of even lower numbers for future episodes."
I wouldn't start worrying now; there were other factors at play like the premiere of American Idol. If this becomes a persistent trend over a period of time, then I think it is time to worry.
However, the most likely departure of the Prentiss character with just the Seaver character remaining is something to be left desired that could possibly effect ratings (even without the departure of Prentiss the Seaver character is just a bad idea that is not improving the show). Any other character shake-up's I think may severely cripple the show.
However, for right now, I think they are ok.
I like the episode and it's making me want to watch future episodes to see what is going on with Reid. I'm not sure what people were expecting but I really felt they delivered on this episode. It was interesting and really has me guessing about Reid. I like episodes that make you think later. I really didn't expect Reid to confide in anyone so I wasn't dissapppointed there. I think he is always afraid that others may judge him and think he can't do his job preperly. He never confided in anyone about his drug problem so I think it is consistent with his character. I think it will be interesting to have his problem in the background and see how it plays out over time. I think it is definitely interesting to see how this job can affect the mind of a profiler. There is so much potential with this storyline.
The dip in ratings is because of American Idol. I'm honestly not worried. I feel like it held its own competing with such a huge show. I expected a lower rating.
Count me in with those who liked/loved this episode. I really enjoyed it a lot. It's by far my favourite episode of S6 so far and, with Corazon, CM has finally grabbed hold of my excitement and interest this season. Reid is, by far, my favourite character and I was over the moon to get an episode dealing with him at long last. I loved seeing Reid teamed up with Morgan, I've missed their friendship/interactions and I loved hearing Morgan call Reid 'kid'. I loved seeing the team members concerned about Reid and I'm looking forward to, hopefully, Reid's problems bringing back the 'family' aspect to the team that has been missing for a good while now.
MGG acted his mismatched socks off in the episode, he was wonderful. The last scene between him and the doctor was particularly well written and well acted. Reid's mind immediately going to schizophrenia, even though the doctor had merely said 'psychsomatic' showed just how terrified Reid is about developing schizophrenia. I've wanted to see more on Reid's fear of becoming mentally ill ever since the subject kind of fell by the wayside in S2 so I'm really excited to see how this all pans out. I'm really glad that Reid's issues were't all wrapped up in this one episode, I can't wait to see how this storyline for him develops.
I have been an avid Criminal Minds fan since the onset of the 1st series...but it has lost so much with the letting AJ go and now I read killing off Prentiss. Are you serious??? The new blond may be a nice person, but surely NO JJ. And without Prentiss, the show will surely go downhill. I love the rest of the cast, but PLEASE bring JJ back and keep Prentiss. I will probably stop watching it next season. You should have NEVER messed with perfection... Seriously...
To Ed Bernero,
I don’t know the reason as to why you would need to take control over the spinoff and leave Criminal Minds in the hands of so many new writers that clearly can’t sit down to watch one of the daily reruns on ION (actually I do, I saw The Fight), but now that you are back, take a long hard look at how this beloved and wonderful show is being presneted and listen to the fans.
Yes, the JJ situation was forced on you, and maybe even this new addition, but the rookie detail part was your doing. And now you can’t fix it without losing the character. You can’t fix it. You can’t make all of these fans with years and years of watching believe her character belongs. You cannot. The sooner you understand that, the better.
You are just asking too much of us.
You ask us to understand JJ leaving because of the network. We did, we blamed CBS. Period.
You ask us to stick with the show even with Paget being demoted. We are trying. But with this being her last season, how come you are not giving us more of her? You think that if you send her to the background we won’t miss her when she is gone? We miss her already.
You told us that the spinoff isn’t hurting the original. We tried to buy it, we couldn’t and we were right, and I gotta say, for more that I hate Nina Tassler for being a network executive incapable of watching her own programming, I must thank her for saying what we all knew. We knew. There was no point in lying to us.
And now you ask us to give a character the benefit of the doubt because you created her and you like your creation. But we know better than to believe that this kind of character is suitable for this show. Because we have been with this show for many years, some of us since the beginning. We know better.
You are asking too much.
And so are we.
But what we are asking is what you already gave us.
And I’m personally asking you not to give up on this show because you have a brand new one and a future one coming.
To leave the show for others to take care is not good enough. Criminal Minds was a stable success and maybe, could work without your total focus, but it has been shaken too hard lately, and it needs attention and to be brought back on its regular level.
You need to level things out. The network broke? You fix it. It’s your show, you have to fix it.
The team dynamics, the rushed cases lacking on team interaction and brainstorming, the characters in the background, the so called secrets that add nothing and change nothing and finally, the new character no one likes.
Honestly, I didn’t see the need for the addition, the show works great with only 6 characters, there’s no need or time for 7, unless you can get AJ Cook back. You should consider that, because losing JJ was a big hit for this show, I don't think the network had any idea what a big hit that would be and maybe in some level, neither did you. But it messed up with the whole team, and that whole family feel isn't there anymore. You really need her back. But if you can't do that, what you had to do was bring the other 6 characters closer together. Why didn't you do that. They do feel just like co-workers now.
I’m just really upset right now. This is my favorite show. I do not want to see it as second though to the idea of a franchise and I don’t want to see it end, especially not like this.
Please, listen to the fans, we care. We really do. Otherwise we wouldn’t be here writing long essays and asking, over and over again for your attention.
Thank you for reading.
Alana
And for all of you who are remembering ANDREW WILDER and asking for this return...
I was looking online and while Debra J. Fisher is working on Law & Order: LA, the wonderful duo Dan Dworkin and Jay Beattie are working on The Event, Holly Harold and Andrew Wilder don’t appear to have any new projects for the moment.
So there, hire them back, show!
Alana
I really wanted to like this episode and was hoping against all hope (based on season 6) that it would be good. Just to touch briefly on what the previous commenter said, yes, you are correct Reid never came out and said that he had a drug problem stemming from the drugs that Tobias forced him to take (by the way Reid/Tobias storyline was probably the best I've seen on CM), but he didn't have to. All of the characters were so in sync, that everyone knew he had an issue, and in their own and distinct way, confronting him about that. In my opinion, there is no comparing team with Reid's issue back then and now. Honestly, it almost makes me cringe when people put the Reid/Tobias storyline next to this storyline because Reid/Tobias was so good, and this current storyline is nowhere near that level of good (writing wise). Also, Reid/Tobias storyline is an excellent example of how the fact that the story was a Reid-centric one, still, the whole team was integrated in that story and it was, again, I think one of the best I've seen on the show.
Regarding this storyline, I am not opposed to the fact that Reid is suffering from physical symptoms stemming from what appears to be some psychological cause (maybe PTSD from the job), it just all goes back to the writing starting with what I disussed on top. The rest of the team, although they were in this episode, was and has been MIA. I believe Gina was right when she said there is no longer any character development, but rather character assassination. I believe it was sdwally who said that this is a character driven show, and that observation is also correct. As such, when you don't feed these characters good and meaty lines, everything in my view falls apart because it appears that these characters are just reading lines, nothing is popping out. Before, with the scripts that these actors had to work with, not only did the stories click and flow, what they said were not merely lines, but they contributed to the story being told and also served to further that character along; the viewer had a real sense of who these individuals were. Now, we have a leader who is there, but almost seeps into the background nowadays. To go back to sdwally again, the material that has been giving to the character of Thomas Gibson are not up to par with his talent and are hindering the Hotch character which is tragic beacuse it is such a great character.
The person that said in a previous thread that it seems that as time goes by on the show Morgan seems to be becoming more and more angry. Couldn't agree more. Morgan always had an edge to him, that yes, were at times angry, but he was also jovial, caring, and the brotherly relationship he had with Reid was just fantastic! It is almost like overnight all of these other aspects of Morgan have disappeared and that is also tragic. In this episode, he was again angry and his concern for Reid, "Are you alright kid?" in earlier times this would have been segway to something great between these characters. In this episode, it was said and they moved on from, unlike past episodes when we experienced such rich dialogue between these two team mates.
cont.
Like many others have said, Garcia presenting just doesn't work and may I say that I personally don't care for her attempt to be funny when presenting these cases. Yes, the ability of Garcia to inject humor into the dark world they all work in is part of who she is, it just shouldn't come out when presenting cases. This has always been the moment in the show when things have been more serious, professional and targeted than other areas. I also have to agree with what some have commented to with respect to Rossi. What happened to Rossi? It seems like each week he is either getting fewer lines or what he is saying is not really worth much attention and are not up to the level of experience and knowledge that this character possesses. Prentiss, first, I am sick at the possibility of this character leaving the show (thanks for that Tassler, ack!), but lately too, Prentiss has not been used to her abilities and why is it that you, at least to me, are trying to make it seem like Seaver and Prentiss have comparable knowledge and experience in this field. If I am correct in that observation, please stop that now. No way are these two comparable in anything. Prentiss far outweighs Seaver in everything and to show anything but that fact is insulting to the Prentiss character. Please start using Prentiss again in the way most of us have come to know and love her; as the experienced, intelligent, take charge, strong, witty character whose presence on screen was a delight to watch.
Like some others, I will not really touch on Seaver because others before me have done so and probably better than I could. It is just not a character that works with the foundation of the show unless you begin writing her as being up to par with the rest (she is a cadet, no one has forgotten that), which you did in Corazon and which most no one is buying and is rather put off by. I don't understand why you didn't cast a character who came in with experience like Prentiss and Rossi. Personally, if something could be worked out with Paget, I think the team would be just fine with Hotch, Prentiss, Reid, Morgan, Garcia and Rossi. But if an additional character is the way you guys are going, please get Seaver out and bring someone in with experience whose presence with the team giving a profile to the authorities is not out of character and makes sense given the characters background.
I hope that the Reid storyline eventually evens out because Matthe Gray Gubler is such a great actor and deserves great material, as does the character of Reid.
Anonymous (Alana) that was great!
I don't have a problem with leaving the Reid issue unresolved as of now, you just have to be careful about the way it is developed and presented in the future. Agreeing with others here in saying that the team interaction in this episode, if that is what you want to call it, was as lacking as it has been for a while now. Overall, I didn't care for this episode and I am HUGE Reid fan so that makes me upset. I just found the episode boring in many parts. I'm really hoping the ball is not dropped with this storyline.
But really, WTH, Seaver presenting part of a profile to the police in Miami???? This character barely stopped running laps on the obstacle course to suit up and sit at the profilers table at the BAU and you have her presenting profiles. You've told us to give this character a chance, even though we all know that a cadet in a team like the BAU is way out there. But you really threw yourself under the bus with that move, having her up their giving a profile. She hasn't even graduated from the academy man, not like that would make her qualified to be at the BAU as a team member anyway.
After that display of nonsense, anything with this character is just simply not going to be credible or believable, more so than before. If this type of stuff keeps happening, any respect I have left for the show will go out the window along with my viewership. I just can't tolerate nonsense.
I didn`t think the episode was so bad. I like episodes that feature religious or cult related themes and I liked the dark atmosphere and the setting where it was filmed. The actor who played the cult leader was great.
A minus point it Seaver. I don`t like the character and her profiling along with the greatest minds of the BAU is an affront to the other characters and so are the the spin off characters. I will try to ignore her and I will ignore the spin off.
This season has ups and downs but every season had ups and downs for me. There have been a little too many OOC moments this season though. The writers have to fix that. Also the continuity of the character`s backgrounds is lacking, but that is not a problem only for this season. Overall I still enjoy the show and I liked most if the episodes or at least most parts of the episodes. The light and funny team moments are not there any longer, but that was to be expected, because the show has become darker and darker over the seasons. And I don`t mind that.I want team interaction but I wouldn`t want the characters to turn into comical jerks like some characters of other show have. Garcia`s usual lighter and humorous side is enough for the show . But I did not like the beginning of this ep when Garcia joked before she presented the case. That was not Garcia-like.
That brings me to my next point.
I know this will not be a welcome and favored opinion on here, but I`m going to say it anyway. While as I mentioned didn`t like Garcia at the beginning of this ep I am pleased that the season has more Garcia and Morgan. For me there was not too much Garcia and Morgan in this season and I am not tired of this season focusing on Morgan. Like many I don`t like Garcia presenting the cases though. But I generally like the character and don`t get where all the Garcia hate suddenly comes from. She is still the same Garcia she always was. At least the writers manage (apart form the beginning of this ep) to keep her in character. Morgan is my favorite character (beside Rossi) , so of course I like to see more of him, but I wish somebody else than Erica Messer would write for Morgan. She doesn`t know the character at all and always adds some OOC moments into her eps. But I don`t like her writing style anyway.
Overall the show is still my favorite show (if I ignore Seaver)and I will continue watching , at least as long as the OOC writing doesn`t get too worse and Morgan and Rossi are still in the team.
I am on the fence about this episode. I don't like the new character. I thought the actors were wonderful but under used. It is the writing that has me confused. There is a clear difference in the level of writing in this season compared to the others. It isn't good. And it is beneath what our actors deserve. If I were actors at the level of Thomas Gibson and Joe Mantegna I would be furious. They are used to much better scripts that these. All of them are.
An increasing decline in the level of writing, characters that have been possessed by other individuals bearing no resemblance to Hotch, Rossi, Garcia, Morgan, Prentiss or Reid, characters that have been added seemingly out of the ashes from one of the levels of Dante's Inferno.... what in tarnation is going on over at Criminal Minds?
For some reason they have decided to change our characters and the team dynamic this season. I don't understand why they felt it was necessary.
The writing......yeah, what the heck has happened there. It is dreadful.
Matthew gave a great performance as always. They all did but they had little to work with.
I was disappointed.
To Ed Bernero,
I won't repeat what so many others before me (most notably sdwally) have so eloquently explained as to why the show is no longer working for them. What they say applies to me too (especially all the comments about why the Seaver character is not working out).
I will only point out that the reason we are all writing to you and complaining is because we all truly care about the show. What you should be worried about is when we stop writing to you because that will mean that we've given up on the show and have moved on.
I've remained a loyal fan of the show despite the many setbacks the show has had over the years (losing 2 characters in previous seasons and now having JJ and soon Prentiss taken away from us, and losing so many of your best writers, most notably Andrew Wilder) because in the past, I feel that you've listened to the fans. This year, I feel like what we've been saying has fallen on deaf ears, despite how many of us are saying the same thing over and over again week after week.
Given how many of us are still writing to you, this means that you still have a chance to fix things before it is too late. So please, please, please, fix it.
gw
Right there with you gw!
There are two spinoff's; the one that is going to air with Whittaker and the one that was formerly CM. So much has degraded with the original CM that I can't help but to liken it to a spinoff of something that was once good.
As others have said, we are not writing this as a way to beat up on the guys at CM, these things are being written because they are things that many people have noticed and are concerned about. It just seems like CM has all but been abandoned to work around the CM spinoff. Excellent writers have been slashed, actors have been fired and had their appearances reduced, and now an addition of a character that is turning many viewers off, not because of what happened to AJ, but because the character is out of whack with CM; and being that this character is so out of whack with CM it only highlights what else is declining with the show. Indeed, this character is not adding to the show's strength, rather, this character is taking strength away from the show.
CM was once so on point and enjoyable to watch on a regular basis. We love the characters and the setting they work in. We know there will be hits and misses, but lately, the hits have been too far and few in between (if at all present). We sincerely just want the level of quality that we know that CM is capable of producing.
It is both sad, yet lovely to see all of these comments about the writing and the new character. Sad, because the writing was so on par, and as Roshini said, we know that there wll be hits and misses, "but lately, the hits have been too far and few in between (if at all present)." Also, sad because we know that CM can deliver a more credible female character with a lot of strength and experience like Prentiss, but instead chose to go with Seaver, who as of the last episode stepped outside of anything you can realistically expect viewers to swallow moving forward i.e. cadet giving part of the profile at briefing to police, etc. This should not be the case and is a huge disappointment for many fans as well as a setback for the show.
On the flip side, it is lovely to see all of the passionate fans voice their opinions about these matters for they, as I, love this show and want to see it soar.
Based on the polarizing reaction from the viewers, I was a bit apprehensive about this episode, but I found I actually liked the show. Sure there were some over the top stuff, particularly at the final climactic scene, but overall, I thought this was an interesting case. I can’t really figure out why Reid would abandon his team and confront the unsub alone at the end. It doesn’t really make sense or fit his personality. He is normally very cautious. He went after Owen Savage alone, because he personally identified with him and wanted to save his life. He was impetuous with Tobias Hankel, because he and JJ were isolated and Tobias was about to get away. He made a classic rookie mistake with his eagerness to catch the unsub, and he paid for it dearly. Now Reid is older and wiser and I can’t figure out why he wouldn’t take his team with him, particularly since there was no reason for him to go alone. I can only guess that the pain from his headache drove him to make a very poor judgment call, or maybe just poor, illogical writing.
As a hardcore Reidchick, I appreciated the focus on Reid and found his struggles interesting. I particularly liked the opening scene where Reid’s exam was contrasted with the unsub’s killing. Poor Reid was all alone and looked so nervous and scared about what might be wrong with him. I’m curious what set off these recent headaches and how this story will play out in subsequent episodes. Is he going to be struggling with headaches and sensitivity to light until the problem is discovered? How will that further affect his work performance, and will his team really notice his problems and confront him? I guess we’ll find out in the coming episodes.
I do wish that the team showed more concern for Reid. I appreciated the fact that Hotch clearly saw something wrong with him and was obviously concerned at the end. I hope this means at some point Hotch will confront Reid about his difficulties. Granted he’s taken a hands-off approach to Reid’s problems in the past, but I hope he learned from that mistake and doesn’t let Reid struggle by himself. I know in the past Reid tried to avoid showing weakness to the team, but this time he assumed his problem was purely physical, and having a physical ailment in no way shows an inability on his part to do his job. He has opened up to Morgan and Penelope in the past, with his nightmares and his fear of developing schizophrenia. Reid just seemed all alone in this episode and nobody really made an effort to reach out to him and care for him. It was sort of the same thing after Elle came back from being shot, but at least Reid did notice her struggles and did his best to talk to her and comfort her. There really wasn’t anything like that going on here. Reid needs a good friend who will look out for him. I’d like to think that JJ would have noticed and cared that something was going on with her “baby brother”, but in the past Penelope would have as well. However nowadays she seems to only notice Morgan. Maybe that is why Reid hasn’t talked to anybody about this. He’s been portrayed as being pretty much on his own since he was shot last season, and maybe he feels some sort of alienation from the team. Or it could just be poor writing.
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I liked that Morgan and Reid were finally paired together for this case, but I just wasn’t feeling anything like empathy or concern for Reid’s well being from Morgan. Sure he asked Reid if he was all right, and called him “kid”, but it was not with the same brotherly affection he showed in earlier seasons. It seemed more like a pro forma question, like when you ask somebody how they are, but don’t really care about the answer. He seemed put out at even having to ask the question, like Reid was some annoying little kid and not a good friend. In the past, I think Morgan would have pressed Reid more on what was bothering him, like he did when Reid confessed to struggling with nightmares. To me his tone of voice was one of dismissal, which doesn’t exactly encourage Reid to open up to him. I dearly miss that brotherly connection and hope it returns. I was glad Hotch and Emily were paired together and especially liked their comfortable rapport as they were profiling the crime scene. That was something that was missed for a while now, and I hope the writers keep mixing up the partnerships, since I feel they all work well together. The only thing I’ll say about Ashley is that I was able to ignore her for the most part, so her presence didn’t diminish my enjoyment of the show. However, I feel it was ludicrous for her to present part of the profile. She hasn’t even completed the FBI Academy yet, and she is not a full-fledged special agent. She has no business interacting with the police in that capacity yet. But I guess the writers felt they needed to give her something to do, rather than just have her sit in the corner and play with a ball of yarn.
As for the case, I enjoyed the high amount of profiling in this episode. Sometimes it seems on previous cases that the team was acting more like detectives, but here I saw them actually trying to determine the unsub through profiling techniques, and I really liked hearing the verbal wordplay among them all as they narrowed down the unsub. I was glad to see Reid’s genius used more, with his brief at the beginning on Afro-Caribbean religions, to nailing who the unsub was at the end. Reid brings a lot to the team, but recent cases haven’t successfully exploited his talent. I really enjoyed Reid in the interrogation room and his interrogation style is a complete 180 of Morgan’s style. Reid is much softer, gentler and subtle, and I like to see his non-alpha male style used effectively. Contrast that with Morgan’s extremely direct, borderline aggressive interrogation technique, and it is striking.
The only weird part of the show was the borderline occult/supernatural elements. I like those things in general, but it is a bit disconcerting to see that introduced into the Criminal Minds universe. I wonder what Julio saw in Reid. Did he really see that something was wrong, or did he just closely observe Reid’s behavior and deduced that he was having headaches? Cult leaders and charlatans are master profilers at determining potential victims, but Julio seemed genuinely concerned for Reid and wanted to help him in the end. I am very eager to know what is really going on with Reid and how it will be resolved.
You know what is crazy, that many people here and in other forums, as well as people that I know personally who watch CM all say that they are just going to block/ignore the Seaver character because her character is not credible or believable, and in many cases, not tolerable.
Come on CM, you really have to rethink this character. Either leave the cast at six, provided that Paget will stay, or if Paget leaves, get another character that has the chops to be there. A character that people do not have to train themselves to ignore because the character is such a bad, bad match for the show. This does nothing positive for the show. Oh, and before anyone says it, for about the 100 millionth time, this has nothing to do with the AJ situation. If this character were a character like Prentiss or Rossi, someone credible and believable with experience, I think people would give the character a shot. But a not even fresh out of the academy cadet standing up and giving a profile with the rest of the team at the police station, CM, that is just preposterous! Even fresh from the academy, this characeter would still not be BAU ready. Come on CM, this is just not cutting the mustard. Please give us some credit.
I don't like the new character. And not because of AJ's leaving! I want more episodes for the show's lead and not just have Hotch standing around. CM needs to showcase TG's acting, not ignore it. Hotch & Reid need more screen-time, not less, especially Hotch. Pair those 2 up more. I'm sick of Morgan's arrogance and power-tripping. The writers need to look back at previous seasons and get it right. Save Prentiss. I really care about CM and it pains me to have to complain so much. Thank you.
You go Shemar and Paget.. I am referring to the article that was just posted on the blog from TV guide. Here is a quote from Shemar and Paget:
“I’m flattered that we’ve done such a good job that they would like to do another show, but there’s another part of me that wants it to fail,” states Shemar Moore on the show’s L.A. set. “CBS, as far as I know, has never had a failed spinoff. I’m not gonna lie, I hope this is their first. Nothing against those actors, but because if it fails [CBS will] realize that this shit ain’t easy.”
“We worked with a guest cast and they used our resources and our crew, and we worked really hard to create this thing for them (and) we kinda got shafted,” continues Paget Brewster. “And it was what we were afraid of. We were afraid that we would be cannibalised for the creation of this next show and unfortunately, that’s a little bit of what happened.”
The article goes on to say, "Regardless, Suspect Behavior was the source behind the changes to the original, which was confirmed by CBS president Nina Tassler at the recent TCAs. Though the cast appears to have welcomed new addition Rachel Nichols with open arms, Cook’s dismissal threw them for a loop and sadly, it looks like Brewster may soon be following in her footsteps. This season, the actress says her character will face a growing problem that stems from her past with a European organization, which “may or may not lead to my demise.”
I hope it doesn't lead to her demise, but clearly, she is not happy with the situation over there. The article continues "Though the cast appears to have welcomed new addition Rachel Nichols with open arms, Cook’s dismissal threw them for a loop and sadly."
I am sure that they are not holding anything against Nichols, she is an actress and this is a gig, plus they are professionals. I would like to add that neither are the people who have voiced concern over the Seaver character. It is not about Nichols the actress, rather the character of Seaver and how it does not fit at all with CM.
On the off chance that Ed Bernero will ever read my comment, Sir, Ms. Nina Tassler has done enough to decimate CM. Please don't add to that by continuing what has been happening with the writing lately and by insisting on keeping the Seaver character on board. Again, it is nothing personal against Nichols, it is just that the Seaver character is harming a show that has already been harmed enough. Add to that the writing as of late, and it is a bomb getting ready to explode.
Corazon just wasn't that good, and I hate saying that because I've wanted a new Reid episode for TOO FREAKIN LONG! I didn't expect them to fully wrap up his secret in one episode, but I thought they'd at least let the audience (not necessarily the BAU) know what it is. Since it looks like they're not gonna deal with it again any time soon, I don't wanna waste my time on Reid-less episodes. In past seasons, even when it wasn't a Reid episode, he'd usually have a couple of good scenes. Now, he's little more than an extra. MGG deserves SO MUCH BETTER.
As a hard-core Hotch fan, I'd like to think that I can still enjoy another character's time in the spot light and was looking forward to the Reid episode. The case was fine but the character writing was awful! And unlike previous 'character-based' episodes, the rest of the team was basically absent, except for Morgan who has certainly gotten on my nerves over the past year and I've seen enough of this season already. MGG was good, but still OOC in places which must be disappointing to his fans.
Naturally, I would like to see Hotch get far more focus than he has been this season. He is the team leader, after all, not Morgan. In TG, you have one of the most talented actors on television playing one of the best characters on television and yet you continue to push Hotch backwards. While I understand the need for others to get their time (and agree), if you want this ship to continue to sink, just keep leaving TG on the side. And if you continue to do that, you will lose a big CMfan base.
But then again, maybe that's exactly what CBS wants. They have never given this show credence, only taken, taken, taken and expected the fans to simply suck it up. Well, if you keep up with the OOC writing (CM, this is down to you!) and abysmal attempts at getting a very loyal fandom to believe in the unbelievable with respect to their characters, you'll be in for a shock. It's obvious that there are many people at the end of their ropes. Regardless of which character we adore, we are just about done with 'sucking it up'. One can only imagine what our poor cast are thinking each week.
Get a small core group of writers and keep them! And please, for the love of god, include a CM marathon as part of orientation.
Madeline said,
"On the off chance that Ed Bernero will ever read my comment, Sir, Ms. Nina Tassler has done enough to decimate CM. Please don't add to that by continuing what has been happening with the writing lately and by insisting on keeping the Seaver character on board. Again, it is nothing personal against Nichols, it is just that the Seaver character is harming a show that has already been harmed enough. Add to that the writing as of late, and it is a bomb getting ready to explode."
Madeline, I too hope that there is a chance, however slim that chance may be, that Ed Bernero will read your comment. Tassler has done enough to totally gut CM, Bernero does not have to finish the job by not doing something about the writing and the Seaver character.
Diana said,
"But then again, maybe that's exactly what CBS wants. They have never given this show credence, only taken, taken, taken and expected the fans to simply suck it up. Well, if you keep up with the OOC writing (CM, this is down to you!) and abysmal attempts at getting a very loyal fandom to believe in the unbelievable with respect to their characters, you'll be in for a shock. It's obvious that there are many people at the end of their ropes. Regardless of which character we adore, we are just about done with 'sucking it up'. One can only imagine what our poor cast are thinking each week."
Diana, couldn't agree with you more here! Like I said in my response to Madeline's post, Tassler has done enough to totally gut CM, Bernero does not have to finish the job by not doing something about the poor writing which has lead to many OOC moments, along with the unbelievable which is the Seaver character.
On twitter, Rachel Nichols said that she is a regular for the rest of the season. Maybe she'll end up being a villain or something. She does have a messed up past. Maybe she's here to get revenge on Rossi and Hotch for taking her dad away - i don't know. This way her character will be gone and there is something interesting to do with her role. I feel like they have to do something dramatic with her that they couldn't have done with the character of JJ. Otherwise there is just no point getting rid of AJ and getting Rachel Nichols. She adds no value to the show. Who knows, maybe she's secretly putting drugs in Reid's drinks that are causing hreadaches. MAybe she wants to bring the whole team down.
Anonymous, I don't care how they get rid of the Seaver character if they do indeed plan on getting rid of her by the end of the season, which I hope to God that they do. Seriously, she is degrading the quality and credibility of the show(not Nichols the actress, the Seaver character- making the distinction in case someone wants to attack me for attacking Nichols which I am not doing. And no, this has nothing to do with CBS firing AJ).
Madeline say it all with regard to the Seaver character, as well as many other people here (Madeline, I too hope Bernero somehow gets to read your comment),
"On the off chance that Ed Bernero will ever read my comment, Sir, Ms. Nina Tassler has done enough to decimate CM. Please don't add to that by continuing what has been happening with the writing lately and by insisting on keeping the Seaver character on board. Again, it is nothing personal against Nichols, it is just that the Seaver character is harming a show that has already been harmed enough. Add to that the writing as of late, and it is a bomb getting ready to explode."
To be honest, i feel bad for Rachel Nichols because she got the crappiest role ever. I'm pretty sure she is capable of more as an actress but really there nothing she can add to this role. I hope they find a good way of getting rid of her. Anon - that idea may work, hopefully that is why they got her - just to make her an unsub in the end.
Actually, making her an unsub in the end would be a pretty cool idea. I am not just saying that because I too think her character should not return, but because I think it actually would be a cool and interesting twist.
after watching the episode I think that some how the writing went down hill at some point the storyline didn't made any sense, it was more like what is going on here? b/c it seem forced like a lack of inspiration and so far it's making this season to be the last, sincerely the writers need a serious make over! mmm.. ok ot extreme.
Full disclosure, I do not like the Seaver character for all of the reasons posted by others, and so I am not saying that I want her to become an unsub so that she eventually gets written off the show (which I hope she does). But seriously, I think that would be a such a cool episode. To see how the team would go about deducing that she is the unsub and what that would do to the team on a psychological level being that they had an unsub that close to them all of this time.
Oh man, that sould be such a cool episode! Anonymous, pretty cool idea :)
I didn't really care for this episode either. Again I felt like it could have been so much better. I still do not like the Seaver character and have decided to try to ignore her as best I can. I wonder why Hotch didn't get upset with Reid for running off without telling anyone as he had done in a previous episode? In that episode he actually threatened to fire Reid if it happened again. I think it just shows this new inconsistency in the writing of the charcters. It is so unlike Hotch to accept just anyone onto his team, least of all a cadet with no experience. It was so unlike Garcia to be cheerful at the presentation of a murder. That stuff use to really upset her.
CBS should've listened to the CM fans and left the show as was. Maybe if they would put all the effort they're putting forth for the new spinoff back to the original CM, we would have our show back. I hate to be so negative and critcal but I cannot say I enjoyed something or that it was entertaining when it isn't true. I understand that after shows are on the air awhile they eventually dwindle. The problem is there was nothing wrong with Criminal Minds. It has been a well liked and successful show till CBS started screwing around with the cast and not putting as much effort into the writing.
Why did they not listen to the fans? Am I mistaken or is that what makes a show, the people who watch it? Nina Tassler has said the new changes are suppose to be creative but I find that explaination lacking. There has been no creative changes yet that have added to the show. Some have taken away but nothing added. As for creativity, a spinoff isn't very creative to me anyways. A fresh, new idea is better than a spinoff, ecspeciallly if the production of a spinoff is going to affect the current show in a negative way. So many shows have spinoffs now: Law and Order, CSI, NCIS. Do we really need another?
Once Paget Brewster is gone from the show, I will not care to watch it anymore. I hate to see her go, but I do not blame her if she was to leave. I also have no plans to watch the spinoff either.
On a better note, the next epsiode looks like it has a real good storyline. I just hope the writing will be better than the recent episodes.
Anonymous above Felicia, OMG, making Seaver an unsub would be super cool! The psychological effects on the team alone would be awesome! I want the character to leave anyway, but this would be an awesome way for her to depart!
Anonymous below Amy, 100% agree with everything that you wrote! It is such a shame that a show that was so great was chopped down the way it was by CBS. There was absolutely nothing wrong with CM. I just don't get CBS!
Love the "Seaver is an ubsub" storyline. Let's hope they do that or something even more clever.
Loving the Seaver is an unsub idea, not only because of what can be explored on a psychological level with the team as a whole, but also on a more character specific level for Hotch being that he is the Unit chief. I could only imagine what a blow that would be for him and what an opportunity that would present for some of TG's acting skills to come alive. Oh, and you know Erin Strauss would have a field day with that!
I would take anything that would get rid of the Seaver character (nothing against Nichols, just not a good character for the show; totally not credible), but really, the unsub idea is perfection!
I think it is sad that Ed Bernero deserted Criminal Minds for a spin-off. So, I also hope the spin-off fails so Ed can again focus his attention to where it should be.
Since so many were mentioning writers, I had to look to see that Ed Bernero wrote the Fisher King (best ever),and Profile, Profiled and so many amazing episodes and what happened to Chris Mundy who wrote the fantastic Revelations among other great episodes, Oanh Ly wrote Amplification and many other great episodes. Where are these amazing writers? Simon Mirren has been there since the beginning and has written some really good episodes, but I think he needs to focus on the team interaction, the comraderie, the occasional light-heartedness, all the things that made Criminal Minds what it used to be and what the fans miss so much.
Anonymous- you are so right! Bernero, following the Tassler "franchise" model did abandon CM which is quite evident looking at what season 6 has produced thus far. Plus, Bernero is the "mastermind" behind the whole Seaver character; that alone tells me that he needs to refocus on CM.
From what I know, Chris Mundy was shipped off to the spinoff to be both writer and showrunner, only to later be fired because they said they didn't like the direction he was moving the spinoff in- yeah, I guess good writing is something Tassler can't grasp. Of course, the brilliant minds at CBS did not have the presence of mind to rehire him for CM; guess they had to keep the bad writing consistent between both shows. Oanh Ly wrote some fantastic stuff and do I even need to name Andrew Wilder. To this day, I don't understand this move on the part of CBS. They have really obliterated CM.
Sooo... Seaver can't stand blood, YOU'RE WORKING IN THE BAU for goshness sake's. What did you expect? Ponies and cotton candy?
This episode, if not for MGG superb acting, and the fact that Prentiss had a scene with Hotch and not only Morgan all the time, would have been a huge disappointment.
Once the Prentiss arc is over, and she leaves, so will I because I truly have better things to do than listen to a cadet ask whether the red substance near a decapitated head is blood, and other nonsensical questions.
Yet, if Paget continues on the show (I REALLY HOPE SO), I would love to continue watching as she portrays Emily to be a witty, intelligent, and overall powerful female role model.
The only way CBS will get me to watch their ripoff, oops, I mean spinoff, is if they make Seaver disappear for a long long long time and never come back.
"Loving the Seaver is an unsub idea, not only because of what can be explored on a psychological level with the team as a whole, but also on a more character specific level for Hotch being that he is the Unit chief. I could only imagine what a blow that would be for him and what an opportunity that would present for some of TG's acting skills to come alive. Oh, and you know Erin Strauss would have a field day with that!"
So right, Martha, this would give Thomas something to dig his teeth into and could explore the relationship with Rossi since Rossi was really the one who went and recruited Seaver.
Strauss... *shudder* ;)
Seaver is a cadet who hasn't even completed training and now she's allowed to profile with the experienced pros. It invalidates them all!
This is the inherent issue with this character Ed Bernero, et al.
Will watch what I consider to be the ONLY CM as long as TG is around. The so-called 'franchise' thing... no, no, no. NEVER. You messed up big this time, CBS.
Loving the Seaver is an unsub idea, not only because of what can be explored on a psychological level with the team as a whole, but also on a more character specific level for Hotch being that he is the Unit chief. I could only imagine what a blow that would be for him and what an opportunity that would present for some of TG's acting skills to come alive. Oh, and you know Erin Strauss would have a field day with that!"
So right, Martha, this would give Thomas something to dig his teeth into and could explore the relationship with Rossi since Rossi was really the one who went and recruited Seaver.
Strauss... *shudder* ;)
Helen, I didn't even connect the Rossi character to this, but you are right. He is the one that went to get her at the academy, that could provide a fantastic storyline for Hotch and Rossi- exploring that relationship.
Does anyone know if Shemar Moore is coming back to CM for season 7? The reason I am asking is because there is a quote from him that I just read which states,
"To tell you the truth, this particular season, the sixth season, contracts are up and things have happened," says Shemar Moore, who plays the show's sexy alpha male Derek Morgan. "We lost AJ Cook... we don't know what the future holds for the Prentiss character... we didn't know this was going to happen. There's been a lot of politics."
As far as I know, he is coming back, but after reading his bold, but oh so lovely quote, in the TV Guide article just posted by the blog (thank you), I don't know.
You think that Shemar Moore might get fired for his interview? That would level the playing field (sarcasm).
You know things are bad when not only the fans, but the CAST also hate current developments. So, their contracts are up, hmmm? Are they going to stay on, or are they all going to quit, ending the show?
where did you find that quote anyway?
It was from an article printed by the RTE Ten entertainment network.
"You know what is crazy, that many people here and in other forums, as well as people that I know personally who watch CM all say that they are just going to block/ignore the Seaver character because her character is not credible or believable, and in many cases, not tolerable.
Come on CM, you really have to rethink this character. Either leave the cast at six, provided that Paget will stay, or if Paget leaves, get another character that has the chops to be there. A character that people do not have to train themselves to ignore because the character is such a bad, bad match for the show. This does nothing positive for the show. Oh, and before anyone says it, for about the 100 millionth time, this has nothing to do with the AJ situation. If this character were a character like Prentiss or Rossi, someone credible and believable with experience, I think people would give the character a shot. But a not even fresh out of the academy cadet standing up and giving a profile with the rest of the team at the police station, CM, that is just preposterous! Even fresh from the academy, this characeter would still not be BAU ready. Come on CM, this is just not cutting the mustard. Please give us some credit."
Completely agree Erin!!!
I am sad that it has taken so long to give us a Reid-centric episode and, when they do, MGG is handed such tripe to try to work with.
I've always been a Reid-fan. I've loved watching his character develop as the series goes along. I hated Gideon along with everyone else for leaving Reid in the lurch with no mentor figure. I loved that Hotch did some Reid-bonding, and that wonderful love/hate Morgan/Reid friendship that was seen in earlier seasons. Give MGG a proper script and he is a dynamite performer to watch.
But here, in Corazon, MGG didn't even have many lines. He was expected to sit quietly in the dark with sunglasses on and rub his head and eyes at the appropriate times. That was it. That was supposed to be a Reid-centric episode. How humiliating for the actor.
That he was made to sit there, voiceless and expressionless as the voodoo priest chanted and railed for nearly a full minute in interrogation was awful. That his interaction with his teammates was dull and unemotional - all to foward the plot device of "blinding headaches" that was never, and probably will never be resolved - was criminal.
Wooden, lifeless characterizations of his teammates didn't help matters. Reid is at his best and most captivating when he is interacting with unsubs or teammates, when he is animated and sparks that energy that we all love. Unfortunately, he was not allowed to do any of that in this ep.
Seaver aside, Corazon failed as a Reid-centric episode. The writing and directing was abysmal. Ed Bernero should be ashamed of some of the writing this season, but, for Reid fans, this was the worst.
Marizpan, thank you for writing what you did. I had similar reactions as you, but could not have written it the way that you did.
It is sad what is going on with CM.
"Sooo... Seaver can't stand blood, YOU'RE WORKING IN THE BAU for goshness sake's. What did you expect? Ponies and cotton candy?"
Really seaver?, thanks for pointing this out (by the way, love your name "Really Seaver?") I had almost forgotten about that part, as I try and forget almost every part that Seaver is in (except of course the part that had my blood boiling when she was giving the profile with the team). There was also a part when she asks if that is blood near the decapitated head. Good grief, this Seaver character is just god awful in almost every imaginable way.
The episode as a whole was enjoyable.
There are aspects I appreciated and I liked how they tried to distinguish different religions that could easily be confused (even if I'm sure the facts weren't completely accurate).
I loved the beginning with Reid at the hospital.
But I'm unsure about where they're going with Reid's storyline.
I'm hoping that his symptoms will, in the end, be the results of a physical disease, not a mental one.
Maybe his doctor (I don't know if he's a radiologist or a neurologist) misdiagnosed him. There are tumors that don't show on MRI.
There are also different kind of MRI and they don't reveal the same things, maybe Reid had a 'basic' MRI scan.
Maybe his doctor didn't read the brain scans correctly. This happens more than we would like to think.
I wouldn't want Reid to physically react so strongly to the emotional stress of his job. It means it would be time for him to quit his job, so I hope it's not psychosomatic.
I don't want the writers to drop the issue either, because they had us invested in that storyline.
So if they simply let it go with a 'oh, don't worry it was just stress, he's better now', I'll be pissed too.
Julio's comment to Reid (that he would need protecting) makes me think that this storyline is not over.
He also said before that his head was spoiled and that he needed to "do a cleansing quickly" (well, the 'Spirit' said so). So it means it's something he can fight.
So, what if Reid's doctor misdiagnosed him and in another episode (like 'Coda') the real reason for Reid's symptom is discovered ? Maybe a surgery could be part of the cleansing mentioned.
That's the explanation I'm hoping for concerning this storyline. If Reid is physically seriously sick, I don't mind (quite the opposite actually).
But I don't want his symptoms to be the result of schizophrenia or a psychosomatic reaction to the emotional stress of the job.
I think I may have an idea where Reid's headaches are leading to--a breakdown. The other day I was doing a random google search on nervous breakdowns and found out that migraines are a symptom of a nervous breakdown. Here are some other symptoms that I think apply to Reid:
Sleep disruption - much longer periods of sleep or insomnia (remember his nightmares)
Constipation (remember the TUMS he took in "JJ")
Migraine headaches (obviously)
Extreme exhaustion/fatigue
Visual/eye disturbances
Plus, a number of potential causes:
Stress (oh definitely, with a job like Reid's)
Genetics (this might be part of Reid's genetic history)
Alcohol and drug abuse (the Dilaudid from earlier seasons)
Schizophrenia (or in Reid's case, the fear of Schizophrenia )
and
Extreme guilt or emotional problems
I'm just throwing something out, but that's what I think it's going to lead to, provided that it continues. I was glad that it wasn't completely wrapped up in Corazon, but I will be pissed if it never comes up again.
Interesting that this is the season when their contracts are up and we are been given the worst episodes ever, I would not be surprised to see their 2 money earners, Hotch and Reid being moved to the spin off show as part of the team and the rest of the cast let go, we already know that Garcia is going to be in the spin off, so this way they keep their more popular actors and the rest are gone.......would not surprise me in the least..........
The latest installment of CM was far from its best, but I was able to find a few things to like about it. The storyline itself was refreshingly new and disturbing. Hotch was back and it’s been way too long for this Thomas Gibson fan to have a new scene with Hotch; I’m still distraught about “25 to Life”. Prentiss and Hotch profiling at the scene of a crime was a treat. MGG did an excellent job and Hakeem Kae-Kazim was magnificent, he was awesome in season seven “24” too.
I too ignore the Seaver character, she adds nothing for me and love the idea of her being a unsub, very clever.
sdwally, your comments are spot on and worthy of repeating: CM needs to put scripts in Thomas Gibson's hands that are worthy of his talent; and stop giving him the nonsense that he's been getting this season, or not getting at all. Treat him the way you treat Forest Whitaker, Mark Harmon, David Caruso, and Simon Baker. Stop making the cast of CM feel as if they are expendable, replaceable, and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. They are the most important asset you have.
I hope that all tptb read the comments posted here and take the right steps to bring back the Criminal Minds we all love so much.
Mary
Like I've said, just move the entire CM Original team to the spinoff.
I'm sure TPTB won't even notice, it's not like they watch it.
And tell Forest Whitaker to stick to movies where he actually get Oscars, not only backlash.
And let's all call it a day.
Yup, an absurd comment for a absurd chain of events.
"Interesting that this is the season when their contracts are up and we are been given the worst episodes ever, I would not be surprised to see their 2 money earners, Hotch and Reid being moved to the spin off show as part of the team and the rest of the cast let go, we already know that Garcia is going to be in the spin off, so this way they keep their more popular actors and the rest are gone.......would not surprise me in the least.........."
Anonymous, you know what I was thinking, I was thinking that maybe Tassler's hope was that the spinoff would take off, becoming as popular or perhaps more popular than CM, so that when the CM actors came to the table to negotiate their contracts she would either low-ball them, or run a Paget on them.
Martha,
"Loving the Seaver is an unsub idea, not only because of what can be explored on a psychological level with the team as a whole, but also on a more character specific level for Hotch being that he is the Unit chief. I could only imagine what a blow that would be for him and what an opportunity that would present for some of TG's acting skills to come alive. Oh, and you know Erin Strauss would have a field day with that!"
Helen,
"So right, Martha, this would give Thomas something to dig his teeth into and could explore the relationship with Rossi since Rossi was really the one who went and recruited Seaver.
Strauss... *shudder* ;)"
Martha and Helen, I so wish this could be an episode! I think it would be fabulous!
Right now, I am watching the episode "Penelope" from season 3 on ION. God, I am so angry at what Tassler, Bernero and the rest of the CBS cronies have done to CM. First, Tassler for thinking that the writers and female cast (AJ and Paget) of CM were nothing but warm bodies occupying space on a CBS lot; Bernero for all but turning his back away from CM to jump aboard the spinoff train and creating and leaving the dreadful character of Seaver in his wake, and the rest of the CBS cronies for going along with all of this madness!!!
"The latest installment of CM was far from its best, but I was able to find a few things to like about it. The storyline itself was refreshingly new and disturbing. Hotch was back and it’s been way too long for this Thomas Gibson fan to have a new scene with Hotch; I’m still distraught about “25 to Life”.
I agree. Not the best episode but not the worst. And like you, anon, I just needed to see Hotch back and steering the ship. CM isn't CM without him. I wish tptb would figure that out. And also agree with the refreshing change of Hotch/Prentiss being paired, as well as Reid with Morgan. Bout time!
Becky
"Right now, I am watching the episode "Penelope" from season 3 on ION. God, I am so angry at what Tassler, Bernero and the rest of the CBS cronies have done to CM. First, Tassler for thinking that the writers and female cast (AJ and Paget) of CM were nothing but warm bodies occupying space on a CBS lot; Bernero for all but turning his back away from CM to jump aboard the spinoff train and creating and leaving the dreadful character of Seaver in his wake, and the rest of the CBS cronies for going along with all of this madness!!!"
Christa, in a billion years I will not have come even one inch closer to understanding this madness.
A few flaws. People are giving it a bad rating? Yes the style was different but the disappointment is really walking away from the episode with no confirmed answeres on Reid. For all I know the headaches are stress induced. Does he ever take a vacation? And no, recovery times from gunshot wounds-anthrax-kidnappings do not count.
As for Seaver, her presence helps the writers keep the dialogue moving. It would be ridiculous to have the BAU explaining terms like unsub this far into the series. Explaining information to a cadet maintains ctedibility of local LEO's.
"As for Seaver, her presence helps the writers keep the dialogue moving. It would be ridiculous to have the BAU explaining terms like unsub this far into the series. Explaining information to a cadet maintains ctedibility of local LEO's."
Um, what??? There has only been maybe 1 or 2 episodes that I can recall where someone in law enforcement asked what an unsub was, and I think Gideon, and maybe Hotch explained it in about a second and moved on from there. It wasn't something that they needed to explain in length, and certainly isn't something that they need a cadet to do.
After all of this time, if they need a cadet on the show to keep the dialogue moving, than that does not bode well for them.
Carmela, not only that, but also, Seaver wasn't explaining any of this in the episode. No, she was up there straight up breaking down part of the profile to the police with the rest of the team; CRAZY! The rest of the time, she was out with Prentiss and Rossi at, I think the guy's name was Julio's, house.
Plus, you're right, I think it was like maybe 2 episodes where they said what an unsub was, something that didn't even take them a half a minute to do. Also, usually if there are those types of questions from the police, they are usually asked in the portion of the show when they are breaking down the profile to them, and usually one or a few of the profilers breaks it down to them. Again, it isn't something that is lengthy and it certainly isn't something that Seaver is needed for. She should be doing that for herself instead of getting up there acting like a profiler already. That is just ridiculous, but I knew they were going to do that which makes them lose credibility. A cadet simply should have never been up there profiling with the rest of the team, heck, a cadet shouldn't be there period. The BAU is not a profiler boot training camp and it shouldn't become one now.
CM you are making the BAU lose what always made it elite and revered.
I think ion tv has really been the crux to see how CM has gone down hill. After watching past episodes over and over again you can really see and FEEL the difference between the old and the new. For instance, just the way they do the police profile. I just watched the episode where a little girl went missing in the park. Hotch started the profile, a question was asked and Gideon answered the question (including a backdrop of how easily an unsub can lure a child). The profile was flowing among the cast members. It didnt seem rehearsed or forced. In comparison, in the last episode, they looked like a line a students standing in front of the class showing how they had memorized their lines. To me it actually sounded silly. It went to ridiculous when Seavers joined in. Why is it Seavers can be a profiler as a cadet but JJ would have needed to go back and take classes to become a profiler (as asked by Hotch, when JJ did a good job figuring out the unsub, has she ever thought of going back and taking classes to become a profiler) Couldnt JJ with all her past experience gone the same route as Seavers and just mysteriously become one? Nevermind, the whole seavers line is just so unbelievable! But my point above is that being able to compare the old and the new I think the storylines are still great. Its the way they are written now. The focus is now more on the guest cast and what happens with them. More time is taking to develop them. In the past it was more of the cast, how they worked together, their personalities, their feelings and therefore we were able to see all of our favorites interact. Gosh when was the last time we have seen anything like the science rocket with Reid, Prentiss, JJ and Garcia and especially Hotch with his reprimand and then his softness. Classic CM! Thats the kind of scenes we are wanting...not the Hotch/Morgan asking "are you ok" to Reid and then letting it drop because the interaction between cast is reduced to almost nothing so they can focus more on the story and guest cast.
I finally found a "source" (I don't do waiting for weeks to watch CM - say no more!) and watched the episode. A lot of what I think has already been said, but...
Firstly, I really liked the opening sequence. The contrast between the dark frenetic scenes in Miami and the tense starkness of Reid sat alone on a corridor in hospital was extremely effective for building tension.
"Aha! Have the good old days returned?" I thought.
In one word: No.
The premise of Corazon had potential, but for reasons I just can't quite grasp there seems to have been a somewhat anaemic quality to this episode. *Something* was lacking.
There's definitely more focus on the physicality and violence of the crimes, to the detriment of the profiling CM was built on. Violence on TV doesn't bother me if it's relevant to a show and not graphic for the sake of it. One of my other favourite shows is Dexter (mainly for the insight into the character and what makes him tick) which can be rather gory at times. Yes, there was more profiling this week, but it still felt rushed.
The team... They don't seem as close as they used to be. If one of my work colleagues showed the same behaviour as Reid did on that street I'd be badgering them about what was wrong until they either knocked me out or sought medical attention. Morgan asked if he was alright and then quite happily accepted Reid's obvious lie that he was. I do think Hotch and Rossi realise something's wrong, that *look* they shared after Reid said he'd faked a headache to distract the ubsub spoke volumes.
Hotch: Someone said they thought he wasn't fully focussed (I'm paraphrasing here). If I recall correctly TG said Hotch's secret is something to do with not allowing himself to go through the grieving process properly after Haley's death. I know why TG was absent during the previous episode but I'm wondering if hints are now being dropped for Hotch's secret to be revealed.
Seaver: I feel desperately sorry for Rachel Nichols who's been cast as an unrealistic character, especially when we're still annoyed after the loss of JJ. I'd love to see JJ return, but there's still a minority of people who can't fathom that JJ's departure is not RN's fault!
Prentiss: I wouldn't blame Paget Brewster for leaving after the way she was treated last summer and now the decreased screentime. My only hope is if someone gets killed off at the end of the season it's Seaver rather than Prentiss, even if Prentiss was the target - possible end of season cliffhanger?
Reid: Superb acting from MGG; the end scene was excellent, I could imagine what was racing through his mind. To instantly go into denial that he's schizophrenic before the doctor had even suggested anything of the sort shows how terrified Reid is of becoming like his mother. For the record, I still think it's migraines although the idea of stress manifesting itself as physical symptoms is beginning to carry some weight with me. They'd better not leave it hanging like they did with the drugs issue back in season 2!
Continued:
Simon Mirren said Reid's secret would be "a doozy". Migraines aren't my idea of "a doozy" (great quote from my Mum - "What the hell's a doozy?" when I mentioned it over the phone ages ago) so I'm hoping it's something more "juicy". Maybe the strain of the job, the worry he could develop schizophrenia, lack of a social life and ladyfriend outside work (I'm assuming that's still as has been hinted at previously) means it's all piling up on him and eventually he snaps? How he snaps, if he snaps, is an unknown quantity in my mind.
I hope the spin-off flops. If I understand correctly there's an initial 13 episodes? Surely if the ratings are poor no further episodes will be ordered? I don't know if or when it'll be shown in the UK/Europe but if poor ratings in the US bring about its downfall you folks across the water know what to do!!! My logic being if the spin-off fails the quality of the original will pick up again, although that's probably wishful thinking on my part.
Finally, the poster who said the cast seem unhappy with what's been happening summed it up nicely. We KNOW the actors are an amazingly talented bunch of people. It must be soul-destroying to get one of the new inferior scripts. The quality of the show's actors makes no difference here, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
And, breathe...
Carmela and J.A., yes, those are things that when they have been done on the show have been done quickly and infrequently. J.A., you are absolutely right about the BAU not being a "profiler boot training camp" and how it shouldn't become one now. Also, J.A. you are right that in inserting the character of Seaver into the show, CM is casting the BAU in a less elite and credible light. If a cadet can get up there and profile, seriously... Point blank, the Seaver character should have never been added to the show.
Raven, the "Physics Magic" scene between Hotch, JJ, Garcia, Prentiss, and Reid from the "Profiler, Profiled" episode is one of my all time favorite CM moments!!!! That is the feel and the vibe that has been missing from the show in soooooo long! Also, your point about the profiling to the police part feeling more forced and rehearsed, I believe you are correct. Before, there was more of a flow in the giving of the profiles to the police, which flowed from one character to the other. Yes, they are spending too much time nowadays on the guest cast, the unsub, to the complete detriment of the characters.
Disappointedly Confused, ditto to everything you said. Oh, and I love how your mom asked "What the hell's a doozy?" LOL
Reid, go get a second opinion asap !
A good M.D. won't simply talk about a psychosomatic cause and leave it at that when your symptoms are so severe (blinding headaches that last for days, impaired visions, high light sensitivity, sort of hallucinations,...).
I too am hoping his doctor missed something and that his symptoms are the cause a purely physical issue.
So, Reid, go see a competent and reputable neurologist who will do another MRI or CT Scan (and other tests if necessary).
@ Yomayra: My old lady doesn't watch as much American TV as I do, hence she needs some words translating! She's quite partial to CM if that's any consolation.
And I must remember the double P next time, blame too few mugs of tea before I posted.
My cousin is a radiographer who specialises in CT/MRI scanning, but I don't know when I'll next see her to ask about what a doctor would say to a patient, etc. At any rate, different countries probably have different protocol for explaining things so it may not be relevant to a hospital in Virginia (I assume he went to one near home).
I hope the writers, producers, that bl00dy Tassler woman (shame on you!), etc. read these threads...
Just finished watching the Corazon episode and have just one question, "What in the bloody hell is going on over at Criminal Minds?" Goodness, where shall I start? Well, first, I don't have an issue with presenting a scenario where the supernatural/voodoo is involved, but for Criminal Minds, that can be tricky. In theory, if written properly, this backdrop could have worked. Unfortunately, that was not the case here. Everything just seemed to be jammed together in kind of the way a cheesy, late night movie one would watch if they couldn't fall asleep would play. And what happened to the "doozy" Simon alluded to, unless the "doozy" was actually getting through the episode. Again, I don't have a problem with having Reid's "secret," if you will, remain open, I think it could be something that is woven into future episodes. What I do have a problem with is the way that they almost made it seem like Reid was developing some super-human, psychic like powers. After a while, I was expecting Reid to say "I see dead people," like the little boy in the movie "The Sixth Sense."
The awfully low emphasis on anything resembling team camaraderie was just pathetic. The way Reid's physical symtpoms were manifesting themselves at different points in the episode, you'd think he'd get more than "Are you alright" from his fellow team mates. I've showed more concern than what the team showed to Reid in this episode to a neighbor I see rather infrequently. Plus, the scene with the voodoo preist, who at some point got possessed by a spirit during Reid's interrogation of him, performing some ritual to accomplish I don't even remember what is just too god awful to get into.
My God, what in the name of all that is good was that scene with Seaver giving the profile at the police department. Did I fall asleep in the incubator that Michael Jackson fashioned for himself, waking up years later to find that I had missed about 10 seasons of Criminal Minds, which would explain Seaver's presence with the team during the presenting of the profile at the police station? As I am pretty certain that did not happen, why was Seaver doing anything besides taking notes and asking questions about what we all assumed only the best minds in the FBI with years of experience could do, and that is profile. I am quite positive at this juncture that the writers, Tassler, Bernero, or whomever else over at CBS who is responisble for this Seaver character believe that we are all bumbling idiots with no common sense. I assure you, we are not.
The only salvageable part of this episode, besides the ending credits, was the scene where Reid was conversing with the doctor in the examination room. I believe Matthew Gray Gubler did a commendable job of presenting the angst that the character of Reid has always suffered in relation to his fear of becoming mentally ill like his mother.
I just wanted to say that although I didn't mind this episode, I agree with the comments about the show's deterioration that others have made much more elequently than I could.
Anonymous said...
omg ppl plz just shut up and stop complaining!!!! ugh :/
I'm sorry if you think we complain too much. No one is forcing you to read it. This is a forum for viewers of CM to share their thoughts, good or bad. The show has deteriorated over last season and this season. The only power we, the viewers, have is to make our thoughts known by either writing our comments or changing the channel. I think it's prudent that we try this method first. In all likelihood our pleas will be ignored, but there is the off chance that someone will pay attention before it's too late. If we say nothing, the writers, producers and execs will think they can throw any drivel at us (like Ashley Seaver) and we'll just take it lying down.
Another thing we can do is for every CM viewer to boycott Suspect Behavior, show Nina Tassler et al that it's not all right to rob Peter to pay Paul, or, in this case, rob CM to build up Suspect Behavior. If the pen is mightier than the sword, then perhaps the remote is mightier than the keyboard. Maybe that's a language Ms. Tassler will understand.
I'm really not sure what people didn't like about this episode. I do understand that the team interaction isn't what it used to be in earlier season, mainly the characters aren't as light-hearted anymore. I think that is because they have all been through so much. I also think this is most team interaction we have received all season. Reid has been totally ignored and I'm glad he received some attention. I loved how Hotch was so concerned over him.
I also think that the episode appeared to have a supernatural/ritualist vibe but ended up not being like that at all. The unsub in the end was a guy with father issues who did all this to promote a book to get attention from his dad. I like how they used profiling to figure it out.
I also think that Julio believed that he had psychic connections and can heal people but really he is just amazing at reading people who have some sort of problem (physical or mental). Many spiritual people who try to heal people are excellent at reading people and I don't think it has anything to do with psychic abilities. I also think that Reid's visions/hallucinations have a lot to do with what he has scene and has stuck in his mind. He may or may not realize that he has scene this things before. I also think that he is vulnerable at the moment so it would be interesting to see if spiritual leaders (such as Julio) will take advantage of that situtation. These people may actually believe they are helping and not manipulating people's minds. It happens all the time. I've actually seen it happen to really intellectual people who are all about facts then all of a sudden they are talking about supernatural things. Unfortunately these people have ended up having some sort of mental illness. I hope this isn't what will happen to Reid. I'm sure it won't but they may want us to think that. I think it is believable.
I think Reid has been through a lot in the past and really has not life outside work. I feel like the others have family or some sort of social outlet but he does not. It doesn't surprise me that all of this is taking a toll. It will ebe interesting to see if he will be able to cope or will completely lose it. I think him going off on his own at the end was a good indicator that his not thinking clearly due to these headaches. I think it is supposed to make Reid, the team and the viewers analyze the situation and see if he is going to be able to do his job properly in the future. I think the fact that Hotch was more concerned than mad at the end is also a good indication of how worried he is about Reid's situation. I also loved the look that Rossi and Hotch gave eachother in the end.
The end scene with Reid and the doctor was classic. I loved how he just jumped to conclusions that the doctor was implying that he has a mental illness. It shows how much he fears this will become reality. It cinsistent with his fears in previous seasons.
I thought MGG's performance was amazing. I think this is a big part of why I enjoyed the episode. He was very convincing.
English CM Fan - so many negative comments - I don't get it. I thought this was a thrillingly different episode and totaly acceptable for a Reid episode whose character hasn't jad a decent storyline since season 4. I love him and Morgan together, I hugely miss A.J and feel sorry for the actress who plays Seaver becuse however lovely she is she will be seen as a usurper - poor poor decision from CBS and needs fixing but as episodes go -I was completely surprised, loved the whol spirtual realm that no one realy understands storyline and was very relieved because the storyline DOES NOT automatically leed to Spencer having a mental illness but plays wonderfully with the idea that there are forces of good and evil which defy logic even that of a genius has to recognise not every answer is in a profile. Wonderful, thubs up to the writer and more Reid and Morgan moments please because I love that Morgan protects Reids vulnerability but you know...I would like to see Reid be their for Morgan when his character is in turmoil but for some reason it is always Prentise - presumably an age and wisdom thing as they are both older but hey, I love prentise I miss Lola, I miss Gideon and have only just got used to Rossi who I totaly resented and thought his acting was ham at times, but the AJ thing, if she had moved on of her own accord that we be sad but acceptable, the fact she didnt is why no one can accept any new characters. More Reid stories, less complaining because the story is a little bit different. I found that an interesting change and fully endorse it.
I don't think the English CM fan whom I suppose you mean is Timothy was being negative for the sake of being negative. He brought out a lot of points that I agree with and experienced as well while watching this episode. First, I believe he said he didn't have an issue with supernatural stories, nor do I, but like for a show like CM it has to be done cautiously and well as this show does not typically deal with these type of subject matters. Like Timothy, if it were written and executed well, I think it would have been a good episode, but in my opinion it wasn't. There were a lot of overly done scenes that to me were trying to hard to achieve the feel of the story's backdrop. Like Timothy, I found the scene with the voodoo priest at the police station, well, bad and laughable. It was great to see Reid take the lead in interrogating the guy, but it was done in a chessy way. Ashley Seaver, I think Timothy and others caught the essence of what I would write about the insanity of her giving the profile with the team at the police department. CM please give us some credit and don't try and sell us a character that is unbelievable even for fiction.
Again, I agree with Timothy about the team interaction, or lack thereof. Saying "Are you alright" and moving along and giving concerned looks doesn't rise to the level of where this team should be at by now. May they explore more concern for Reid by his team mates in later episodes, I hope so; I miss seeing that interaction on the show. Finally, like Timothy and others I like the final scene with Reid and the doctor and don't mind that Reid's issue seems like it will be dealt with in later episodes.
Cont.
I should rephrase my first line; I don't think Timothy comments were negative, but rather his opinion given in a manner and style probably some are not used to. At the end of the day, it is what he thought of the episode and as Pat said so well forums are here to share opinions good and baf, positive and negative. Pat, I am with you in not watching the spinoff; one because there is nothing about it that appeals to me, two, because I too believe it will send a message.
I agree with you Pat. We all have the right to voice our opinions.
There have been a lot of novels written lately about FBI agents who use psychic or other abilities to catch killers. I hope they never take that direction with this show. I was beginning to get a little worried with all the ghost talk and visions. I am assuming the ghosts in Reid's head aren't literal but at times with the way the medicine man was talking and acting towards Reid it made you wonder 'what tha?' Also with the dreams that predicted the outcome, it just made me wonder.
I hate when shows become too far out there to believe. I hope by ghosts maybe this means Reid is just carrying around the weight of the job in his brilliant mind instead actually having some super human ability which he doesn't need. He's already a genius.
I too agree with Timothy about the episode and feel that is just his style of expressing things. As far as viewing Nichols as a "usurper," some may think that but I think it has been said repeatedly here that the problem isn't Nichols herself, nor is it the AJ getting fired from the show situation, it is the character of Ashley Seaver. In the Corazon episode, the show took this implausible character to a whole other level. Believing that the BAU would need to enlist a recruit as a consultant (after 5 + yrs the BAU, the best minds in the FBI couldn't crack that one case so they had to enlist a rookie who didn't end up adding tp tje solving of that case), then believing that the BAU would have this same cadet complete her remedial training with them was asking a lot, but then to have this same cadet with no experience (certainly no experience deserving of a spot on the BAU) was utter lunancy. Look, I don't have a problem with the show introducing new characters, what I
do have a problem is adding characters that don't align with the way the show has been presented and framed to
its viewers.
The character of Ashley Seaver is exacerbating the overall issue with the decline in writing quality because like Seaver the writing as of late seems like an afterthought. This is something that is deeply troubling to many fans, especially considering what Tassler confirmed about CM being gutted because of the spinoff. Simply painting this as being against Nichols and/or being bitter and unable to get over the AJ situation accomplishes nothing but ignore the substantive points that many have brought out about the Seaver character which are related to other pressing issues at CM.
"I appreciate your interest, agent, but profiling is a specialty. We can't just let anyone who wants to give it a whirl."
Aaron Hotchner, Season 2 - Episode The Last Word
"Unless she is blond and cute and only two years younger than our former and beloved agent, then it's OK if she is just a cadet. Welcome!"
Criminal Minds, Season 6
Alana,
Yep. That is so true. And no matter how the writers spin it at this point (and it's not like they could credibly turn Ashley into a Reid-like genius), they can never get past the point that she doesn't deserve to be there and is not qualified to be a profiler. I can't wait *sarcasm* for them to state the reason why she comes back and presumably joins the team full time in episode 15.
Alana, thanks for providing the quote from Hotch to Prentiss in her first episode here. I don't have the season 2 DVD's, but knew that this quote was from the episode where Prentiss first arrived to CM. I just didn't know the name of the episode.
I love how you contrasted Hotch's quote to Prentiss (who came in with 10 years of experience) to what CM is basically saying to us today to justify Seaver's presence on the team. It burns me everytime people deflect points others bring out about Seaver like she is a cadet and so it cannot be sold to the viewers that she deserves a spot on the team by stating, "JJ is gone so you have to get over it." Where in the Seaver is a cadet and so shouldn't be on the team is JJ mentioned or involved? The point there is that Seaver is a cadet and not qualified to be on the team no matter how much magical writing is done to prove otherwise.
I miss the JJ character and am angry that Nina Tassler decided that JJ's role on the team was not important, but the fact is the JJ character is no longer on CM. So, like many others I was curious to see what CBS and Ed Bernero were planning in terms of a new female character. To my horror, in came Seaver. At first, I thought, "No, there is no way they think viewers of the show are that dim to not realize that a cadet is terribly unqualified to be on the team. No way they think we have forgotten what they have instilled in us from the very first episode until before Seaver got there, that the BAU is an elite and specialized team," well, again, to my horror that was indeed the case.
Janet is right,
"The character of Ashley Seaver is exacerbating the overall issue with the decline in writing quality because like Seaver the writing as of late seems like an afterthought. This is something that is deeply troubling to many fans, especially considering what Tassler confirmed about CM being gutted because of the spinoff. Simply painting this as being against Nichols and/or being bitter and unable to get over the AJ situation accomplishes nothing but ignore the substantive points that many have brought out about the Seaver character which are related to other pressing issues at CM."
This is concerns me for a couple of reasons. First, the writing has been taking a downturn for a while, decreasing the quality of episodes being produced. Second, I don't want this to lead into a situation (although, in a way it already has) where unbelievable and off the charts stories and situations are created to work around this completely unbelievable character (this also effects the integrity of the other characters because the writers will have to navigate the other characters around this non- workable piece of fiction). This type of thing has been done on other shows and has failed.
Lashawna, I too can't wait *sarcasm* for what off the wall reason is given to justify Seaver joining the team straight from the academy. Your right, the writers will never be able to get past the point that Seaver should not be on the team.
This is just so insulting to the viewers.
"Like Timothy, I found the scene with the voodoo priest at the police station, well, bad and laughable."
I'm not sure what was laughable about this scene. Julio is a spiritual man who believed he was possessed by the Saints. No one else believed that. Reid let him continue in the beginning because he was studying his behaviour. He said that Julio wholeheartedly believed he was possessed by the Saints - he didn't say he actually was. He needed to let him continue so he would get some answers out of him. Reid would not have gotten what he wanted if he didn't let Julio to do it his way. It doesn't mean anyone else believed in it.
Also Reid's visions, I don't think they were predictions. He saw everything before the visions including the gate. He must of seen the first time they visited the soup kitchen but did not pay attention to it. I think all these things were stuck in his head - he does have an eidetic memory. It must of be hard to get some of these things out of his head. It seems like he actually started hallucinating them like when he saw the symbol appear on the ceiling. He has seen the symbol before in the crime scene photos. I think this Julio guy wants Reid to beleive that there is a supernatural/psychic reason behind everything because that is what he truly believes. In the end he said soemthing like, I know you heard me calling. Reid responded that he had seen the photo and that is why he came. In the end, I felt like there was a logical reason behind everything. The headaches are the only thing we didn't receive an answer to. I'm glad they will continue that storyline. I look forward to finding out the cause.
I have to agree with everyone about Seaver. Total waste of a character.
Anonymous, I can see where you are coming from, even though I did not like the episode. I can't speak for Timothy or Julia, but I am thinking that they didn't necessarily think that Reid or anybody else truly believed the priest was possessed. I think their point, like mine, is that the way the scene flowed it seemed like they were trying to juxtapose the priest "possession," or what he believed to be "possession," with what Reid had been experiencing thus far in the episode. Don't know if that makes sense, but for example, a friend of mine who watched the episode with me (she has mainly seen the CM episodes from ION and a few from season 5 and the Seaver episodes, which like me, left her scratching her head). As the interrogation scene was going, my friend asked me, "Oh, ok, so this Reid guy is starting to develop some psychic powers, right?" I asked her why she thought that and she said that by the way the episode started, then all of the cuts where Reid is concentrating on something then you see flashes of images, plus the fact that initally it seemed that they may have been insinuating that Reid was understanding what the voodoo priest was saying when he went on his spirit filled rant. She continued to say that she believed that is why maybe he was having the bad headaches and was sensitive to light because he is coming into these psychic powers and that the voodoo priest picked up on the fact when he first saw Reid with Morgan at the restaurant.
I literally shuddered when she said this because I thought, wow, is this what a CM episode has come to, where someone can come away with that impression. Believe me, I don't have a problem with injecting this kind of backdrop into an episode; CM kind of did it before with the episode "Demonology," however, in that episode they didn't write/cut it in a way where it could potentially be perceived that one of the team members was coming into some type of supernatural powers. For me, and I think Timothy and Julia, it all boils down to the way the episode was written/cut. Yes, your correct, Reid's eidetic memory would account for the fact that he had those images in his head (the "hallunications"), but again, the way the episode flowed, it sort of seemed like they were trying to connect this supernatural theme with Reid's what was ailing Reid. It just seem like it went way over the top at points in an attempt to fuse this backdrop with Reid's siutation. I definitely think there was a way they could have done this without it having come off like that, which is, correct me if I am wrong Timothy and Julia, what I think they believed was bad about the interrogation scene. I have to say that I agree.
continued
I am curious as to how they will develop this story moving forward. Matthew Gray Gubler is such a good actor that I hope they start giving him (like they used to before) scripts that can use that talent to bring Reid's story to light. Lately, as most everyone has said thus far, the writing has gone down, an unfortunate casuality of CBS' decision to strip CM of its resources like writers and actors to build up the spinoff. Another unfortunate situation is one that was created and developed by Ed Bernero and that is the Seaver character. Before when I wrote that we were scracthing our heads when Seaver first appeared on the scene is because it seemes totally out of place and silly that the BAU would bring along a cadet to help them, the elite profiling experts, to crack the case in "What happens at Home," which many have already brought out that Seaver didn't do anything to help solve the case. "25 to life," my friend and I were like, "Why is she still there?" Now, I have seen the show from day one, so I could understand my reaction as well as the recation of people who have maybe not been with the show since day one, but have seenn enough of the show to know that this is a specialized unit requiring people who are skilled to make it work. My friend has not seen as merely as many episodes as I have yet still asked why Seaver was still there. When the ridiculously insane scene came up where Seaver was giving part of the profile with the team my friend audibly said, "What, wait, isn't this the trainee cadet? Why is she giving the profile along with the rest of the team?"
CM, even a non- longtime viewer saw the inherent flaw in this character, the lack of credibility this character presents to the show's contention that the BAU is distinct and elite because of the years of experience each team member brings prior to joining the team (with the exception of Reid who was recruited by Gideon because of his genius). Seaver giving part of the profile at the police station was, for me, the worse and most laughable scene in this episode.
Irina, if this wasn't CM, I would be laughing at the fact that yur friend made those observations about Seaver being that it doesn't appear that she is a longtime viewer of the show. But it is CM so it is sad that they believe that viewers, both longtime and non-longtime, are going to believe that a character like Seaver can just up and join the BAU.
What I think CBS and CM have forgotten is that the overwhelming majority of those who watch CM are longtime viewers either because they have watched the show from day one, or because they have seen many of the older episodes on ION and/or A&E. These are the people that make up the core of the viewing audience, and it is these people that they are putting off with the Seaver character.
Alana, I appreciate you posting that quote from Hotch:
"I appreciate your interest, agent, but profiling is a specialty. We can't just let anyone who wants to give it a whirl."
Aaron Hotchner, Season 2 - Episode The Last Word
This is something, that try as hard as they might, the show simply can't back away from, but it is precisely what they are attempting to do with the Seaver character.
I have not read the latest posts from the last 24 hours but in skimming, it appears to be more of the state of CM and Seaver, etc. I cannot think of another thing to add that hasn't already been said every which-way-but-loose and I can only hope that TPTB are reading.
What do you all think about the latest picture and quotes from Shemar and Paget?
I am bumming because they genuinely sound concerned and put-off themselves, which worries me even more. We hadn't heard much feedback from any of the cast before and it makes it seem sreious and more real to me.
I really hate to see this show go down the tubes - it has been my favorite of all time, and I go way back to great cutting-edge shows like NYPD Blue, ER in the early days, etc and this is going to be such a disappointment if it goes down the drain anytime soon because I look at it having been the quality show that could last for an easy 10 years. So much better than the CSIs, etc.
I am truly bumming big-time...
Gubegirl, I have been reading the comments not just here, but on other sites which discuss CM, including the CBS website, and many people are extremely upset over what is going on with CM. People were upset before the whole Tassler statement about the spin-off, but it is like after that statement their angry just flew off the charts. People are really mad that CM has been purposely ruined in order to further the spin-off. I think pretty much everyone knew that the spin-off was the cause for the show losing quality, but I guess having that confirmed was a bad blow. With the whole Seaver situation, did you know that someone has started a petition to get that character off the show? I think that is the first time I have ever seen a petition to get a character off a show. Needless to say, I have read comments from people that are really angered by the Seaver character because they believe that the show is further shortchanging them with this character.
When I read the article posted here on the blog with Shemar and Paget's comments, I was shocked. I wasn't shocked so much by Paget's comments, she has been pretty much vocal about what she feels about CBS and what they have done to CM, but Shemar, wow, I don't think he has ever come out saying anything regarding the situation at CM before. To say that he hopes that the spin-off fails, wow, that was bold. Got to say that I love that he said that, but I don't know what that may mean for him down the road. I am not sure if he is one of the actors whose contract is up at the end of this season, I know Thomas Gibson's is and so is Paget's. Does anyone know if Shemar is one of the actors whose contract is up at the end of this season?
To add to that, the ratings for the Corazon episode were not great. They weren't horrible, but it was the lowest the show has seen for their demo, going down by 15%. Although, that may just have been related with the fact that the premiere of American Idol was on at the same time as CM. I guess it is something that will be seen as the season moves on. What I am getting at is that all of these factors together seem like they are bad. I too think that the quality of the show has gone down and that the addition of the Seaver character is something so off kilter and ridiculous for CM that it makes me question where this is all going to fall.
For sure, I believe that the show will be picked up for season 7, what it will look like and how much potential damage would have been done by the time it gets there is anybody's guess :/
I would also be curious to find out if MGG's contract is up at the end of this season, as well as JM. I'm assuming because of the spin-off that something has already been worked out with KV, but am not sure.
To Timothy - from another English fan - I'm really realy sorry. Apparantly I have critizised your post but the truth is I either haven't read it or don't know which one it is. I was actually just being defensive because I had read a wave of negative posts from loads of fans and it really saddened me. I still enjoy CM, I am still enjoying season six. I am also dissapointed with the changes but I'm strongly loyal to the cast left and really like character writing and enjoy having characters storylines woven into the script - it's means you can enjoy the story on more than one level. So for everyone who rallied to Timothys defense thinking I was challenging his comments my apologies - but I honestly wasn't. I was in all sincerity just trying say that inspite of all the reasons people didn't take to the episode I found I liked it and didn't mind it being different or "out there". In fact, it is one of my favourites because it is different. Seaver - maybe I didn't pay her enough attention. I totally missed the whole new cadet with no experience storyline (probabl;y because I was on a downer over A.J) so i get those comments - but I haven't really invested in her character and decided she was in it breifly to be a love interest or something..dunno.
I don't apologize for loving every episode of CM. Some I love more than others, like this one. I really enjoy the Spencer Reid character (and Matthew Gray Gubler as a actor) and have missed his intellectual banter and querky hand movements in the last several episodes. This was real treat for me.
I think Reid's hallunications were not hallunications but visions. I'm guessing they will stop with this episode but who knows.
Note the old lady at the community center looking at him...she was picking up on his bad mojo. Like the non-unsub said, he has ghosts in his head. In previous seasons he has dealt with bad dreams and identifying too closely to some unsubs. Makes sense.
I loved the intensity of the episode. I think it needed to be a bit graphic with the chix blood, tongue, heads, scary-intense non-unsub dude in the interrogation.
Although I don't know much about shooting, angles and editing, I did notice the cool angles when Reid was tying up his hospital gown and his hand while in the MRI (like when you're in pain or nervous).
I think the cutest line in the show was when the old man in the community center talked about his friend having trouble with his "man spot". That cracked me up to have an adult man use that terminology.
I'm looking forward to MGG's directed episode later this year and hoping Reid's bad mojo doesn't stop him from being in the field.
To Julia - I am really sorry, I headed my post English CM fan meaning me. Wasn't discussing Timothy's comments at all - honestly not sure which ones they were. I just felt a little overwhelmed with the negative feedback on the episode and wanted to say that I really enjoyed it. I liked the suggestion that the voodoo priest had a different way of thinking and as someone has previously said - he believes there is a connection to Reid and that's what mattered. I don't for one minute think Reid is Psychic or that the headaches are supernatural and am keen to find out what they are. I'm also relieved that the writers have cleverly woven the plot to investigate Reids mental state but at the same time given themselves a huge back door in that it could possibly be stress or Reids being afraid of his own mind that brought on psychosomatic headaches. This made the storyline believable and as someone else said, Emily had an episode which dabbled in possesion and JJ had one where she wanted to believe in a psychic. Wasn't refering to Timothy at all. I just like the episode. But I read the majority of the well articulated critisisms again and almost convinced myself that I was confused and actually I didn't like the episode and had missed all the little things that other fans had picked up on...then I decided that as valid as the points were (and they were) I will stick with "actually, I enjoyed it" because it's true. May sound odd - but I loved the episode and the over exaggerated eye rubbing just made Spencer seem like a little boy ina big mans world waiting for it to collapse in on him. Bless. Morgan will look after him.
I was neither here or there with this episode. I'm hoping that what is troubling Reid will be explored in future episodes and that the team involvement in being there for Reid will increase.
Overall, I would have to say that I have been disappointed with the quality of the writing last season and this season, more this season. I am desperately hoping that the writing will improve and that something will be done in regard to the Seaver character. No offense to the new actress, it isn't anything personal against her, but this character is really bad for CM and I am not sure why this type of character has been signed on as a series regular. I am not sure how long she has been signed for, but I hope her character doesn't return for season 7.
I would also like to find out if Shemar is one of the actors whose contract is up at the end of the season. It seems rather risky to me to come out saying what he did. I understand why he said it and agree with him, but I wonder if he will have to answer for it later on. I am also wondering if he maybe doesn't want to continue with the show, or maybe he has a feeling that he will not get a new contract if he hasn't gotten one already. Paget has been saying these kind of things for a while now, so I don't think she is worried about what will happen to her, they have basically done everything bad to her by now anyway.
I know for sure that Thomas Gibson's contract is up at the end of the season, but I don't know about the other actors. I'm hoping someone has the answer to whose contracts are up at the end of this season.
Cindy: Are you certain about the petition re: dropping the Seaver character? I may have been the one to suggest that on the last place to post several weeks ago, but I said it in jest after reading so many dozens of negative posts about how the character (NOT Rachel Nichols! this is NOT her fault!) is dragging the show down, it's quality and credibility are rapidly falling.
I am putting all this together now, with the recent comments from Paget and Shemar, who you are right about: I have not heard him be quite so outspoken before, he may think he has nothing to lose at this point an, reading here, knows that all the fans are up in arms.
I am greatly concerned that we are quickly reaching the point of no return and I pray that this is not the case because I seriously believe it is not too late - they can still turn it around, but very shortly, that will not be the case.
I was going to watch the spin-off out of curiosity but have absolutely no problem of "going on strike" against CBS and not watching or DVRing it even if that helps get the point across. What do you think? I am willing do do something if any of you think it will help.
LMK; let's band together and come up with a plan instead of only using this forum to b---- because b----ing may just not be enuf!
There's strength in numbers, ya know, let's do something to get the best show on TV flyin' high once again!
English CM fan to Lucille - thank you. Phew - I was feeling guilty for liking Corazon! But then if you put Supernatural and Criminal Minds togteher - not sure how - I would be happy. My two favourite shows for different reasons. We talk about CM needing to be believalbe but realistically do you have that many serial killers on that level in America and do they always conveniently kill someone when a profiler is brought in making them easy to catch???? I don't think so. But then..I don't care - it's a story where the good guys catch the bad guys (in this case through profiling) and I'm okay with that. What makes it believable is that the viewer can invest in the main characters and follow their story whilst they catch the bad guys - that's what's made it work so far and hopefully will continue to for many more season. Love it..and am also looking forward to a Gube directed episode, don't suppose you know which one?
Gubegirl- About the petition, yes, I am sure. I don't know how long ago it was created, but it has been created.
I am most certainly not watching the spin-off! I think if the spin-off tanks it may send a clear message to Nina Tassler about this whole CM situation. It just saddens me that they stripped CM to make a spin-off get off the ground. Can you imagine how the fired writes, cast and crew at CM feel like having someone like Nina Tassler basically say that they are expendable and not really unique to the show. That is not cool! I think maybe that is what Shemar was reacting to in that article, the slap in the face that he, the fired writers, and the other cast and crew have received from CBS.
I really hope something can be done to turn this all around.
Anonymous said - "May sound odd - but I loved the episode"
I loved the episode too. Very much so in fact. I've been a bit half and half on this season so far but I really enjoyed Corazon. It's the first one this season that I've re-watched. I was very happy to have a Reid centric episode at last and I'm even more chuffed that it looks like there should be more to come concerning Reid's health/stress issues. I'd love it if Reid's problem is the catalyst that brings the return of the sense of 'family' within the team. I miss that so much these days.
The only downside for me was Ashley Seaver but I managed to, moreorless, tune her out and she didn't stop me enjoying the episode. Although her taking part in the profile was rather a WTH?? moment. It was weird though in the plane scene at the beginning, for a split second when she walked up to talk to Reid I thought she was J.J.
This episode was so-so for me. I liked the fact that Reid's situation wasn't wrapped up in one episode, opening the door for more of this story in the future. But like some said, I don't feel like there was a strong team pull of concern for him. I don't know exactly where they are going with Reid's storyline, but I hope they do justice to the Reid character. MGG is a great actor who really truly deserves some great scripts to get his acting skills out there. Plus, they need to step it up with Hotch. He is the team's leader, but lately he seems to be more in the background than up front leading, or maybe it is because in a way all of the characters have been in the background due to the writing. The characters don't seem like they were before, something is missing and it is running throughout many of the episodes that have aired. The things about each character that used to pop before are not there and it seems like they are just going through the motions.
Definitely a WTH moment when Seaver got up and started to give the profile with the rest of the team. Thankfully, she didn't dominate this episode but I am finding it harder to ignore her everytime she pops up on the screen. Her character is completely unbelievable, the lines she says are just useless and out of place, and her presence on the team seems forced, or maybe it is that I feel like the writers are trying to force her presence on the viewers. I don't know which one it is but it is not enjoyable. I'm glad that she won't be in the next couple of episodes but am dreading her eventual return to the show in, I think, episode 15.
I don't know if Paget is going to stay or go, although, it is looking like she is going to go. I really hope she doesn't leave but i don't blame her if she does. CBS really messed around with her, they messed around with the whole show.
sdwally, love your comments!!! Hope somebody with a pulse over at CBS and Criminal minds takes to heart all that you wrote.
"Plus, they need to step it up with Hotch. He is the team's leader, but lately he seems to be more in the background than up front leading"
Thank you! I'm glad I'm not the only one who has missed Hotch's strong leadership and presence. I hope the writers are not thinking of keeping him there. The team needs him, especially if Reid is gonna be made to be sick. And I love Thomas Gibson. He is an amazing actor! I can't wait to see what his secret is and I really hope the team is there for him.
Okay, so some people on a different forum are trying to start a "Switch to ION Event" the day the spin-off starts. The way it would work is that right after the Criminal Minds episode finishes airing, the one that is set to air before the spin-off, they are asking people to switch to ION to watch an old episode of CM rather than watching the spin-off.
Cindy: Do we know yet what date the spin-off is to start? I thought I read a mid-Feb date
(2-16?) but am not sure.
I am totally ready to jump on the ION bandwagon that nite because I watch CM on ION many nites a wk anyway! No big deal!
Please LMK and maybe others will do the same.
Can you tell us what other forum you are quoting from and should we/can we be participating there as well? We want to be doing all that we can, right?
WE DON'T NEED TO GO TO ANOTHER FORUM. CBS, ABC AND ED ALL READ THIS FORUM
CiminalMindsFan:
What do you think of the plan to watch ION during the spin-off? Can you say? Would you recommend this?
We want to do the right thing here but be effective also.
Thanks.
Sorry Criminal Minds Fan, it was not my intention to send people to another forum. I just remembered that gubegirl asked if there were any ideas that people can come up with to try and salvage the show. So, when I saw that I thought I would mention it here. Again, sorry.
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